 smartlinks and astral perseption |
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  Feb 21 2005, 09:24 PM
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#1
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It's for winners  Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 523 Joined: 8-February 05 From: Wiltshire with da shooty stuff Member No.: 7,067  |
Douse and astrally perceiving character with a smart-link (brought with essence) get the smart-link modifier when shooting? torz x :talker: |
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Feb 21 2005, 09:26 PM
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#2
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
I don't think any digital readout could be read while you are astrally perceiving. I guess the question would be "could you use an image link while perceiving", to which I would say no.
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Feb 21 2005, 09:38 PM
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#3
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It's for winners Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 523 Joined: 8-February 05 From: Wiltshire with da shooty stuff Member No.: 7,067 |
oh and another thing, still seeing through your eyes, surely the smart gun display overlayes the images coming in just like it would with thermographic vision. torz x |
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Feb 21 2005, 09:48 PM
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#4
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 210 Joined: 8-October 04 Member No.: 6,736 |
What about for dual-natured creatures?
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Feb 21 2005, 10:03 PM
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#5
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 132 Joined: 4-May 03 Member No.: 4,535 |
How i've always felt astral perception uses something more like your minds eye than your actual eyes, hence why a blind man can use astral perception even if his eye were ripped from his head. so the digital overlay of the smartlink would not apply.
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Feb 21 2005, 10:08 PM
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#6
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
except that, when a mage uses astral perception, he's got access to his normal sight and his astral vision. i believe the smartlink would apply.
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Feb 21 2005, 10:08 PM
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#7
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
From the BBB, p171:
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Feb 21 2005, 10:37 PM
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#8
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
yes, but it doesn't replace your normal vision, any more than thermo, hearing, or smelling replaces your normal vision. it's merely another sense that you can access.
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Feb 21 2005, 11:13 PM
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#9
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
I'll buy that argument, although I will mention the usual penalties for being astrally perceptive and trying to fire a gun: blanket +2 to your shot, background count modifiers (+1 to +5, depending where you are... most violent gunfights are background count of 1 minimum), and astral visibility penalties, as well as the fact that you will be an "astral beacon" for astrally active entities unless you are also Masking. Also, you would still suffer the usual penalties for your normal vision, like smoke, flashpacks/glare, etc. In most cases, it's just not worth it. |
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Feb 21 2005, 11:36 PM
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#10
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
i'm pretty sure the strong emotions have to be present for an extended period of time (an hour, a day, etc.), or be extremely emotional (crime of passion).
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Feb 21 2005, 11:47 PM
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#11
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,011 Joined: 15-February 05 From: Montréal, QC, Canada Member No.: 7,087 |
I'm guessing there's a PC somewhere intent on shooting invisible targets through Astral sight. You get a +2 to TN for astrally perceiving, -2 for Smartlink. It's only fair and it makes finding the TN a snap as a bonus!
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Feb 21 2005, 11:52 PM
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#12
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
plus, using astral perception makes you both vulnerable and a target for enemy mages.
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Feb 22 2005, 12:29 AM
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#13
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
Well, about the extreme emotion: On page 83 and 84 of MitS, it lists extreme emotion, positive or negative. It specifically mentions "the emotions common during acts of violence also generate this effect." Under Level 1 in the Background Count Levels Table, it says any place where background count was briefly or recently generated, which includes any site where violence was committed within the past hour. At the very least, I'd say the death of a metahuman life leads to a temporary increase in the Background Count by one... multiple/mass deaths may lead to an increase by two points. This is assuming an astrally-naive area that doesn't already have an established background count... different effects would probably apply depending on the location. For example, a hospital would have a background count of 2, and probably would only increase to 3 if unspeakable acts of violence were committed. |
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Feb 22 2005, 10:50 AM
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#14
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 614 Joined: 17-June 03 From: A safehouse about to be compromised by ninjas Member No.: 4,754 |
To shoot at a target on the physical plane yes. To attack and astral target, no. The smartlink requires a pyhsical target to calculate ballistics to etc; an unmaterialized spirit, for example, lacks this component for the device to work off. Note that in this case they would still suffer the +2 tn modifer for performing a totally pyshical action in addition to the SL modifier. IMO.
