 Manaball, Who gets hit... |
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 Oct 30 2004, 06:51 PM
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#26
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 210 Joined: 8-October 04 Member No.: 6,736  |
Personally, I don't like the mass bolt explanation that gets tossed around. That still conjures an image of something shooting out from you and hitting the person. There is nothing that actually shoots out or explodes or anything like that. You essentially just manipulate the mana in the area that the spell affects (or at the target for a bolt affect) and it manifests an appropriate effect. The key is that you have to have line of sight to manipulate the mana appropriately. In your example you can't see the guy who's off to the side so you can't affect the mana at his location. Even physical spells rely on the manipulation of mana. |
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Oct 30 2004, 06:57 PM
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#27
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
Only because you're taking "bolt" at face value. To put it a little more straight-forwardly, don't look at it as an "area effect" spell. Look at it as a "mass effect" spell for purposes of Combat Spells and the like. |
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Oct 30 2004, 07:14 PM
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#28
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 210 Joined: 8-October 04 Member No.: 6,736 |
It's still essentially an area effect. Manaball/stunball is going to be hitting untold billions of bacteria and other microorganisms, and Powerball will have pollen, dust, and other suspended things to crush. I find it easiest to think of it as an area effect spell that can only affect what you see. |
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Oct 31 2004, 12:12 AM
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#29
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
Only if you can actually see them... which is why Sterilize is more effective against bacteria than Manaball. Similar to the person under an invisibility spell, you can't see the bacteria to affect it. |
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Nov 1 2004, 05:38 PM
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#30
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 9-July 04 From: Modesto, CA Member No.: 6,465 |
Not without trying to use SR logic, but the bottom line is, if you can't see it, you can't hit it (with mana). Creating Elemental effects are different since you are creating an explosion of real material.
If you tossed an Elemental spell like fireball then the hidden target would. The real issue is with mana-based spells (aka Combat). My feeling is that this is more of a balance issue since Combat Spells have a relatively lower drain than there manipulation cousins. Seems to be a decent limitation IMO. |
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Nov 1 2004, 05:58 PM
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#31
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Can anyone logically explain why two objects should attract each other with a force based on their masses and the distance between them? It's a tenet of the Shadowrun rules that that's how magic works. ~J |
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Nov 1 2004, 09:12 PM
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#32
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Midnight Toker Group: Members Posts: 7,686 Joined: 4-July 04 From: Zombie Drop Bear Santa's Workshop Member No.: 6,456 |
The exchange of a massless information particle, if you perscribe to String Theory. Now, if anyone can explain why matter exchanges massless information particles, that would be amazing. |
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Nov 1 2004, 09:21 PM
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#33
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Exactly. If you go far enough back, you're always going to find something inexplicable. For instance, can anyone explain to me why it should make sense that there is this big universe with all sorts of laws and rules and bizarre things out there, when the simpler explanation is that it is the imaginings of a single mind (mine)?
Like the physical laws, magic being LOS simply is true in current thinking. Unlike in real life, we can even remove the qualification: magic is simply LOS-based. Human magic, at least. ~J |
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Nov 2 2004, 12:03 AM
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#34
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 476 Joined: 30-December 03 From: Fresno, CFS: taking out one durned furriner at a time. Member No.: 5,940 |
Aside from game balance reasons (I just blew up Damien Knight!), there are some explanations within magical theory, well least hermetically speaking.
But basically, you don't need LOS, what you need is a symbolic connection between the mage and the target of the spell [EDIT]so that the spell goes where you want it to go[/EDIT]. I've heard some call it Variance Sympathy or somesuch, but personally I go with Identity. It's just acquiring LoS is the easiest way (by far) of satisfying this requirement that humans know. See, Ritual Sorcery doesn't require the target to be there, but it does require some symbol of the target, and the more direct the connection (representations to personal effects to bodily matter), the easier the casting becomes. Here's a poor analogy, but it's something like getting a lock on with a missle. Cept there's no way to fire the missle without the lock on, but once locked on it always hits (kinda like Streak missles if anyone is familuar with Battletech). |
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Nov 2 2004, 05:49 PM
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#35
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 9-July 04 From: Modesto, CA Member No.: 6,465 |
I've only heard symbolic links used to describe Ritual Socery. Is it mentioned somewere else with reguards to general Socery?
What would be some other "ways"?I can't think of another way to preform general Sorcery that is cannon other than LOS, Touch or Ritual. Any references available?
Streak misslies annoyed me, why didn't they just apply to tech to all there missile weapons? Bah.
Better analogy would be lasing a target to guided a missile to an intended target. Your vision acts as "the laser" and the spell acts as "the guided missile". The only difference is that your eyes don't shoot photons at the target for the mana to ground at, so I've always just chalked it up to your mind making a "visual connection" with the target. |
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Nov 2 2004, 07:19 PM
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#36
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
You just named the ways other than LOS. |
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Nov 2 2004, 10:05 PM
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#37
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Old Man Jones Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,415 Joined: 26-February 02 From: New York Member No.: 1,699 |
And remember, to avoid getting hit by that manaball, always stand behind trees.
If you can, strap one to your back. Just make sure to water it on a regular basis. :wobble: -karma |
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Nov 3 2004, 07:43 AM
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#38
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 210 Joined: 8-October 04 Member No.: 6,736 |
After re-reading the LOS bit on page 181, I stand corrected. I did get the amusing mental image of my microbiology professor manabolting bacteria through the microscope after reading the part about lenses and LOS, so it was totally worth it. |
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