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> Are you switching?, Simply, will you convert from SR3 to 4?
Again, will you convert from SR3 to SR4?
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Cable
post Apr 16 2005, 12:20 PM
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Lets face it, simply put, theres a lot of great source for SR3. After playing many roleplaying games, I've found Shadowrun to be a great balance between fun, fast action and complex rules. I like don't like over complex rules, and SR3 balances them very well. I won't be converting, there isn't anything wrong.

I think they're pulling a "D&D" here. They're not changing editions to fix the system, they're doing it so we have to rebuy all the same old source again. I've owned three different mage, rigger and matrix books. I'm done. I like the way it is. The SOTA updates don't include a heck of a lot of stats, its mostly world source. I thinks I'll be alright.

Excuse me if someone's already ranted on this. I haven't read that post and would like to know how other gamers are taking it.
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Critias
post Apr 16 2005, 12:41 PM
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I've gotta see. As much as I hate to say it, every FAQ posting is making me less and less excited...but, I'm a fanboy. Gotta buy it, gotta try it. Gotta make up my mind totally, for myself, when I see the finished product.
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Fygg Nuuton
post Apr 16 2005, 01:25 PM
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as of right now, yes i am changing. But i'm all about progress and the belief that these people are professionals and can do a better job than i can do.

if its a twenty page book though, thats a different story
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blakkie
post Apr 16 2005, 01:38 PM
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I put down a "Yes", but it's more like a "Yes, for now". I haven't seen anything yet that would convince it's not worthwhile. If only for deckers to be mobile with the team (i.e. playable) and to have the rules organized rather than rambling.
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psykotisk_overle...
post Apr 16 2005, 02:10 PM
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I'll definetly have to see more, because if this might turn out great. But as of now, I'm not changing.
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Pthgar
post Apr 16 2005, 02:33 PM
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I buy just about every new SR book that comes out. I would have bought whatever they would have published instead of SR4. In the end if I don't switch now I'll switch at some later date when I want to be current and am to lazy to do conversions.
If it really is easier to learn and smoother to play, I'll be very excited. I've had people give up on SR because it had too many rules. These were not casuall gamers, they were full on hard core nerds.
If we have to, my group will house rule what we cannot swallow with SR4, just like we did with SR3. I doubt we'll have to make more than we did with SR3.
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Grinder
post Apr 16 2005, 03:01 PM
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I'll wait until i bought the new BBB and read the rules. Then i'll decide if i (and my group) switch over or continue playing sr3 or a mix out of both. Guess the latter one is the most likely option.
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Catsnightmare
post Apr 16 2005, 03:04 PM
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No. Though I will somehow obtain a copy and see if anything is worth retro-converting to SR3.
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Grinder
post Apr 16 2005, 03:39 PM
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When it comes to music i'm sort of old-school :D but in rpgs i always enjoy new influence - and i guess sr4 will have a lot of new ideas which will be appealing to me and my fellow gamers. :)
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Cable
post Apr 16 2005, 03:45 PM
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Here's the problem, they're widening the fan base. Now from a developers stand point and, of course, the bank accounts stand point thats a good thing. But, its our shadowrun. If you wanted a simple game, you'd have tried it, hated it, and then played D20 MODERN.

Lets face it, we play SR for a reason. Maybe I'm nuts.
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Charon
post Apr 16 2005, 04:42 PM
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Am I switching?

Yes, I love switching.

QUOTE (Cable)
I think they're pulling a "D&D" here. They're not changing editions to fix the system, they're doing it so we have to rebuy all the same old source again.


Whoah, bad example. If you think that updating AD&D wasn't needed, then I'm assuming that no revised edition in the history of roleplaying has ever met your approval.

The upgrade from AD&D from D&D 3e was desesperately needed and turned out great. If ever there was a necessary and successful new edition, it's that one.
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blakkie
post Apr 16 2005, 05:18 PM
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QUOTE (Cable)
Here's the problem, they're widening the fan base. Now from a developers stand point and, of course, the bank accounts stand point thats a good thing. But, its our shadowrun. If you wanted a simple game, you'd have tried it, hated it, and then played D20 MODERN.

Lets face it, we play SR for a reason. Maybe I'm nuts.

