 Your top 5, What top 5 things would you like to see |
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 Mar 15 2005, 09:42 PM
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#26
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Great Dragon  Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222  |
I'll have to disagree about 87% here. It'd be better if they just revamped troll heights to be in the 210-240cm range. Either that or keep the trolls at the height they are, raise their weight accordingly (into the 350-500kg range), and really enforce the immense problems that would cause. Trolls Weight, What do you do? |
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Mar 15 2005, 09:42 PM
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#27
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 157 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Perdition Member No.: 108 |
They already are useful. The ECU rules, that's what are completely stupid. I'd like to give a swift kick in the ass to the moron who came up with those. (And knowing he's probably reading these words, yes, YOU, you moron!) Like -- why is it that better cyberlimbs (in grade) have less room to put stuff in? You'd think the opposite would be true. But as far as my 5: 1) Mages get ignored for a while, let's see more development on the cyber and mundane front. I'm not saying make sammies more powerful; I'm saying give mundanes the same level of opportunity given to mages and mundanes for versatility. And give plain-jane mundanes -- I'm talking no cyber, no magic whatsoever -- some in-game bonuses, possibly with a story-driven backlash against cyber and magic. Or possibly some low-grade 'magical' abilities -- like magic, but not magic -- coming from inner talents, like Edges & Flaws, that go away when you get cyberware. 2) Reimplementation of the Power-Level-Staging code system from SR1 in a fashion that makes sense. It could be the answer to our problems with the firearms system. For example, rifles which do 8M damage but require 3 successes to stage down, not 2 -- in essence, an 8M3 damage code -- that would make them what they should be. 3) I guess they're working on the telecommunications and wireless systems for Matrix, so we'll see more deckers who aren't tied to their cyberdecks and a jackpoint. Pity; I rather liked that element of the game. I'm only learning now just how central the decker should be to any group -- even moreso than the mage or the sammie. 4) Martial arts systems which work with armed combat skills. In fact, martial arts systems which work, period. 5) A tech system which works and which lets characters play technical-minded characters -- and I don't mean just the guy with the Electronics and the Electronics B/R which gets you past the unlinked-to-the-Matrix maglock, I mean guys who build your Maglock Passkeys and your Jammers and your other tech toys, as part of their reason for being there in the Shadows. Don't even try to tell me these kinds of characters aren't Shadowrunners -- I played them in Cyberpunk 2020 all the time. Techies of the world, unite! :cyber: |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Mar 15 2005, 09:38 PM
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#28
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Guests |
Build Points as the standard for the chargen system.
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Mar 15 2005, 09:51 PM
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#29
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 875 Joined: 16-November 03 Member No.: 5,827 |
Well, Cyberware and magic are supposed to make people better than the un-enhanced ... i mean the mundane today who is repairing a car without the proper tools is handicaped too. Mundanes are just that: mundanes ... old flesh, not good enough anymore more the magical, cyberenhanced worldk 2070
I would just say: heavy pistole / SMG: 8M assault rifle / LMG: 10M etc ... ;-) SYL |
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Mar 15 2005, 09:52 PM
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#30
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
I like this one, but only if it's on the staging the damage down side of the equation. Don't make it any harder for the shooter to stage that 8M3 up to a serious or a deadly, than it would be to stage a light pistol up. Skill is skill. |
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Mar 15 2005, 09:44 PM
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#31
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Target Group: Members Posts: 20 Joined: 15-March 05 Member No.: 7,164 |
TESTIFY! Really, all I want is getting cybered up to be as cool as being a Mage. |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Mar 15 2005, 09:45 PM
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#32
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Guests |
Some people just don't understand, apple. Don't bother. |
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Mar 15 2005, 09:56 PM
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#33
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 858 Joined: 25-August 03 From: Braunschweig, North German League, Allied German States Member No.: 5,537 |
That's what I would like to see. If they decide to include a race with such bizarre body size/weight they should as well show the consequences. I usually don't allow the stealth skill for troll characters. I mean, it's a being the size of a small car, its footsteps can be heard over several stories - playing trolls is no fun when I'm the GM. I firmly believe that trolls are completely unfit for the shadowrunner profession - stealthy, sneaky breaking-and-entering experts. Living heavy weapon support platforms, that's a different thing. |
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Mar 15 2005, 10:00 PM
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#34
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 9-July 04 From: Modesto, CA Member No.: 6,465 |
) makes cyber/bioware costs like beta and delta more the norm as well as more varierty of things like increasing reaction or init dice. Kind of like writing unix code: many little things that add up to bigger things aside from large systems that do it all.
