 Opinion? Yeah, I got one..., (I can't believe they're doing this) |
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 Mar 25 2005, 02:19 AM
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#51
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Running Target  Group: Members Posts: 1,102 Joined: 23-March 04 From: The Grizzly Grunion, in a VIP room. Member No.: 6,191  |
DAMN, I wish I'd thought of that! |
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Mar 25 2005, 02:41 AM
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#52
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,144 Joined: 22-September 04 Member No.: 6,690 |
On a related topic, I can't really remember where I saw this, but does anyone remember seeing a _huge_ anti-FASA rant by some guy who was completly off his rocker because the release of Bug City screwed up his Chicago campaign?
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Mar 25 2005, 03:13 AM
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#53
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
It's cool. Please note that nobody is saying you (not necessarily addressing Black Mamba) have to like everything (or even anything) about SR4. Nobody is saying you can't have, or express an opinion on anything. The problem is when people make great leaps of conjecture with very little information available, and then get overly upset about these suppositions and start ranting with no real cause. |
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Mar 25 2005, 04:09 AM
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#54
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Target Group: Members Posts: 36 Joined: 7-August 03 From: Irvine, CA Member No.: 5,357 |
You want a good overreaction by a fan story get one of the old timers to tell about the dude who got really pissed about Dunklezahn getting cacked. It was before my time so I don't want to mess the story up but I can tell you it's pure comedy gold.
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Mar 25 2005, 04:36 AM
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#55
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 257 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Los Coronados | San Ysidro CA Member No.: 106 |
Video is my department :rotfl: |
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Mar 25 2005, 05:01 AM
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#56
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 257 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Los Coronados | San Ysidro CA Member No.: 106 |
Gotta throw some remarks in here now ... (getting caught up one page at a time).
First of all, as someone that has an automatic distrust of anything making drastic changes to "MY SHADOWRUN" I admit that wondering about SR4 has me curiously aroused (back off... those are my toys). I have inherently felt that Shadowrun had enough inherent strengths over other gaming systems at the time that it really never needed any new editions. Okay, so I was a playtester back through the first half/two-thirds of 3rd Ed and enjoyed it all. Life just catches up and we discover that stuff's just gotta change on occasion. As for what I am hoping the most comes out of SR4 is a solution to a couple of the oldest problems in the game. Problems that have existed since SR1 actually. Barrier vs. Body vs. Vehicles Let's face it, this game mechanic gives everyone the most severe headaches of all. It's not that it cannot be figured it out, it's that it takes a stroke of mathematical mayhem in the middle of a heated combat scenario to figure it out. If it was somehow streamlined and still made to feel comfortable that would be cool IMO. Matrix Mathematics Speaking of mayhem, let's face it ... the whole concept of the the Cyberdeck slowed people down simply because of the math. I find it interesting that a couple months ago some of us here at the HHH.com group started playing around with Quantum Processing Pool and just ditching memory/MP entirely makes this whole "the matrix gets remade" rumor all the more enticing to me. I also admit that what I personally know about "Mobile Internet" gives me all sorts of ideas of how this might technically work and still be a playable game mechanic that makes sense to everyone. Initiation Research Okay ... gotta admit, this is really only a tad irritating. No real ideas on how to research a new metatalent on ones own. Coming up with "Quest ofs..." only goes so far IMO. |
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Mar 25 2005, 07:18 AM
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#57
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,144 Joined: 22-September 04 Member No.: 6,690 |
Enlightenment please? (and if anyone knows where the Bug City one might be hiding, tell that too. All I really remember is the way that the rightous fury just boiled right off my screen). |
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Mar 25 2005, 07:46 AM
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#58
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,156 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Fresno, CalFree Member No.: 4,252 |
Holy crap, if it means punchings, I will definately go to GenCon.
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Mar 25 2005, 07:44 AM
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#59
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
"And in other news today, a riot broke out at the scene of GenCon. No word yet on the cause, but occasional screams of 'Third Edition was good enough!', 'hands off my game world', 'I like pie', and 'for the honor of White Jesus' could be heard above the din."
~J |
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Mar 25 2005, 07:48 AM
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#60
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
I've spent years preparing for nuclear holocaust and zombie holocaust, and now I have to deal with insufferable SR3 wanker holocaust?
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Mar 25 2005, 08:03 AM
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#61
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,156 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Fresno, CalFree Member No.: 4,252 |
I bet you'll feel really silly when you're totally unprepared for Nuclear Zombie Holocaust.
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Mar 25 2005, 07:56 AM
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#62
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Haven't you heard? GenCon coincides with the Dark Conjunction which will raise zombies, and a nuclear meltdown near the site will prompt global nuclear war. It's the Nuclear Insufferable SR3 Wanker Zombie Holocaust.
~J |
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Mar 25 2005, 08:07 AM
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#63
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,156 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Fresno, CalFree Member No.: 4,252 |
Wow, I totally didn't see that one coming. Guess I'll need to soundproof my shelter in addition to making it deeper. And I guess I could scatter a few more bear-traps to keep the zombies at bay. Unless they're giant mutant zombies. Maybe I'll scatter some copies of Cannon Companion around to keep the SR3 guys occupied, too.
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Mar 25 2005, 08:02 AM
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#64
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
By the power of zebra-striped undershorts!
