 Mechanics vs. Setting, Slightly different |
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 Mar 27 2005, 05:03 PM
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#1
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 669 Joined: 25-May 03 Member No.: 4,634  |
I started this poll up as sort of a "refinement" to the other poll, so that a more complex array of answers would be possible.
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Mar 27 2005, 08:57 PM
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#2
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Target Group: Members Posts: 91 Joined: 23-January 05 From: Washington, DC Member No.: 7,007 |
GunnerJ,
Thanks for the refinement for my, admittedly, crappy one dimensional poll. Good work!!! :) |
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Mar 27 2005, 10:03 PM
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#3
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Running, running, running Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,220 Joined: 18-October 04 From: North Carolina Member No.: 6,769 |
wouldnt 50/50 be the same thing as both are vital? heh
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Mar 27 2005, 10:16 PM
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#4
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,006 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Not really. 50/50 means you could remove one and have half a game, "completely vital" means if you take one out you've got nothing (or nearly so).
~J |
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Mar 27 2005, 10:28 PM
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#5
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The King In Yellow Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,922 Joined: 26-February 05 From: JWD Member No.: 7,121 |
100% setting: I want NO changes in the setting, evolution yes, but nothing drastic, no SR - dark age, no SR - BESM, no SR - GitS clone. All that changes should be based on happenings described in existing books. No disappearance of major metaplot figures either - no sudden IE disease, no sudden GD demise, no breaking up of every corporation, no US restoration.
50% mechanics: There's a lot they could cut back on, and a compete remaking of vehicle and Matrix rules might be in order, but NO changes to the heaps of D6 I get to roll! Guess that makes me 'other'. And no idea why my vote didn't get through. |
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Mar 27 2005, 10:43 PM
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#6
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
I get a kick out of the 'completely vital' crowd, as Shadowrun's mechanics have already changed twice and the game still exists. :D |
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Mar 27 2005, 10:36 PM
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#7
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Running, running, running Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,220 Joined: 18-October 04 From: North Carolina Member No.: 6,769 |
but if you take out 50%, you're obviously lacking some major point, but i null voted.
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Mar 27 2005, 10:56 PM
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#8
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Why oh why didn't I take the blue pill. Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,545 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gloomy Boise Idaho Member No.: 2,006 |
Not disagree with you buddy, but they wern't so much changed as revised. If you played SR1 you could pretty much jump right into SR2, and the same goes for SR3. From what I can tell SR4 is gonna be a whole new rule set that also uses D6, but doesn't have a lot in common with our current SR3. Not to mention the seemingly drastic setting changes. |
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Mar 28 2005, 02:34 AM
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#9
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
SR2 to SR3 had some wide sweeping changes of its own. And I'm just not seeing the 'drastic' setting changes. Sure the timeline is advanced, and the Matrix is being rconfigured, but FanPro isn't rewriting the Sixth World. They are just evolving it, not making every bit of history (or even any of the history) that came before invalid.
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Mar 28 2005, 03:06 AM
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#10
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,006 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
The shift from first to second was big, but while there were some significant differences between second and third, it was largely a retooling. Personally, I don't consider Shadowrun to be the same game between First and Second edition. ~J |
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Mar 28 2005, 08:01 AM
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#11
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
cant comment on the sr1 to sr2 changes as i got into it late sr2. but to me the sr rules reinforce and give shape to the sr fluff.
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Mar 28 2005, 08:21 AM
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#12
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,156 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Fresno, CalFree Member No.: 4,252 |
Aren't options 3 and 6 the same?
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Mar 28 2005, 08:31 AM
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#13
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,006 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Look up.
~J |
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Mar 28 2005, 09:14 AM
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#14
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,156 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Fresno, CalFree Member No.: 4,252 |
Well excuuuuuuuuse me.
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Mar 28 2005, 10:47 AM
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#15
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,133 Joined: 3-October 04 Member No.: 6,722 |
SR1 to SR2 was a much-needed streamlining.
SR2 to SR3 seems to have been more minor changes (and ones that continually trip me up - "Did you roll the Force of that spell?" "Yes. ... Oh yeah. ((adds a couple of dice because Sorcery is higher))" |
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Mar 28 2005, 07:45 PM
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#16
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Knight Templar Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 212 Joined: 20-June 04 From: Ipswich, UK Just South of the Stinkfens Member No.: 6,424 |
Very important poll to put up GunnerJ. Many thanks :)
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Mar 28 2005, 07:56 PM
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#17
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
biggest changes from SR2 to SR3 was the initiative system, making wired reflexes a bit less uber, and the removal of grounding. the rest was folding the vr2 and rigger2 rules into the main book. |
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Mar 28 2005, 08:01 PM
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#18
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Adding Knowledge Skills, totally reworking how Sorcery worked, redefining Astral Projection, Metamagic and Initiation changes, and quite a few other 'little' things. |
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Mar 28 2005, 08:02 PM
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#19
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 9-July 04 From: Modesto, CA Member No.: 6,465 |
Admitidely, I've always enjoyed Mechanics over Story. I am can always make up something to fit what I want, but solid rules are important for my group to help them know what they can and can't do.
I like my rules static, and my storylines fuzzy. |
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Mar 28 2005, 08:31 PM
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#20
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
oops, what the year of SR3 have made me forget... still, metamagic and initiation changes came with mits, not SR3 main. but other then that your correct. astral projection was reworked (no longer a need to dodge every living plant and being out there. allso killed the trick of covering the office in plants. still, there is that awakend ivy from amazonia). havent looked at the SR2 sorcery in ages so i cant comment on the specific changes there. knowledge skills true, and the removal of the skill map (good riddance :P ). but still the two most talked about changes was the removal of grounding (a classic trick to keep the mage from going astral lighthouse) and the reworking of the initiative system (no more mr "the flash" sammie). |
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Mar 29 2005, 04:45 AM
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#21
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
Like the fact that under SR3's Bleeding To Death rules, character's die a hell of a lot quicker than the same rule in SR2. :dead: :vegm: |
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Mar 29 2005, 06:00 AM
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#22
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 560 Joined: 21-December 04 Member No.: 6,893 |
Mechanics all the way. A streamlined system that's easy and fun to use (but with a bad campaign setting) only requires a few hours, a word processor, and a few large sheets of graph paper to correct. In contrast, a bad set of mechanics will cause me to move over to the Dark Side (A.K.A. GURPS) despite the lack of fun nifties inherent in Shadowrun, and not buy any more rulebooks.
For the record, I did the same thing with AD&D 2nd edition back in my AD&D days. My players liked it too; they could get a HARDCOVER player's handbook for 8$ in a used books store compared to 30$ for a PAPERBACK 3e edition. And, of course, another one for 3.5 in six months. So, be warned: I'm not going to move unless the game mechanics are a LOT better than those of SR3. |
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Mar 29 2005, 06:31 AM
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#23
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Freelance Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 7,324 Joined: 30-September 04 From: Texas Member No.: 6,714 |
SR3 also broke up quite a few of the skills (especially combat ones) into smaller, more specific, skills. No more "Firearms 8" guy who can pick up anything and kill you with it, melee combat/edged weapons/knives specialists, or unarmed combat/kung fu/hand strikes masters.
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Mar 29 2005, 06:47 AM
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#24
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
there was a paperback 3e PHB?
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Mar 29 2005, 07:08 AM
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#25
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
It's news to me too. Unless SpasticTeapot is refering to the few instances where third-party publishers have taken the System Reference Document and compiled it into a cheap paperback form as an alternative to the offical D&D products. |
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