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> Shadows of Latin America/Shadows of Asia, Third edition will be complete afterall
LivebythE-SCORE-
post Mar 24 2005, 05:02 AM
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I just received my e-mail from Rob Boyle confirming that Shadows of Latin American and Shadows of Asia are still on schedule. I don't have a date as to when they are supposed to come out.

I think it's a good news because those two books were pormised since Shadows of Europe came out. Since i think SR as never been so complete on world detaisl before SR3 then we can all rejoice that the only regions that will lack details are Arabia/Africa.
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Synner
post Mar 24 2005, 08:42 AM
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This had already been confirmed and FanPro's Catalog (including upcoming releases) is available here.

Before wrapping up SR3, FanPro will be releasing Loose Alliances (the sourcebook formerly known as Sixthworld.org) which details many of the most important non-corporate and non-underworld players (and now that I think of it some of those too) in the Sixth World. Then comes Shadows of Asia and Shadows of Latin America in quick sucession, adding to the overall global picture and also building/wrapping/developing existing plotlines. Finally you have System Failure which will wrap SR3 with a major event.

FYI - The Middle East, and Arabia specifically will be in SoA.
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Luca
post Mar 24 2005, 09:55 AM
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yes but not Africa or North Africa (which is an important part of the Islamic world)...another complaint is tha lack of that fascinating region which are the Balkans (Serbia, Greece, etc...)......well, after all one cannot have anything...it is anyway good to have SOA and SOLA.....
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Luca
post Mar 24 2005, 10:25 AM
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there is another point I do not understand.
In SoE the Balkans and all East Europe was cut due to problems of space......how can be possible that you want to put lands so distant like Syria and Korea all in the same, big, book?
I liked SoE, there are flaws like in any book (I have some complain for Southern Italy), but, in general, it is an inspiring, glorious book. I should say much better than SoNA to my view. SoE did not have time to give you all the detail but, at least, they give you some detail.
The Authors of SoE were obliged to cut off Eastern Europe to give us decent detail of the rest of Europe....how can you pretend to have detailed pictures of a continent (Asia) which is three times Europe?
I understand that so many readers are not interested in things like "what makes Tajikistan different from Kazakistan" (as far as I can see, most people in the West thinks they are just the same because the word end similarly..). But in any case, how can you give us the same level of detail of SoE for such a big area?
I'm angry for the cutting of the Balkans (they must appear somewhere! Please, Synner, post somewhere the draft you were talking about!) but I can understand it was necessary.....so what do you want to cut from Shadows of Asia?
Asia is a complicated land, with complicated history and cultures (the most ancient urban civilizations, as far we can say), much more complicated than North America so you cannot simply resolve it with a sourcebooks all dedicated to modern corporations. What the awakening brought to Mesopotamia or India must be wonderfull and the if the awakened past will be mixed with the complicated future, anything will be just fantastic.
Please, do a good book, not just a small summery of what are the funny names of all those funny countries.
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mfb
post Mar 24 2005, 06:12 PM
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QUOTE (Synner)
FYI - The Middle East, and Arabia specifically will be in SoA.

whoah. SoA's gonna be like 900 pages.
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CanvasBack
post Mar 24 2005, 06:31 PM
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QUOTE (Luca)
yes but not Africa or North Africa (which is an important part of the Islamic world)...another complaint is tha lack of that frascinating region which are the Balkans (Serbia, Greece, etc...)......well, after all one cannot have anything...it is anyway good to have SOA and SOLA.....

Yeah, I'd like to see more info on Desert Wars myself.
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mfb
post Mar 24 2005, 07:12 PM
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i'd like some info on Desert Wars that makes it brutal again. maybe you could just say that the Desert Wars competition is a pale mockery of the real desert wars, which occured (and are now over) elsewhere in the desert. back in the day, being a DW vet made you badass. now, it makes you a punk trid wannabe whose only qualification is that you didn't get shot in one battle.
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Zen Shooter01
post Mar 24 2005, 08:11 PM
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Yeah, I was thinking tht Asia is going to be sketchy, sketchy. Everything from Moscow to Tokyo, from the Arctic Circle to the Arabian Peninsula? In one book?