) Some changes in the mechanics of melee combat to add more abilities and options. ) overhauls to magic putting more emphasis on Initiation / Metamagic ) Build points for chargen would be cool. Since there are no classes, then let players build exactly what they want. Very cool indeed. ) Ressurect Rigging from the mess it is. |
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Mar 15 2005, 10:02 PM
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#35
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 157 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Perdition Member No.: 108 |
Oh, I understand just fine. Just that people are screaming about mundanes falling further and further behind the ability curve, throw 'em a bone. You know what? On second thought, scratch point 1. I'd like to see Mages and Mundanes more balanced, but in different ways. To hell with true mundanes. If they can't get cyberware, and don't have magic, let 'em suffer. Next time, (takes on a Jim Carrey-like voice) DON'T TAKE THE CYBER-REJECTION FLAW, DOOFUS!! The way I see the game evolving right now, mages deal with the astral (spirits, magical threats, etc.), adepts specialize for the physical plane, and cybers generalize for the physical plane. The things holding the cybers back is mainly having the money and the contacts to upgrade. The rules from M&M were an unnecessary impediment to this, because unless you run a very high-powered game, the cybers don't evolve as fast as the mages and adepts. That's why they start so bloody powerful. SOTA 2064 only continued the specialization curve for the adept, while it made the true mundane howl -- unnecessarily. You're right, those who want to be mundanes are handicapped in this setting. They should be. While there's some things which can be replicated -- headset data readers in place of headware memory, a datajack and a display link -- cyberware lets the cybers deal with so much more, and magic lets the adepts be so much better. Mundanes get pooched -- get fucked. I personally would like to see the trends continue. Mages should continue to become masters of the physical environment, working outside the world to shape what's within. Adepts work within the environment to shape themselves. Cybers work the environment itself, spreading their influence and ability to shape the path of the future. And mundanes? They exist within the environment, unable to affect it. Whoa, that's deep. |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Mar 15 2005, 10:32 PM
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#36
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Guests |
HAHAHA Testify! I am with you 100%. |
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Mar 15 2005, 10:26 PM
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#37
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
preach it, brother.
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Mar 15 2005, 10:35 PM
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#38
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Target Group: Members Posts: 85 Joined: 24-September 02 From: Centerville, UT Member No.: 3,307 |
1) Switch to d10s. This would require tweaking all of the target numbers in the system, but it would allow for more gradiation between target numbers and make target number adjustments more uniform in the amount of actual difficulty they add or subtract from a roll. I don't much care for the current "roll tons of dice and throw away most of them as completely useless" central game mechanic.
2) Change the character creation system so that you can buy "package deals" of cyberware/decking programs/vehicles/magic libraries at a discount rather than having to hunt through the books for hours to spend your one-million neuyen. Once play starts things go back to how they are currently. 3) Give more reasons for selecting a weapon than its damage code. Extra built-in features, reliability, accuracy, anything to make the weapons more distinctive. Give them calibers too, so the ammo isn't all interchangable in weapon groups. 4) Bring back variable staging numbers in damage codes. Someone already mentioned this, and it makes a world of difference in weapon types. 5) Give the non-mages an equivelant of initiation that will keep them competative. Maybe the sammys can buy back lost essence in order to allow them to add more cyberware. Maybe the decker gets new features he can add to his programs. There could be many more uses for karma than just bigger attriutes and skills. |
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Mar 15 2005, 10:36 PM
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#39
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 527 Joined: 30-January 04 Member No.: 6,043 |
No kidding. It's a little silly that some insist non-special people must somehow have an edge over special people.
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Mar 15 2005, 10:37 PM
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#40
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Guests |
Aside from the fact that it's illogical and contradicts the very definitions of the terms "mundane" and "special?"
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Mar 15 2005, 10:50 PM
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#41
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 527 Joined: 30-January 04 Member No.: 6,043 |
But... but... they totally made non-cyber mundanes unplayable...
