 Spirit Chatter |
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 Mar 28 2005, 08:23 AM
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#1
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Running Target  Group: Members Posts: 1,129 Joined: 11-June 03 From: Tir Tairngire Member No.: 4,712  |
What kinds of sounds (if any) can be heard in astral space when a mage is projecting? Do spirits communicate via a form of telepathy? A player asked me about this tonight, wondering if his ally spirit could communicate with another astrally projecting shaman. I wasn't sure. I know that his ally has the telepathic link power, so the two of them share the bond, but as for others I wasn't sure.
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Mar 29 2005, 12:43 AM
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#2
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
The story on page 177 makes clear what is hinted at on page 173. Sound, while psychic, is present and communication between astral forms is possible without the need for other magics.
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Mar 29 2005, 12:52 AM
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#3
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
The question is, without any sort of language skill, would an Ally Spirit specifically know any languages that can be used while in the astral plane? I'd say no, because there's no such thing as an "Astral Language" or "Universal Spirit Language"... I'd imagine the Ally Spirit would need at least one point in the relevent language skill to speak on the astral plane to another mage. I'm sure more forgiving GMs and gaming groups out there would allow the Ally Spirit to retain the native language of the summoner, I'm just saying how we play it in our group. I also think that language barriers (speaking English to a German-only speaker, for example) still exist astrally, otherwise language would mystically get translated somehow when you are astrally projecting...
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Mar 29 2005, 01:24 AM
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#4
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
Whether spirits know languages is not relevant to whether sound exists, or if communication occurs on some level. A lion's roar may not be in English, but I understand it well enough, and that should go double or triple on the astral where the emotions are as clear as crystal.
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Mar 29 2005, 01:26 AM
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#5
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
I was going by the example given rather than the initial question posted (which, when looking at the example, asks a very different question), sorry if I have offended in any way. I figured you answered the first part well enough, but didn't answer the actual example, which is what I wanted to clarify. :-P |
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Mar 29 2005, 01:25 AM
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#6
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
Well, then I would point to watchers and say the answer is most likely yes, spirits can talk with other astral beings in the summoner's language. Furthermore, Elementals can be commanded to obey other characters (page 187), mudane or otherwise, implying that they can understand in the very least.
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Mar 29 2005, 07:39 AM
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#7
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,512 Joined: 16-August 03 From: Northampton Member No.: 5,499 |
Don't forget that Spirits around the Wuxing Tower could be seen having conversations.
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Mar 30 2005, 05:50 PM
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#8
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Old Man Jones Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,415 Joined: 26-February 02 From: New York Member No.: 1,699 |
The real question is, what would spirits chatter about?
Big deep astral philosophies? Or maybe how Swiftwind went and got her claws re-done, and don't they look just adorable? Can you imagine projecting into astral space and suddenly hearing thousands of inane meaningless mind-numbing conversations? Maybe it's better that we can't understand. :D -karma |
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Mar 30 2005, 06:34 PM
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#9
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
How do we know that, in the case of watchers, it isn't by rote memorization? While a watcher can communicate telepathically with its summoner, the "Astral Messenger" service seems to be limited to a phrase/picture and a response. All the watcher would have to do is mimic the sounds coming out of the summoner's mouth, and then "record" the response once he has delivered the message. Telepathic communication with the summoner is one thing, and communication through language is another. Again, I can see kind GMs and Gaming Groups allowing all spirits to know the native language of their summoner, and being able to speak said language fluently (the equivalent of 2 points of the native language skill). This brings up issues, though, of translation... if a spirit speaks to, say, a German Wiccan who only speaks German, would it be able to communicate at anything beyond an emotional and psychic level? If it CAN, why is it that there are no spirit interpreters, as they would be able to translate any human language, apparently? Back to the question of the Ally Spirit, it isn't specifically stated that the Ally knows any language unless it is given to them by the summoner. The only communication that exists is the telepathic bond between the summoner and itself. I'm sure the Ally can understand spoken language (especially if it has been around for a while), but to respond intelligently in a spoken language on the astral plane is another thing entirely. A non-canon possibility is that all language on the astral plane is being-to-being, mind-to-mind, a telepathic connection between two entities like Dragon thoughtspeak. This again brings up issues of translation of languages (why no astral interpreters?), but it conveniently sidesteps the issues that underlies the native language problem. |
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Mar 30 2005, 07:12 PM
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#10
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
if watches could only say aloud what they've memorized, it would be noted in the book. there's no basis for the assumption that they can only speak what they've memorized.
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Mar 30 2005, 07:06 PM
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#11
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It's for winners Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 523 Joined: 8-February 05 From: Wiltshire with da shooty stuff Member No.: 7,067 |
This was something I had always wondered about, I have been told that you cannot communicate with people in the astral but always wondered if you could still hear sound and what was going on??
torz x :D |
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Mar 30 2005, 09:25 PM
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#12
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,587 Joined: 25-January 05 From: Berkeley, CA Member No.: 7,014 |
There's no basis in the book that they have meaningful speech with people other than their summoner, either. It is clear that spirits and summoners of those spirits can communicate in some way (most likely thought-voice or telepathy). It is never made clear whether or not a watcher can have meaningful communication to other spirits or to other people (especially those who speak a different language from the summoner). Thoughtvoice is one thing, speaking in Spanish or Sperethiel is another. |
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