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> You're gonna do what?!?!?, When a runner wants his own AAA corp.
Graywolf
post Nov 19 2004, 08:04 PM
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:S Okay here is the problem, one of the guys I play with has decided that he wants to create his own AAA mega corp. And yes you did read that correctly. Being one of the regular GM's I basically want to tell him that he's on something and that I wouldn't allow it. But the kicker is that he won't play that character anymore because he is "retired". Does anyone have a good idea as to how the rest of the group can handle this tiny issue? Personally I would like to have every other AAA corp break down his front door and steal all of his R&D along with all of his employees. To prove how far this has gone, he asked me awhile back how much I thought it would cost to create a Dikote plant. I also believe that he wanted to know how much a cybermacy clinic would cost to start-up and maintain.
Any suggestions???
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Kagetenshi
post Nov 19 2004, 08:06 PM
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Create his own? Sure, go for it, let him try. In twenty years, let him try to resist a hostile takeover with some serious shadowruns to soften him up.

Hell, just hand him a copy of the old game Capitalism. If he can beat that in three tries, give him his corp. Otherwise tell him he's unemployed and broke at the age of 60.

~J
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Nikoli
post Nov 19 2004, 08:07 PM
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He does realise you don't "start-up" a AAA corp. you have to earn your way up. That means he needs legal citizenship outside of a corp, he needs venture capital (that is legally his), etc. Then he'd be just another asshole with a business license. It would litteraly take years to build up to C status, let alone AAA.
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Graywolf
post Nov 19 2004, 08:12 PM
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:S
I see. The biggest problem with the whole works is that he picks and chooses what rules he uses and mostly that involves skipping them. I was talking to him the other day and he made the comment that the "company" wasn't going to declare AAA status until they hit the 500 million nuyen mark. I know that most of his product his military wear, think Ares might take notice?
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Lindt
post Nov 19 2004, 08:14 PM
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only 500 million? See, here is the problem, to be a AAA you need a seat on the corp court, and they dont give those away.
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Nikoli
post Nov 19 2004, 08:18 PM
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I think the layer may be confused as to what being a AAA company means.

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Herald of Verjig...
post Nov 19 2004, 08:21 PM
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Eh, let Ares get miffed and perform a "Corporate Takeover." Despite the current meaning of the term, as an AAA, Ares doesn't need the consent of the smaller corp, and just needs to avoid angering another AAA during the process.
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Kagetenshi
post Nov 19 2004, 08:26 PM
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Five hundred million nuyen is nothing whatsoever. Apple Computer, a company that, while certainly up there on the Fortune 500, would still be a AA has some four and a half billion dollars just as a cash reserve.

~J
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Austere Emancipa...
post Nov 19 2004, 08:33 PM
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QUOTE (Lindt)
only 500 million?

More like "WTF?! 500 million? That isn't even half-way to A yet, nevermind AAA!"

The A^3s are much bigger than any corporation in existance now. Wal-Mart had net sales in 2003 of $229.6 billion. AAAs would work with 14 or 15-digit total revenue figures.
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Nikoli
post Nov 19 2004, 08:38 PM
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GE is probably the only A company by shadowrun standards being possibly one of the largest companies int he world.
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Austere Emancipa...
post Nov 19 2004, 08:42 PM
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I looked at GE first. It appears their total revenue in 2003 was $134.2 billion. Wal-Mart is called the biggest company in the world in many places, and it certainly seems to be that based on TR. GE does look more like an archetypical A company because of the greater range of products and industries it works with.
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Kagetenshi
post Nov 19 2004, 08:43 PM
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Nah, GE is an AA. Remember, As are actually quite small; they get that status just by being multinational, pretty much.

~J
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Nikoli
post Nov 19 2004, 08:43 PM
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Well, Walmart is a definite A company. But they are a retailer, not a manufacturer AFAIK
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Shanshu Freeman
post Nov 19 2004, 08:57 PM
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don't forget, GE gets badass points for building nukes.
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Graywolf
post Nov 19 2004, 09:03 PM
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:S
With all that in mind is there anywhere that states how much a AAA corp fiscally needs to have to gain that status? I checked Corp Shadowfiles and Corp Download and all it gives are stats. There is nothing stating what the point value actually means.
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Kagetenshi
post Nov 19 2004, 09:06 PM
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Nothing. A corp with $10 to its name could be AAA. Trick is, they need a seat on the Corporate Court, which realistically won't happen until huge amounts of money are involved. How much money depends on how much of a coup you're willing and able to pull.