:please: |
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Mar 15 2005, 10:47 PM
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#42
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Decker on the Threshold Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,922 Joined: 14-March 04 Member No.: 6,156 |
Acutally, I think someone around here analyzed toe probabilities once, and you'd be surprised how little this actually changes things. Honestly the dice mechanic is just fine the way it is; certainly it's better than that *other* system. :P
Oh HELL NO. The closest thing I can see to this is the creation of aerchtype characters for quick start play or something. Making "package deals" would only encourage people to take the packages over customizing the character themselves, resulting in an increase in character classism. It'd be a setp backwards.
Well, the decker just needs more uses for karma period. As it is they need to sideline as something else just to have stuff to spend karma on, after upgrading their Computer skill to 12+. But yes, it should be possible to buy back Essence somehow; maybe some sort of theraputic surgery, one that increases Essence but causes more Magic Loss, to keep mages from utilizing it as easily as they do Geasea now? |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Mar 15 2005, 10:51 PM
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#43
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And?
Everything about this paragraph just screams insane to me. First, there's no such thing as too high a skill. Second, there are tons of Matrix-related skills a decker could get. Third, there's no such thing as too high a skill. As for regrowing Essence--that is the worst idea for SR I've ever read. Period. I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Screw the mundanes. |
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Mar 15 2005, 10:53 PM
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#44
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 665 Joined: 20-November 03 Member No.: 5,834 |
Hmm, my bits:
1. I second the "All magics as Metamagics" concept, which I put out myself as a houserule some time ago. Remove some of the onus of having a character's entire future of magical ability heavily determined at Chargen. 2. Make the chargen system and the in-play experience system the same. I don't say make the only chargen system bEcks, but remove the huge karma penalties for not min-maxing, as it is if I take a skill at six and a skill at 2, then upgrade the 2 skill later, I save loads of Karma off starting with a skill of 5 and a skill of 3 and upgrading the 5 skill. This annoys me, the same result should have a similar cost. Perhaps the massive math could be avoided if all costs were flat. 3. More ways for mundanes to protect themselves for mages. As things stand, the only way to stop a mage is often with another mage. This is particularly true for astral projection, a Shapeshifter or Ghoul who isn't awakened is a walking corpse because he has no defenses at all against astral threats, he can't run, he can't fight back, he's just dead as soon as one appears. I'll save my next too for when I get some better ideas. |
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Mar 15 2005, 10:54 PM
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#45
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 858 Joined: 25-August 03 From: Braunschweig, North German League, Allied German States Member No.: 5,537 |
Last time I checked the genre was called Cyberpunk. Not Punk. |
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| Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_* |
Mar 15 2005, 10:55 PM
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#46
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Whoever said they can't fight back? They're dual-natured. It works both ways.
To be fair, his entire comment indicated he was being sarcastic. |
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Mar 15 2005, 11:06 PM
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#47
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 527 Joined: 30-January 04 Member No.: 6,043 |
Thank you, sir. |
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Mar 15 2005, 11:17 PM
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#48
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,032 Joined: 6-August 04 Member No.: 6,543 |
Let's take this idea. I have hade my cyberware removed. It is not longer in my body.... Would it be unreasonable to say after some time, that the part of me that I lost, would now either be regained or replaced? Why wouldn't my essnce come back? |
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Mar 15 2005, 11:29 PM
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#49
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Decker on the Threshold Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,922 Joined: 14-March 04 Member No.: 6,156 |
Er, actually there *is*. Keep in mind that unless you're playing a high-powered campaign you're not supposed to be able to increase any skill beyond twice the governing attribute. That means a skill of 18 for deckers. Additionally, you get a doubly-effective law of dimishing returns on high-level skill increases; not only is the cost increasing every level, but the benefits of getting one extra die when you have 11 already are not nearly so big as getting, for example, the Shielding metamagic. Now, I *do* kinda agree that deckers have lots of knowledge skills to spend their hard-earned karma on, if you use all of those rules. It doesn't even come close to what an adept, a mage, a face, or even a souped up sammie can spend his karma on.
I agree, screw the mundanes. *don't* screw everyone who doesn't want to start as Awakened though, otherwise we're just playing D&D in the 21st century with a different dice mechanic. :P |
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Mar 15 2005, 11:30 PM
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#50
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
this is an argument for another thread. matter of fact, it's an argument that has other threads--several of 'em.
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