 A Katana By An Other Name, would cut as deep |
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 Feb 10 2005, 12:55 PM
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#1
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Running Target  Group: Members Posts: 1,133 Joined: 3-October 04 Member No.: 6,722  |
A lot of people, myself included, have issues with (as I believe it was stated on another thread recently) the whole "Katanas come from Japan. Therefore Katanas are Cool. Therefore Katanas do more damage" setup.
I just had an epiphany on the subject, and you'd never believe where from - bloody D&D 3.5! On the subject of the katana, they say "a katana is just a masterwork bastard sword". Ding! So you want to shell out for a high-quality long/broad sword? Fine, use the katana stats. You bought your katana off the shelf at "Cutting Remarks"? Use the sword stats. Th-th-that's all folks |
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Feb 10 2005, 12:56 PM
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#2
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 128 Joined: 28-January 05 Member No.: 7,029 |
Hehehehe.... I wonder what The Dodd would have to say on Katana's being the bestest swords in the whole wide world! ;)
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Feb 10 2005, 01:02 PM
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#3
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,133 Joined: 3-October 04 Member No.: 6,722 |
A lot. Definitely a lot :) Or he'd just point you at the Knight vs Samurai essay on ARMA.
I still love the story about John taking his son to see A Knight's Tale. The swordfight scene comes on and this little voice pipes up clear as day "Dad? Dad? They're doing it wrong, Dad!" |
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Feb 10 2005, 01:04 PM
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#4
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 128 Joined: 28-January 05 Member No.: 7,029 |
:D
LOL! Lovely! |
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Feb 10 2005, 01:05 PM
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#5
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,512 Joined: 16-August 03 From: Northampton Member No.: 5,499 |
Is that the one with Richard Gear??
Thought the sword scenes looked good (whether or not they are correct im not that bothered) |
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Feb 10 2005, 01:07 PM
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#6
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,133 Joined: 3-October 04 Member No.: 6,722 |
No, that was First Knight. Knight's Tale was the Heath Ledger movie that portrayed Jousting as the mediaeval WWF. A lot of people misunderstood why it used modern imagery and language and slated it, but it's actually a good and fun movie, with some surprisingly deep moments of personal integrity and good old-fashioned being a hero.
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Feb 10 2005, 01:08 PM
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#7
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,512 Joined: 16-August 03 From: Northampton Member No.: 5,499 |
Ah yes the one where they sing we will rock you or some such so i was told. never grabbed me as one to watch.
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Feb 10 2005, 01:12 PM
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#8
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,133 Joined: 3-October 04 Member No.: 6,722 |
That's the one.
Quickie explanation: Mediaeval slang would mean diddly-squat to thee and me. So rather than make a half-arsed attempt at it, the producers went for contemporary slang, behaviour and portrayals to convey the pseudo-rockstar status of jousters. I'd rent it if I were you and make up your own mind. Me, I love it as a fun piece of fluff. |
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Feb 10 2005, 01:19 PM
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#9
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 345 Joined: 10-February 03 From: Leeds, UK Member No.: 4,046 |
A surprisingly good, watchable, entertaining film, depite my initial fears. Plus Paul Bettany is fantastic as Chaucer...
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Feb 10 2005, 01:50 PM
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#10
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 693 Joined: 26-March 03 Member No.: 4,335 |
Unless I'm mistaken, in SR the katana is just a 2-handed sword.
A normal sword is listed as requiring 1 hand. A katana is listed as requiring 2 hands. The katana is listed has having +1 power over the normal sword. The normal sword gets +1 power if used with 2 hands. Seems pretty clear to me. |
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Feb 10 2005, 01:51 PM
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#11
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 693 Joined: 26-March 03 Member No.: 4,335 |
Knight's tale is a fun movie to watch for a reasonably good example of courtly love.
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Feb 10 2005, 01:56 PM
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#12
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 230 Joined: 3-December 04 Member No.: 6,863 |
Agreed. Using both hands in an attack with a sword would give you more power out of the strike compaired to one handed attack. |
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Feb 10 2005, 01:58 PM
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#13
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,006 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Though I'd be inclined to allow the katana to be used one-handed without penalty, because claiming that it's solely a two-handed sword is even sillier than claiming that it does extra damage because it's a katana.
~J |
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Feb 10 2005, 02:04 PM
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#14
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 128 Joined: 28-January 05 Member No.: 7,029 |
*Sigh*
A Katana is a 1 handed sword. Yes, you could grip it with your other hand and smack things with it, but it was made to be used as part of a pair of single handed swords. A No-dachi is a two handed Japanese sword. ;) |
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Feb 10 2005, 02:14 PM
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#15
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 251 Joined: 29-April 02 Member No.: 2,659 |
It *can* be used one-handed, with a great deal of effort and training. The style of doing so wasn't developed until Musashi's time, pretty late, and really as a 'trick' for dueling. You'd certainly lose power and control compared to wielding it two handed - any weapon would. Find a bokken someday and try swinging it around one handed - not easy! On the other hand, it's easier than trying to use a claymore or halberd one handed (which by the rules you can do). I'd reduce the penalty to power and target number to 1, and with training eliminate the target number penalty (so it's just -1 power). As Lantzer said, the SR3 rules are pretty clear on the matter, and pretty accurate too. |
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Feb 10 2005, 02:16 PM
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#16
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,006 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Er, no. It was designed to be used in either one or both hands, and the vast majority of any training with it will be done using two hands. Musashi was exceptional for using two swords, not typical in the least. ~J |
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Feb 10 2005, 02:29 PM
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#17
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 128 Joined: 28-January 05 Member No.: 7,029 |
;)
Heh. I stand corrected! ;) |
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Feb 10 2005, 02:46 PM
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#18
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,006 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Don't mind us, we've probably had this argument at least half a dozen times each by now :)
~J |
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Feb 10 2005, 03:51 PM
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#19
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,840 Joined: 24-July 02 From: Lubbock, TX Member No.: 3,024 |
I thought the dai-katana was basically a two-hander, because it was a few inches longer.
In either case, I'd go with a damn morningstar. Then who the hell needs skill. |
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Feb 10 2005, 03:53 PM
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#20
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,840 Joined: 24-July 02 From: Lubbock, TX Member No.: 3,024 |
EDIT: Double Post
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Feb 10 2005, 03:56 PM
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#21
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,006 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
The dai-katana was an invention of John Carmack for his D&D game. ~J |
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Feb 10 2005, 04:01 PM
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#22
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,840 Joined: 24-July 02 From: Lubbock, TX Member No.: 3,024 |
Well, I've seen it used in a novel as well, but it was decidely fiction, Lustbader I think. Written way before D&D 3rd.
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Feb 10 2005, 04:03 PM
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#23
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,006 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
And John Carmack was playing this game with Romero and others back before Doom came out, well before 3rd ed as well.
Not that it's a terribly inventive name, being the conflation of "big" and "sword". Independent development is entirely possible. That being said there is a large two-handed sword, the Japanese equivalent of the Claymore or similar, though it's more than "a few inches" longer. I cannot, however, remember its name at the moment :oops: ~J |
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Feb 10 2005, 04:06 PM
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#24
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Genuine Artificial Intelligence Group: Members Posts: 4,019 Joined: 12-June 03 Member No.: 4,715 |
No Daichi, as Gentleman Loser mentioned earlier.
The No Daichi is definitely a two-handed sword. The katana was usually a two handed sword, although I would say that that's less because of the weight and more because of the fighting style. |
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Feb 10 2005, 04:08 PM
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#25
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,006 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
That was it, thanks.
~J |
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