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> How many cybereyes in a starting character?, Because we were bored
hahnsoo
post Jan 25 2005, 08:59 AM
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One of my players this past month was getting independent cybereyes installed in his gun-hand (so that he can shoot around corners without exposing himself, or simply look around). Somehow, this lead to a discussion of how many independent cybereyes you can fit in a character. The quick answer was:

Each independent pair costs 0.5 essence. If it is alpha grade, then it is 0.4 essence per pair, so you would end up with 14 pairs and a single cybereye, or a total of 31 eyes (including the 2 natural eyes).

This lead to some chuckles in the group. Then I mentioned that independent cybereyes in a cyberlimb cost only 0.2 essence. Potentially, you could end up saving essence if you installed them all in the cyberlimb.

So imagine you had a pair of alpha grade cyberlegs. Each contains 18 ECU, and can take up to 9 pairs of cybereyes. So that would be:

1.6 essence for the alpha grade cyberlegs (at the cost of 300k :nuyen: )
2.88 essence for 18 pairs of alpha grade independent cyberleg eyes (at the cost of 540k :nuyen: )
1.2 essence for 3 pairs of alpha grade independent cybereyes (at the cost of 90k :nuyen: )
0.3 essence for a single cybereye (at the cost of 10k :nuyen: ).
for a total of 45 eyes (including the 2 natural eyes) at the total cost of 940k :nuyen:

Note that you would get similar results with:

2.0 essence for cyberlegs (at the cost of 150k :nuyen: )
3.2 essence for 20 pairs of alpha grade independent cyberleg eyes (at the cost of 600k :nuyen: )
0.4 essence for 1 pair of alpha grade independent cybereyes (at the cost of 30k :nuyen: )
0.3 essence for a single cybereye (at the cost of 10k :nuyen: ).
for a total of 45 eyes (including the 2 natural eyes) at the total cost of 790k :nuyen: Much cheaper!

There's nothing in the rules that prevent people from doing this at character creation (because it is under the million nuyen resource maximum), other than the sheer stupidity of it all. *grin*
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RedmondLarry
post Jan 25 2005, 01:23 PM
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I see. ;)
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Crusher Bob
post Jan 25 2005, 01:33 PM
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Now, fit eyes lasers in every single one of them...
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Demosthenes
post Jan 25 2005, 01:48 PM
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And you have a lot of tiny little holes burned through your trousers!
:cyber:
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Moon-Hawk
post Jan 25 2005, 02:13 PM
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Well, thank you for . . . that.
Thankfully, we'll never have to wonder about that again. :eek:
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Jrayjoker
post Jan 25 2005, 03:09 PM
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I for one an looking forward to the background explaining the 50 or so eyes looking out of this guys pants.

And talk about awkward on a date....
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DocMortand
post Jan 25 2005, 06:41 PM
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Yeah, you could never call the trouser snake the "eyeless wonder" ever again.

*ponders* Ugh...how many other tasteless jokes are there?

Actually, wouldn't you have to put some kind of link in the brain to allow the cyber eyes to work? I can't believe I'm taking this to the next level...
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ES_Riddle
post Jan 25 2005, 10:47 PM
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The essence cost for cybereyes already figures in that they are connected to the optical center of your brain.
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DocMortand
post Jan 25 2005, 10:51 PM
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Yes, but that is if they are in the normal place. We're talking extra eyes here - wouldn't you need extra hardware to help with the extra sensory data? Not to mention the fiberop wires going from the new eyes to the brain.

I would think you would need a dataport at the very least.
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Crimson Jack
post Jan 25 2005, 10:54 PM
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Man, that was funny. I had a player who once tried to do something similar. He wanted to make a virtual crown of eyes around his head so that no one could ever sneak up on him. Without even getting into whether it was allowed by the book, I told him flatly, "No. You'll not be making such lameness in our game. Make a real character." :grinbig:
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Kanada Ten
post Jan 25 2005, 11:12 PM
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Independant cybereyes are the only way to get an internal tool laser without houserules.

Crimson Jack, I think you were a little harsh on the guy considering the kinds of fun-loving stupidity that any shadowrun must entail. The reaction of NPCs should have been more than enough balance.
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Dax
post Jan 26 2005, 12:02 AM
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Well, we have apparently figured out how one could re-create the good old "Robe of Eyes" out of the 3.5 DMG.

Downside being that he'd have to be largely naked to make it work. :rotfl:
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Fresno Bob
post Jan 26 2005, 01:16 AM
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So it'd be a Disrobe of Eyes...
...

What?
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hyzmarca
post Jan 26 2005, 01:26 AM
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QUOTE (Crimson Jack)
Man, that was funny. I had a player who once tried to do something similar. He wanted to make a virtual crown of eyes around his head so that no one could ever sneak up on him. Without even getting into whether it was allowed by the book, I told him flatly, "No. You'll not be making such lameness in our game. Make a real character." :grinbig:

He should have gotton a cyberskull and put them on a rotating track, that way he'd be able to pick which eyes he needs depending on the occasion. One pair of thermo, one pair of low-light, one paid of optical magnification, ect.
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RedmondLarry
post Jan 26 2005, 02:05 AM
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QUOTE (DocMortand)
We're talking extra eyes here - wouldn't you need extra hardware to help with the extra sensory data? Not to mention the fiberop wires going from the new eyes to the brain.