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Synner
post Mar 24 2005, 08:42 PM
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Don't hold me to it but I think SoA will be even larger than SoE. I too thought it would end up being sketchy simply because of the scale of the enterprise, but I believe we pulled it off.

There will be places which are given only the briefest treatment, but all the major hotspots will get at least as much space as the Euro and American ones did.
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Luca
post Mar 25 2005, 12:50 AM
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Big scale book like Asia? More pages than SoE?
I hope anything will be fine but....What is this? Maybe a kind of haste or rush to publish as much as possible before August when, as anybody knows, the 2060s' will be finished?
I really hope SoA will be a good book.
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mfb
post Mar 25 2005, 01:00 AM
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so... 300 pages?
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Kanada Ten
post Mar 25 2005, 01:09 AM
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QUOTE (mfb)
now, it makes you a punk trid wannabe whose only qualification is that you didn't get shot in one battle...

...and who is also the best and brightest the corps have to offer, experienced with the latest in technology and tactics in a near endless stream of challenges drawn from the last two hundred years of warfare...

Maybe not badass, but certainly more frightening than most corp or metroplex guard offerings.
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Synner
post Mar 25 2005, 01:07 AM
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QUOTE (Luca @ Mar 25 2005, 12:50 AM)
Big scale book like Asia? More pages than SoE?

"Huh?" and "Yes, probably" respectively.

QUOTE
I hope anything will be fine but....What is this? Maybe a kind of haste or rush to publish as much as possible before August when, as anybody knows, the 2060s' will be finished?

Don't know where you're getting these strange ideas. Loose Alliances has been written since before Halloween. Primary writing on SoA was wrapped around the New Year iirc. And SoLA was wrapped a few weeks ago. All were developed and drafted within (what were in my experience) typical timeframes and deadlines - and in a couple of cases a little longer (sorry, minor case of writer's block there).

QUOTE
I really hope SoA will be a good book.

All I can say is that if you liked SoE and SoNA before it you're definitely going to like this one. Even if you didn't like SoE and SoNA this one is sufficiently original and unique that you might still like it.

QUOTE (mfb)
so... 300 pages?

Quite honestly: no idea.
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mfb
post Mar 25 2005, 01:16 AM
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QUOTE (Kanada Ten)
Maybe not badass, but certainly more frightening than most corp or metroplex guard offerings.

yeah. i just think DW should be something more than a televised West Point--or, well, i think there should have been, at some point, a "real" DW that was a hellishly brutal conflict, which the televised DW are based off of. Joe Blow on the street might not know of or understand the difference, but real mercs would. basically, i think DW should be to SR what vietnam was to the 80s--hollywood crap spread thick over a starkly horrible war.
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Grinder
post Mar 25 2005, 11:55 AM
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Maybe they're focusing on some regions like india, china, japan and some arabic states and treat the rest the way they did with greece and the baltic states in SoE, only shortly mentioning what's up there. And i mean very short. ;)
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Luca
post Apr 7 2005, 09:06 AM
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QUOTE (Synner)
Don't hold me to it but I think SoA will be even larger than SoE.

I've noticed today that in the official site Shadows of Asia is described as a 192 pages book (while Shadows of Europe was 240 page....).
I hope SOA will have more pages because, usually, these kinds of previews are simply preliminary information which could be wrong....I hope so.
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Bull
post Apr 7 2005, 08:36 AM
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One thing to remember about this whole deal...

SoE was originally a net project that managed to get the attention of the Blue Fairy. Many of the authors for the project were doing it for love of their home country, and not simply as a writing project. They had extensive knowledge about the area they were writing about, and there was a ton of info that got hacked out due to space.

