What *is* Shadowrun? Options

[mfb]

ooh, that's one thing i forgot. revision, meatbags:

a classless d6 game set in the Shadowrun universe, with detailed game mechanics that make the game dangerous to characters of all power levels and incorporate greater and lesser degrees of success.

[Pthgar]

For me:

Near Future
Dystopian
Megacorps
Magic meets Man meets Machine meets Matrix
Metahumanity
Conspiricy Theories
Mercenary Teams
Very Lethal
Fun with Friends

[TeOdio]

[Kagetenshi]

Another big thing that's Shadowrun to me: things that are different not working the same. Decking isn't Rigging isn't spellcasting isn't firing a gun.

~J

[mfb]

to a point. i don't think spellslinging should be different from decking just to be different. i think spellslinging should be different from decking because the are different, and i think that the differences in the mechanics should spring from necessary differences in the activities, rather than from some desire to just throw in differences willy-nilly.

for instance, i can't see any way to work a mechanic similar to writing scripts into the physical combat rules, so i don't think they should try. but, given the fast-and-loose way the Matrix is explained, i don't think it's unreasonable to handle sneaking past a piece of IC the same way you'd handle sneaking past a guard.

[Cain]

Shadowrun is the game I learned to roleplay on. It taught me how to think outside the box, to measure and consider tactical options, and that the game was more than just combat. It taught me that just a few simple stats could turn into a very complex and detailed character. It allowed me to have the most flexibility in designing a character, who could be virtually anything I wanted, within the starting power levels. It's the game I've loved ever since I picked up my first blue book in 1989; and the only game I've had autographed by one of the game designers.

That's what Shadowrun is to me. So far, SR4 doesn't sound like that game anymore.

[Vuron]

[mfb]

which parts? the only thing i see in that list that SR4 is apparently missing is the tactical options for combat. (and yes, that's a big loss, and i hope to see it put back in before the game comes out.)

-thinking outside the box? no word on anything i'm aware of that would limit that.
-simple stats, complex character? see above.
-flexibility in char design? ditto.

[Kagetenshi]

[mfb]

but the Matrix system is wholly unrelated to reality. sneaking through systems in the Matrix has no concept to default to. there's no reason not to borrow a default concept from another part of the system.

[Vuron]

[The Horror]

To me Shadowrun is the classic Cyberpunk game, only with more focus on the spiritual side of the story.

Really, the only thing that makes the Shadowrun setting better than Cyberpunk 2020 is the Native American presence and the way that magic and metahumanity blend so seamlessly with the dark and gritty. Somehow, having japanese metahumans in control of faceless corporations just works. It provides a much easier avenue for exploring themes of racism in games than standard Cyberpunk, and the Native American parts allow for a good exploration of themes relating to technology, the possible sentience of machines/the definition of life itself, and the interconnectedness of man with the world around him.

Just recently I ran a Shadowrun game for a group that had never played it before. They all thought it was going to blow for sure. Needless to say, they were all very surprised, and all became very appreciative of how much Shadowrun really had to add to the story rather than being the stereotypical Cyberpunk 2020 with elves and dwarves. They still all thought the system sucked though, and are happy to hear there will be an overhaul of the entire thing.



The Horror

[Fresno Bob]

Shadowrun is a 700 ton rodent who lives in outerspace.

[Kagetenshi]

Hey stupid—are you too dumb to know there are 4 different simultaneous editions within a single edition of Shadowrun? D20 1 edition is a lie. 4 corners of the book = 4 directions and 4 different editions. Each edition rotates its own separate direction. Infinity rules is stupidity.

~J

[mfb]

evil word-bastards do not deserve to live.

[Pthgar]

6th World is a lie! You are to stupid and ignorant to see that it is 4 simultaniuos world exitsing at once. Orks are sunrise, humans are noon, dwarves are sunset, trolls are midnight. Elves are created by stupid evil educators to make you belive the lie.

[Penta]

Okaaayyyyyy....whaaa?

[mfb]

bask in the knowledge of Dr. Gene Ray, you educated singularity stupid non-entity.

[Cain]

[mfb]

argh. i'm really getting tired of people saying that--that deckers and riggers are just going to be one muddled "techie". if you listen to the guys who are actually playing the game with SR4 rules, you'll find that this just isn't true at all. a hacker who focuses on vehicles won't be able to do a computer-hacker's job, any more than a stealth-oriented adept will be able to to a gunbunny-adept's job.

i'm also still not clear how you're getting SR4 = inside-box-thinking only. what's been posted that would keep an SR4 mage from whacking the PCs with chaotic world, then letting the guards finish them off?

i agree that the loss of combat pool needs to be fixed in some way. but i don't see at all where you're getting the rest.

[sapphire_wyvern]

[mfb]

i'm responding specifically to Cain, who did say those things. i know most people aren't saying 'em, but, well, Cain did.

[sapphire_wyvern]

[mfb]

hm. that's not what his first post sounded like, to me. he listed what SR is to him, and then said SR4 doesn't sound like that game.

[sapphire_wyvern]

Whoops. Please see my edited post above for my final, definitive, opinion. ;)