~J |
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Mar 25 2005, 01:18 PM
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#65
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,314 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Lisbon, Cidade do Pecado Member No.: 185 |
Anyone else feel this thread is on the fast track to getting locked?
Black Mamba - I echo Fortune's words. And apologize, I tend to get overly defensive when people make blanket statements about SR3, particularly when they muddle SR3 under FASA and what, IMHO, has been FanPro's excellent work in bringing a lot of original flavor and grit back into the setting since DotSW, both in terms of writing and artwork. DotSW is a good case in point, a book which could have been a uberpowered campaign's dream come true, but which has material for all levels of play and some really nice twists. In terms of writing: SSG was very well recieved and rightly so; in general so was SoE (more so in Europe than America, true); SOTA64 (despite the controversy around adepts) and Mr.JLBB too. Having recently reread Loose Alliances from one end to another I am confident it's going to knock a lot of people's socks off. SoA surprised me in the end by turning out much better and atmospheric than I ever expected, a lot of people did a lot of good work on that. SoLA's still too fresh in my mind to comment. On the art side I have been genuinely impressed by the evolution, DotSW and SSG had some really good material, I was fortunate that the art in SoE was excellent and evocative throughout (I cna't thank the artists enough) and SOTA64 is one of my favorite books in the whole line in terms of art (that picture of Howler was exactly what I had in mind when writing and the Scherwinski really nailed the Euro-magic perfectly). Haven't laid my mits on MrJLBB yet to see the artwork but am planning too soon. |
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Mar 26 2005, 03:58 AM
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#66
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The back-up plan Group: Retired Admins Posts: 8,423 Joined: 15-January 03 From: San Diego Member No.: 3,910 |
Synner--I'd like to go on record once more, the guys who wrote SoE did a kick ass job, hands down.
On the subject of artwork I have to ask about the nipple piercing on a dragon...intentional or am I just seeing things? Also, to be completely fair, will there be a line for the developers and playtesters to come and slap everyone who either a) went completely off the handle or b) spoke out of turn and made it come across as a personal attack against specific groups? I know that I deserve a few slaps being sent in my direction... |
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Mar 26 2005, 04:21 AM
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#67
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
On my lists, SSG has dethroned Shadowbeat as the book I thump soundly and say "This is the backdrop against which all your adventures are painted." Mr.JLBB... all I can say is that there had better be portions of this book cut & pasted directly into the SR4 core rulebook (The "Don't Reprint Stuff I Already Have" crowd be DAMNED) or there had better be a tear out coupon in the back that gets you $10.00US off the purchace price of Mr.JLBB. How the game managed to go aproximately a decade and a half without the basic concepts of exactly what is a Shadowrun and what typically happens during one spelled out as clearly as they were in Mr.JLBB amazes me to this day. |
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Mar 26 2005, 04:23 AM
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#68
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
I thought those books were called "adventure modules" :P |
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Mar 26 2005, 05:27 AM
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#69
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
Ah, yes, the shove-them-out-of-the-nest-and-the-ones-that-don't-go-splat-turn-out-to-be-decent-flyers approach. :dead: What about the Green-as-Amazonia Shadowrun Noobs, The ones who have absolutely no context for the game? It's not like fantasy role-playing where a new player at the very least, should have some grounding in the subject matter from the fables and faerie tales they grew up with. Typically, with a new Shadowrun player, at the very least you rattle off a few movie titles like Sneakers or Ronin to give them some background before you either give them a pre-gen character or shove the core book in their hands and tell them to make their own character. Now that I have Mr.JLBB, I give them that, a week ahead of time instead. It gives a much better portrayal of what Shadowrunning's about than what you'd find in any of the core rulebooks. |
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Mar 26 2005, 03:04 PM
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#70
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 360 Joined: 18-March 02 From: Plymouth UK. Member No.: 2,408 |
I'll just say Amen to that.
:notworthy: :smokin: |
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Mar 26 2005, 04:04 PM
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#71
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,078 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 67 |
I'm pushing for, and will continue to push for, material like this being front and center in the SR4 main book. While, as a history buff, I like the "And So It Came to Pass..." history information in Shadowrun, I think far too much emphasis has been put in the main books on the past and far too little on the present life of a shadowrunner and the basics of what they actually do. |
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Mar 26 2005, 04:28 PM
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#72
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Moving Target Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 870 Joined: 6-January 04 From: Idaho Member No.: 5,960 |
Agreed. How long did it take for SSG to come? THen MJLBB how long after that? I totally agree. I had a player who has been playing since 2nd ed. came out and he had a very distorted (and incorrect) view of what a runner was and did.
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Mar 26 2005, 04:37 PM
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#73
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Given that Shadowbeat was out during 1st ed…
~J |
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Mar 26 2005, 04:49 PM
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#74
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
indeed. i think the history section should be replaced with a collection of in-character articles and/or anecdotes that paint a picture of what shadowrunners are and what they do. mention the key points of the history in passing--the GGD, the balkanization of the US, the Great Jihad. but stuff like the rise of japan as a major power? you don't need to tell people that, you can just show them.
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Mar 26 2005, 04:54 PM
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#75
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Target Group: Members Posts: 5 Joined: 14-August 02 Member No.: 3,112 |
As a longtime SR player, I just found about this a minute ago....
What I'm feeling now is just as close to hate as I probably could feel over a gaming product. And here I thought Fanpro/Wizkids was doing such a good job on SR please let me wake up..... Rune |
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