Greece and the Balkans, OTH, were areas that were pretty sparse to begin with, I believe, because there wasn't any natives working on it. What work was done on it was doen more for completion sake, and chances are it showed. Thus, when the time came to trim the manuscript a bit and focus the writing, they got the axe because there wasn't much meat there to begin with.

With SoA, we don't have many, if any, natives working on it. Shadowrun simply doesn't have the fanbase there. Thus, there's less knowledge to work from, and it's more of a "job" for the writers than a labor of love. This isn't a slight to anyone involved, just saying... It's one thing to have 300 pages written about Lithuania before the project ever even gets green lit, another one completely to get an assignment for Outer Mongolia for 3000 words.

Plus, a lot of Asia's gonna get lumped together. There will likely be more detailed books down the road, maybe in the Target style, that will focus on specific areas, such as the Middle East, Russia, or whatever.

<shrug>

Bull
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hermit
post Apr 7 2005, 09:13 AM
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Hopefully, because 192 pages aren't nearly enough to even give in-a-nutshell type information n Asia's various countries and cultures. But what would most interest me would be a Target: China and Target: Southeast Asia. Tagret: Japan would also be a great idea, of course, because I always found Shadowrun lacked something when the main villain nation never got more than passing coverage.

And for Japan, there're even fans out there who wrote up a net book; so much for the labour of love thing.
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Synner
post Apr 7 2005, 10:33 AM
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QUOTE (hermit @ Apr 7 2005, 09:13 AM)
And for Japan, there're even fans out there who wrote up a net book; so much for the labour of love thing.

One step ahead of you. We tapped some of them (not many) to give us a hand with SoA.

However given the drafts I was privy to, I'd venture a guess that those figures, like the ones originally posted for SoE (namely 164 pages) are placeholders until layout is finished.
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Critias
post Apr 7 2005, 10:43 AM
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If I told you guys I was from the Tir, would I get to help out with the next sourcebook touching on stuff going on there?
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Demosthenes
post Apr 7 2005, 09:59 AM
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QUOTE (Critias)
If I told you guys I was from the Tir, would I get to help out with the next sourcebook touching on stuff going on there?

Me too! (Though I suspect we're talking about different Tirs...)
Aye, but which one?
Have to get my grubby mitts on SoE and see what they made of Ireland...
Not that I have any reason to complain if I'm unhappy...
[ Spoiler ]
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DrJest
post Apr 7 2005, 11:16 AM
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QUOTE
Have to get my grubby mitts on SoE and see what they made of Ireland...
Not that I have any reason to complain if I'm unhappy...


I'm curious, Dem - what did you think of Tir nan Og? For my part, once you got past the Mary Sue parts I thought it was an interesting and sometimes chilling portrayal of an incredibly dictatorial regime, but never having been to Ireland I couldn't testify to the realism (or lack thereof) of the geography and history.
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Critias
post Apr 7 2005, 11:30 AM
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Well, I'm not from Ireland, but I'm a fan of both Tirs, a history major, and I've been on vacation to Ireland a few times. For what that's worth, I remember being fairly imperssed with the geography and whatnot from the old na nOg book; the parts of Ireland I'd actually hiked around sounded about like a magically active, idealized, version of what I remembered. The parts I hadn't been to, I cross-checked with my various and sundry travel guides, and that (at least) matched up.

Which, I mean, is better than some sourcebooks have been.
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Synner
post Apr 7 2005, 10:24 AM
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I would note that the authors of the TNO chapter (Pistons, Steve and Rob) were constrained by a lot of pre-existing canon, in much the same way as we were with the UK. Given those restrictions and expectations, I think TNO turned out particularly well.
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Demosthenes
post Apr 7 2005, 11:26 AM
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I don't remember the TNO sourcebook very well - I borrowed it off a friend a looong time ago. I didn't like it much then.

I'll have to look at it again and get my hands on SoE before I can really pass judgement honestly.
I'll keep an open mind, promise!
(And as I said, I kept my mouth shut at the "speak now or forever hold your peace" part of SoE development...)
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