Extra cybereyes already figure in the essence cost of the extra hardware. A pair of standard cybereyes are .2 essence. Extra ones are .5 essence.
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DocMortand
post Jan 26 2005, 04:41 AM
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QUOTE (hyzmarca @ Jan 25 2005, 08:26 PM)
He should have gotton a cyberskull and put them on a rotating track, that way he'd be able to pick which eyes he needs depending on the occasion.  One pair of thermo, one pair of low-light, one paid of optical magnification, ect.

So are you saying that, to access a particular pair he'd have to roll his eyes?

...

what?

And yes I do see the extra essence cost. I just remember that a datalink was needed to connect various cyberware in the brain to other various parts...wouldn't that apply to this as well?

Edit: I.E. If you plan to shoot around a corner, do you need a datalink to be able to use a Smartlink II with your extra cybereye, since it is not the ones connected to the "natural" section of the brain??
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PBTHHHHT
post Jan 26 2005, 05:03 AM
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hmmm... I can see someone wanting to install eyes all over his body, the type of psycho guy who wants to recreate his body after some demon of legend who has eyes all over their body. (yeah, yeah, there's that one character in Yu Yu Hakusha, errr, did I spell that anime show correctly?)
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Crimson Jack
post Jan 26 2005, 06:10 AM
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QUOTE (Kanada Ten)
Crimson Jack, I think you were a little harsh on the guy considering the kinds of fun-loving stupidity that any shadowrun must entail. The reaction of NPCs should have been more than enough balance.

Heh, possibly and I do milk NPC interactions with my PCs. However, this player is the type of gamer who likes to make characters as messed up as he can just to mess with the other players. He doesn't play in the regular group and so I kinda have to put the governor on his creative cap... for game flow.

Plus, one of the other players was like, "Dude, you're not making a character with eyes all over his head. That just sounds dumb, man." There were laughs all the way around the table, he acknowledged the humor of his idea (as did we all), and then he made a pretty cool character with an interesting back story.

All in all, everyone was happy. :)
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hahnsoo
post Jan 26 2005, 08:26 AM
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QUOTE (DocMortand)
Edit: I.E. If you plan to shoot around a corner, do you need a datalink to be able to use a Smartlink II with your extra cybereye, since it is not the ones connected to the "natural" section of the brain??

You need the following:
An image/display link in the Independent Cybereyes.
A datalink to your Smartgun II processor.

The display link can be folded into the "extra Eye essence", while the datalink would cost 0.1 essence.

Note that you'd still suffer a +4 modifier for ranged attacks when using the Independent cybereyes to shoot around a corner. This effectively means (other than the obvious stealth/surveillance applications) that you are simply allowing the character to use Full Cover (+8) to fire out of (+4 penalty to the attacker). Without the independent cybereyes, you could only fire out of +6 cover with a penalty of +3 to you. It's not incredibly useful in a firefight, but it's great for shooting someone while staying out of sight (i.e. the first shot). Not to mention the style points.
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hyzmarca
post Jan 26 2005, 03:24 PM
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QUOTE (DocMortand)
QUOTE (hyzmarca @ Jan 25 2005, 08:26 PM)
He should have gotton a cyberskull and put them on a rotating track, that way he'd be able to pick which eyes he needs depending on the occasion.  One pair of thermo, one pair of low-light, one paid of optical magnification, ect.

So are you saying that, to access a particular pair he'd have to roll his eyes?

...

what?


Spin. The track would be external and would apear to be a visor with several pairs of eyes on it. All of them would be active at one time, but if he wanted to use a particular feature in a particular direction he'd have to spin the track around.
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DocMortand
post Jan 26 2005, 06:01 PM
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QUOTE (hyzmarca)
Spin. The track would be external and would apear to be a visor with several pairs of eyes on it. All of them would be active at one time, but if he wanted to use a particular feature in a particular direction he'd have to spin the track around.

Meh...that sounds impractical. Think of the problems inherent in the system - how are you going to connect such eyes to a stationary point of the brain? If they are rotating connections to a transducer jack, lets say, then friction between the connection would eventually result in spotty connection, and eventually loss of sight.

Not to mention what would happen if the track got warped due to impact (tripping could be very expensive). The track could be stuck in place, or pushed to the point where the contacts don't touch.

The crown of eyes, while garish, would be a better option than this. Besides...the options of having a pair of eyes for each vision system is better served by having one pair of eyes that has ALL of the vision systems in it.

Hahnsoo: that's about what I thought. Makes sense, and is essence cheap.
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Aku
post Jan 26 2005, 06:51 PM
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is there a total limit to the amount of stuff u can put in a pair of eyes? i know that theres an amount of freebies in there, but i dont know of a total cap on them either.
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RangerJoe
post Jan 26 2005, 07:17 PM
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I suppose the eyes have it... or rather, it has the eyes?
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Jrayjoker
post Jan 26 2005, 07:24 PM
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Could you use a router to record any data the non-active eyes are "seeing" without incurring any disorientation penalties?
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Kanada Ten
post Jan 26 2005, 07:54 PM
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Nope, you have to have an opticam to record visual data of any kind. Think of it as a transducer or translator to machine language. And I would allow an independant eye with a opticam to record even if the cybereye is not transmitting to the brain (though you would need to route that data somewhere).

This post has been edited by Kanada Ten: Jan 26 2005, 08:26 PM
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