~J
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Austere Emancipa...
post Nov 19 2004, 09:28 PM
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I seriously doubt there is such a statement anywhere, and there shouldn't be since that's not what describes an AAA. But you can deduce some figures. For example, assume people consume about as much as they do right now (this is a must if the economy is to function properly), and that the worth of one nuyen is the same as the worth of one 2003 USD. Assume that the economies of the "civilized world" are about as strong as they are today, with CalFree+PCC+CAS+UCAS+Quebec+Most of Europe+Western Russia+Australia+NZ+Japan averaging out to a GDP of about 28,000 :nuyen: and that the populations of these regions are as big as they are now.

Now assume that a megacorp owns a "Wal-Mart" that operates in all these areas (let's put that down as 1.5x the revenue of the current Wal-Mart), a "DaimlerChrysler", a "General Electric", a "Dow Chemicals", etc, continuing with some of the biggest corporations in every sector there is. My earlier estimates were a bit high, though. Since the GDP of the world in 2003 was only $51.48 x 10^12, you'll only end up with figures in the low-mid 13-digits, e.g. 2,000,000,000,000 :nuyen:.

Again, getting your total annual revenues to a 13-digit figure doesn't guarantee that you're an AAA megacorp. But that would be a good start.
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Nikoli
post Nov 19 2004, 09:35 PM
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Well said Austere
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Shockwave_IIc
post Nov 19 2004, 09:52 PM
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Personally i think that a player wanting to have there own AAA is a none event.

As Kage and a few others have said you need a seat on the Corporate court to be AAA.

Yakashima (sp?) is SR's Biggest AA it's bigger then Novatech by a good margin. Novatech is only an AAA because of a techincality (owns one of the founding companys of the corperate court) And Novatech is own by Richrad Villers, one of thee most buisness minded people in SR with the exception perhaps of Lowfyr himself.
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BitBasher
post Nov 19 2004, 10:39 PM
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Yeah, Actually as I recall you can;t even reach AA status without approval from the corporate court. They must approve your right to be territorial. Also, as a requirement for AAA status you must have a significant presence in every one of the 12(?) major categories of corporate competition, and have a corporate rating largetr than (I think) 125. Wixing is smaller than that at like 117 but got an exception... Thos numbers may be off a bit but the ranges are about right .

The categories are (if I can remember them off the top of my head)...

Heavy Industry
Agriculture
Mystical Products
Military Hardware
Consumer goods
Aerospace
Entertainment
Computers
Public Services
...err and several other categories :grinbig:

In summation, the big 10 corps, added together, have by canon a cashflow and yearly income equal to or greater than half the Gross Financial Product of the earth. This means the largest corp, SK, (by the most recent numbers) has about 9% of the walth of planet earth and the smallest, Wuxing, has about 2%.

These corps are far bigger than most people fathom. Trillions of dollars at the smallest.
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Cynic project
post Nov 19 2004, 10:50 PM
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ZIC is an AA and is bigger than Novatech,witch is an AAA. ZIC is about the size of Wuxing or C.A.T.o. ZIC is most likely making in the rangs of high ten too low hundreds of billions each year.

Anything over A, has to be apoved by the corprate court. Note Spinard, was once an AA,but had their status revoked and fined 2,000,000,000 :nuyen: They weren't the biggest AA,and they are still around after that..So in no way should one fourth of that fine make a AAA.
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toturi
post Nov 19 2004, 11:23 PM
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tsk tsk... You are all thinking conventional warfare. Think unconventional and strike at where the enemy is weakest and sow the seeds of their destruction.

The point of course is not the money. But where you target that money. Notice Art Dankwalther. Granted that 20 billion isn't pocket change, but I'll bet you that a tribe of otaku could get you a couple of billion in virtual assets in a week easy. After all, Novatech is teetering on the verge of AA(or even A)-dom. "Persuade" Villiers to sell JRJ International to you and you'll have a AAA on your hands.
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Graywolf
post Nov 19 2004, 11:28 PM
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:D
So basically there is absolutely NO WAY that a "retired" PC can ever, I repeat ever, found his own AAA corp legally. Would it make a difference if he was trying to keep this all blackmarket. A shadow corp in other words. I think it would get very difficult to create and operate any size corp completely "in the shadows."
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L.D
post Nov 19 2004, 11:34 PM
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What do you mean by shadowcorp? A corp that doesn't pay any taxes? I thought that was a normal corp. :D
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BitBasher
post Nov 19 2004, 11:35 PM
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uh, shadow corp? who does it deal with? where does it get it's products? who does it sell to?
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