Are Street Sams/Mercs boring? Options

[iPad]

I doubt anyone here hasnt played one or the other, but the idea of a straight up Street Sam you see in the novels and main rule book looks so boring as a basic concept to me. 'Ware, guns and guts, apds this apds that, and usually some bone ex-navy seal or sas background to boot.

I have no problem with the concept of an ex-military, just all the ex-mill people Ive met in rl arent anything like the way they tend be protrayed in rpgs, films or TV. To be ex-mil it seems you have to be a 'tough nut' charisma void, an ex-squaddie (British infiltryman) I know has kept me and a crowd of people down the pub almost on floor with histerics all evening with tales of his army days.

Before you reply please ask yourself would you actually enjoy playing Kid Stealth for a whole campaign?

[Kagetenshi]

Sure, why not. I'm not sure I would have thought of the legs-and-explosives trick, though.

~J

[Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_*]

[iPad]

I wasnt saying anything about crappy players mate, more 'no thrills' sams. The message I suppose is everyone needs a hobby (IC wise).

[Cray74]

[noneuklid]

Yes, but most of the people who play ex-special forces ops who had (x limbs) blown off in an explosion and their right arm shot up, then bought upgrades to their 'standard army replacements' (I get those for free, right? Because I didn't pay for them. I don't care if 'resources' includes all gifts! La la la! I can't hear you!) with their mustering out pay and also the huge amount of gold they found in an Atlzan technotemple and now carry assault rifles and katanas (or broadswords, because "katanas are too overused") down the streets...

Most of those people tend not to be the ones to stick around long on a discussion forum, or post entirely too much about their own greatness.

Only us Night One adepts are truly great. 8)

[Apathy]

I've played a fair share of ex-military PCs, because that's my own history so that's what I know. But I agree with others that have posted here; a fun merc can't be defined by his 'ware and equipment any more than the adept is defined by his powers...it's all about the personality you infuse into them.

I think the reason sams and mercs often come across as boring is because they're often the first characters that newbies create (easier than learning all those decking/rigging/magic rules), and it takes a while for newbies to learn how to get into role-playing. But that's just a limitation of the player, not the archetype.

[Crimson Jack]

[Fix-it]

Sams= boring.
Mercs= Less boring.

[Oro]

its the same in every game:
im running a D&D3.5 game right now and one of my players (fighter) is going to play a street sam in a new SR game. hes been playing for a while and knows both systems better than i do. I like lots of options for my characters cause i like a real mental challenge when i play, he likes to kill stuff... so be it.

people who play combat monkeys well usually play them really well cause they have less to worry about system wise and can devote more game time to RP'ing; they dont have to worry about problems on multipule dimensions, just their physical one while a decker/conjurer/rigger has to worry about...well, hed be a nut job after a few months.

in all the games ive run and played in the players that REALLY SHINED role-playing wise were the experienced gamers who played fighters (in all their varied forms). the ones where i had to step back say "damn hes got that character down" where the intelligent, experienced gamers who played moronic meat shredders.

my two cents

[Necro Tech]

Don't forget you can make magic user, adept and rigger combat monkeys. Combat monkeys can be bored frequently when you are not killing stuff. If your merc has hobbies or back up skills, he gets more playing time and tends to be more interesting. If you can't (or wont) roleplay, all characters are boring.

[mfb]

well, yeah, if you're playing a guy with no hobbies, no family to speak of, and no social skills, of course he's gonna be boring. that's true whether you're talking about a sam, a merc, a mage, or whatever.

[toturi]

Ahhh, that's what Meditation is for. Passing the time... and Centering when you initiate. Mage/adept combat monkeys are good.

[Fix-it]

[Sandoval Smith]

No, but he has walked into a mechanic's and asked for a tune-up.

I'd say that the problem isn't with sam and mercs, but with players who really aren't doing any roleplaying.

[Kagetenshi]

That's what Riggermages are for… so you can try to fly out of bed and succeed.

~J

[Cain]

My favorite street sam was a troll with a Cha of 1; he was loosely based on Mr. Tulip from Terry Pratchett's The Truth. He started with an Art History skill of 6, and later raised it to a 9! One of his hobbies was going to museums and seeing if he could make the curators break out into tears.

[mfb]

i think the reason that sams and mercs tend to be characterless more often than other character types is, there are so many more examples of them in media. i mean, consider the following movies as SR characters, and how much they'd suck: Escape from New York, Sniper, Rambo, any Steven Segal movie, any Arnold movie in which he's not trying to be funny. sure, it's fun to watch them beat the crap out of bad guys (except Steven Segal, he's just terrible), but they've got no life. they're excuses for one-liners and violence; and let's face it, most SR players can't come up with good one-liners to save their lives.

[Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_*]

You forgot the most atrocious example: Walker, Texas Ranger.

Although in the right context, even the most ludicrous and unnecessarily violent and stupid scenes can be really effing funny to watch (Which Conan O'Brien proved earlier last year).

[mfb]

i didn't forget him, i had him surgically removed from my mind.

...if you consider opening your own skull with a claw hammer "surgical".

[Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_*]

You know, I wouldn't have charged much if you asked me to do it for you.

[Canid13]

I actually prefer to play the combat monkeys, but I try my best to not make them one dimensional, either in their background or in their personality. Sometimes I fail miserably, but as far as I'm concerned, a character who can just kill people is one dimensional and should be treated as such - any person who's not going to bother trying to do anything else has real issues which can be entertaining to try and bring out.

Regardless of how you kill, a combat monkey is a challenge just as much as any other charcacter because you're got to try and be the character. So a character doesn't take an especially active part in some runs and perhaps doesn't say much, but over time that can change and change dramatically.

Newbies use sams and mercs cos they're less rules heavy (afterall, everyone needs an understanding of the combat rules) so they're easier to start with, in any system. Some people then move away from those arctypes, but some people don't. I enjoy combat as well as the actualy character interaction, so I guess that makes me inclined to play sams and mercs or combat monkeys of one form or another. It's up to me to make them less one-dimensional, and I think I manage it for the most part. Unless I'm intending to play a walking cliche that is :o)

[noneuklid]

Playing a good combat monkey means being a living work of art. I am a minmaxer to the core: Maximize advantage, minimize disadvantage. Just like being a good face means being able to turn an angry mob into a teary-eyed group of barstool pals, being a good combat monkey means being able to get the rest of your group out of an apparently hopeless situation.

And if you are a damn good combat monkey, you have perfect control over who lives and dies while you're doing it.

[mfb]

indeed. playing a combat monkey is more fun, for me, when i'm the only one on the team--not because i want to hog all the kills, or anything, but because that's when it's the hardest to do my job well. more challenge = more fun.

[Canid13]

Hehehe, you'd love my group then mfb. There's loads of combat types but they ALL, including the non combat types, go around without thought or due care (either player driven or cos the character genuinely wouldn't care).

Makes playing a wolf shaman combat guy kinda challenging :o)

Course it's even more fun as a GM coming up with ways to not kill them and not make it look like I ain't going for the throats :o)