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Feb 22 2005, 05:12 PM
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#15
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 486 Joined: 4-August 04 From: Fomorian Wastes Member No.: 6,538 |
Aren't the gun cam and range finder part of the smartlink system able to see an invisible target automatically as they are highly processed technological devices? |
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Feb 22 2005, 05:28 PM
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#16
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,664 Joined: 21-September 04 From: Arvada, CO Member No.: 6,686 |
Sure, the range might jump as you wave the gun about, other than that, no, they can't, and thats only if the spell wasn't high enough force (4-5) to affect them anyway.
At best, it'd give you a reason to try blind fireing at the invisible person. |
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Feb 22 2005, 06:22 PM
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#17
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,453 Joined: 17-September 04 From: St. Paul Member No.: 6,675 |
I am going to side with the +2 for astral perception while performing a mundane task, -2 from Smartlink.
In addition, as many people have stated, all the modifiers for both astral vision and physical vision should apply IMO. It still may be better than blind fire, but not by much. Also, as a GM I may just bump your TN to blindfire levels to keep the game rolling because it would be time consuming during combat (the slowest part of the game anyway) to calc out an accurate TN for both sets of modifiers. YMMV |
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Feb 22 2005, 07:02 PM
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#18
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
i don't see why all the mods from both physical and astral perception should be applied. astral perception is close enough to "seeing", i think, that it should follow the rules for multiple vision systems--ie, only the best modifiers (for the character) apply. if your target is a glowing figure lit by the glowing ground, i really don't see why darkness modifiers should make any difference. besides, invisibility imposes a vision modifier. why would you take a +8 TN to hit a figure that you can not only see, but which glows in the dark?
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Feb 22 2005, 07:23 PM
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#19
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 9-July 04 From: Modesto, CA Member No.: 6,465 |
Isn't the Astral effectively, "well lit" or purposes for vision to Perception/Projection? I'd replace the vision modifiers with background count, or the growing one as you gun down opponents. |
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Feb 22 2005, 07:59 PM
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#20
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,453 Joined: 17-September 04 From: St. Paul Member No.: 6,675 |
Right you are. I still have a feeling that the two should overlap with more difficulty that the rules allow right now, but that is just me. And I can house rule it later if I want to. :)
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Feb 22 2005, 08:00 PM
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#21
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
This is not quite true. If you have thermovision active (cybernetically or with magic/adept power depending on your game) and you run into Thermal Smoke or Thermal Glare, you take additional penalties by virtue of having Thermovision on. You can shut off the thermovision but you will still suffer the penalties for Glare afterwards. Same thing with Astral Perception. You cancel out light/dark visual penalties, but you will take astral vision penalties, just as you would if you had Thermovision on and you ran into thermal smoke or thermal glare. |
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Feb 22 2005, 08:09 PM
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#22
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,453 Joined: 17-September 04 From: St. Paul Member No.: 6,675 |
I don't know, the overlap of astral and mundane vision is made pretty clear, and the different modes of cybervision are just that, discrete. I could see taking the better of two situations (magical versus mundane) with the +2 pentaly for using both as sufficient to satisfy the rules.
I still have the gut feeling that it should be harder though. |
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Feb 22 2005, 08:13 PM
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#23
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
Oh, another thing: Astral Perception only cancels out Light penalties. All other penalties are still applied per the Astral Perception LOS rules (there is an entry for heavy smoke/light smoke), and you still take penalties for flashpaks/Glare without Flare Comp.
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Feb 22 2005, 08:23 PM
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#24
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 126 Joined: 27-December 04 Member No.: 6,908 |
the +2 tn represent the consentarion you must exert to astrally purseve. Simular to a deker or riger interacting with the RW while riging or deking.
Yes you get the binifit of a SL2, but it just counters the astral perseption penalty. you still hafta deal with vision modifiers for the sense you are using to primarly aim. The SL2 modifier would not work, on a invisabel target unless the Gun has a sensor that is not efected by the invis. laser sight are vision and thear for usless agins invis. Target Imp Invis. Mage: SL2 w/ sonic raneg finder (alows for SL2 binifits) no sonic raneg finer no binifits( SL can not lock onto target ) Astral per. may let you know where the target is, but not the gun. The gun, or SL must be abble to target the target to get it's binifit. |
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Feb 22 2005, 08:26 PM
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#25
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
the flare/flash thing is kinda dumb, but within the rules for multiple vision systems.
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