 Do ally spirits count toward focus addiction?, when acting as a power focus? |
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 Nov 10 2004, 08:01 PM
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#1
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Genuine Artificial Intelligence  Group: Members Posts: 4,019 Joined: 12-June 03 Member No.: 4,715  |
Sorry if this has been addressed before, I tried searching but didn't find anything. Um, my entire question is in the topic.
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Nov 10 2004, 08:03 PM
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#2
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
No, they're not a focus at all. They just have a power that operates similarly to one. Same goes for adepts with the Aid Spell power from SOTA:2064.
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Nov 10 2004, 08:05 PM
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#3
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Genuine Artificial Intelligence Group: Members Posts: 4,019 Joined: 12-June 03 Member No.: 4,715 |
Thanks.
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Nov 10 2004, 08:32 PM
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#4
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 693 Joined: 26-March 03 Member No.: 4,335 |
I'd think they would - for they are doing the same thing - the character is relying on a 'crutch' more than his own abilities.
Better ask your GM for a ruling. And give him a week to think about it. You'll get more consistency that way than from a snap ruling. |
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Nov 10 2004, 08:53 PM
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#5
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
given that ally spirits are formed from either a point of the mage's own magic, or as part of the mage's initiation, i have trouble seeing the use of that power by the ally spirit as a 'crutch'. the mage isn't using power from an outside source, he's using power from his own magic.
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Nov 10 2004, 08:59 PM
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#6
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 485 Joined: 25-October 04 Member No.: 6,789 |
hmmm....i wonder could you apply that same logic to Foci made by the character?
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Nov 10 2004, 09:24 PM
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#7
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 292 Joined: 24-September 04 Member No.: 6,701 |
I'm w/ DocFunk on this one. Also, if Ally spirits can't help w/o risking addiction, then there'd be no point in building them. Just build Power Foci; less issues of independance, fussing w/ morale, and keeping them "happy".
The hijacked question I have is, can you use Power Foci and/or Ally Spirit dice greater than your Sorcery Skill to cast or does all that extra dice just make a bigger Sorcery Pool? If you're capped, then there would reach a point of diminishing returns on how big a pool is really useful. |
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Nov 10 2004, 09:25 PM
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#8
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
Refer to the focus or use of Sorcery in question and see what it has to say. By default there are no limits.
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Nov 10 2004, 09:29 PM
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#9
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
foci made by the character don't include an investment of the character's magical ability. karma, yes, but not magic. the argument would not apply.
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Nov 10 2004, 09:52 PM
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#10
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,073 Joined: 23-August 04 Member No.: 6,587 |
Even a focus you make is not as tightly linked to you as your ali spirit. A ruling that foci you made counted as lower force would make some sense but would encourage the over use of enchanting at which point you have to ask “why the frell do you run the shadows”.
By canon aid sorcery provided by an ali spirit or elemental is not a focus and thus dose not count for focus addiction. If any GM I play with wants to change that they had better tell me before I start playing a character that would use one of these. Edward |
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Nov 10 2004, 11:39 PM
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#11
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Free Spirit Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,944 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bloomington, IN UCAS Member No.: 1,920 |
Another way to avoid focus addiction with the aid of an ally is to:
1) let the ally bond the sustaining focus 2) cast the spell 3) sustain it for you Need to watch for the ally concerning its own focus addiction. |
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Nov 10 2004, 11:40 PM
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#12
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
Ally Spirits can't bond foci. They have no Karma.
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Nov 11 2004, 12:16 AM
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#13
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Free Spirit Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,944 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bloomington, IN UCAS Member No.: 1,920 |
You are right. I must have made it a house rule based on free spirits getting bound, given karma, ordered what to do with said karma. Cross that with being able to give an ally karma pool. Oops!
Another reason to bind one of these thousands of free sprits that have been freed.;) |
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Nov 11 2004, 04:58 AM
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#14
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Senior GM Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 1,406 Joined: 12-April 03 From: Redmond, WA Member No.: 4,442 |
tisoz, once bound they are no longer a free spirit. Just my .02 nuyen.
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Nov 11 2004, 05:01 AM
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#15
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
Sure they are, they're just no longer free Free Spirits. :D
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Nov 11 2004, 05:03 AM
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#16
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The back-up plan Group: Retired Admins Posts: 8,423 Joined: 15-January 03 From: San Diego Member No.: 3,910 |
Taking the argument to one extreme,
Mage1 has sorcery 6, a power focus [6], an ally spirit [6], and an adept-buddy with aid sorcery [6]. How many dice can the mage use to cast his ToxicWave spell? |
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Nov 11 2004, 05:04 AM
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#17
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
By the rules, 30. By most GMs, 12... possibly 18.
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Nov 11 2004, 05:05 AM
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#18
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
You forgot the earth elemental (also force 6) and spell pool to put you to about 36 dice. 38 if you are an earth aligned mage.
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Nov 11 2004, 05:11 AM
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#19
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The back-up plan Group: Retired Admins Posts: 8,423 Joined: 15-January 03 From: San Diego Member No.: 3,910 |
Thanks Herald--I missed all the steps, I was trying to use all of the fragments that had been raised earlier...but damn...
Is there a limit on how many adepts can use their Aid Spell power on the same mage simultaneously? Evil machinations of magical groups all pouring their power into one person or even one group, ritual sorcery here we come... |
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Nov 11 2004, 05:12 AM
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#20
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
Nope, no limit.
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Nov 11 2004, 05:19 AM
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#21
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Taken to the extreme ... Elf Mage has: Earth-Aligned 2 Sorcery 6 Spell Pool 6 Power Focus 6 Adept Buddy 6 Ally Spirit 6 Elemental 48 (8x6) *If only one allowed, then 6 Manipulation Focus 6 Toxic Wave Focus 6 (only on of these is Mage is under Grade 3 Initiate, or wants to risk Focus Addiction) For a total of ... 92! *50 if only allowed 1 Elemental. Then factor Karma! ;) [note] I probably forgot something. ;) [edit] Add additional Adepts to taste (Magic Rating?), and also add in multiple Ally Spirits if available. :D [/edit] [edit -edit] Added race ... ;) I don't know the Path bonuses off-hand, but +2 for aspected is alright. |
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Nov 11 2004, 05:22 AM
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#22
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
You'd be better off with a Path Magician (the one who gets Earth Elementals and Manipulation spell bonuses; don't have MitS handy) casting the spell in his Irish county during his bonus season with one of those Path Magic foci thingies in Shadows of Europe. (Beyond my awesome knowledge of the game. "Thingies." Pfft. I feel dirty.)
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Nov 11 2004, 05:24 AM
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#23
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
No, only one elemental can be used on each casting. |
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Nov 11 2004, 05:33 AM
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#24
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
I may be just forgetting a rule, but are you sure? I rarely play Hermetics, but isn't there a rule that states the Mage can command all his Elementals of one type to perform a similar service with one action? |
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Nov 11 2004, 06:16 AM
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#25
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
SR3, page 187, last line before it states what spells each elemental type can aid.
It wouldn't matter if hermetics could give mass commands like riggers can, this power is restricted to one elemental per spellcasting. |
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