Nuts? Nah, just machocistic. ;)
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DragginSPADE
post Apr 16 2005, 05:34 PM
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Hmm... I still need to see more. A week ago I would have said yes. But the more they post on the blog, the less excited I am about the new edition.
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Pthgar
post Apr 16 2005, 06:03 PM
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That's why there are NDA's and stuff. Any news that comes out before the whole picture can be seen isn't likley to make people feel better. The DevBlog was really a sop to us on DS. I would have been just as happy with totally secrecy and wild speculation (except maybe a "Definatly not D20") because incomplete info is just as bad (or worse) as no info to me.
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Whizbang
post Apr 16 2005, 06:10 PM
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I'm not the keenest on changing...I mean, I'm just starting to understand SR3... and now they're on to SR4. I just can't win.
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Whizbang
post Apr 16 2005, 06:11 PM
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QUOTE (Charon)
Am I switching?

Yes, I love switching.

QUOTE (Cable)
I think they're pulling a "D&D" here. They're not changing editions to fix the system, they're doing it so we have to rebuy all the same old source again.


Whoah, bad example. If you think that updating AD&D wasn't needed, then I'm assuming that no revised edition in the history of roleplaying has ever met your approval.

The upgrade from AD&D from D&D 3e was desesperately needed and turned out great. If ever there was a necessary and successful new edition, it's that one.

The upgrade from D&D 3.0 to 3.5, however, wasn't.
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Capt. Dave
post Apr 16 2005, 06:32 PM
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I'll get the new BBB, read it over, try a few games with our group, and we'll all decide. I really want to like SR4, I just don't yet due to the small amount of info I've seen so far. Maybe we'll get used to the new system and love it. I hope so.
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blakkie
post Apr 16 2005, 06:33 PM
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QUOTE (Whizbang @ Apr 16 2005, 12:11 PM)
The upgrade from D&D 3.0 to 3.5, however, wasn't.

Yes, but it's shaping up that SR3 to SR4 is more akin to 2e to 3e. It has been, what, seven years since SR3? D&D 3e to 3.5e was more like 1/2 that time. Value to the player was dubious.

P.S. I personally just use the free electronic 3.5 SRD, which includes the key crunch for the DMG, epic (above 20th level), a lot of monsters, and psionics, (all that were separate books under 3.0). For me it wasn't much of a deal of new books, though there are people that had filled out the This & That series under 3.0 that certainly could feel compelled to buy the Complete Those heroic series.
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Charon
post Apr 16 2005, 07:23 PM
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QUOTE (Whizbang @ Apr 16 2005, 01:11 PM)
The upgrade from D&D 3.0 to 3.5, however, wasn't.

Considering that all you need to know about that has been put for free on the net by Wizard in their revised SRD, I don't see the problem. They've basically fine tuned the rules of 3e and let us use them for free. I haven't bought 3.5 but I do play with those rules.
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blakkie
post Apr 16 2005, 07:29 PM
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QUOTE (blakkie)
QUOTE (Cable @ Apr 16 2005, 09:45 AM)
Here's the problem, they're widening the fan base. Now from a developers stand point and, of course, the bank accounts stand point thats a good thing. But, its our shadowrun. If you wanted a simple game, you'd have tried it, hated it, and then played D20 MODERN.

Lets face it, we play SR for a reason. Maybe I'm nuts.

Nuts? Nah, just machocistic. ;)

BTW if you need any more proof of this machocitism go no further than the fact you are still posting here by don't plan on moving to SR4 even before you see actual details. I mean at least Catsnightmare is planning to umm, pirate parts of SR4 and try shoehorn it into SR3 as house rules. But apparently your answer is fixed already, but you are sticking around? :spin:
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Sunshine
post Apr 16 2005, 07:33 PM
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I ran a test of the new game mechanic (as much as i know about it, that is) and it worked out quite fine. It turned out to be faster in resolving combat. As much as I know right now I will switch. But I am also a Fan of 7th Sea and it seems there are some similarities besides the fixed TN.

I'll get a copy of the Core Book anyway, just to see how the integration of De(Ha)ckers works out.

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Charon
post Apr 16 2005, 07:35 PM
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What's "machocitism" or being "machocistic" anyway?

In a thread about switching, you'd think people could spell "masochism" correctly. ;)
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Wounded Ronin
post Apr 16 2005, 07:39 PM
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QUOTE (Charon)


The upgrade from AD&D from D&D 3e was desesperately needed and turned out great. If ever there was a necessary and successful new edition, it's that one.

What? How can you say that? D&D 1st edition was the best. It was the funniest and most entertaining.

Like, in 1st edition Oriental Adventures, you could take a weapon proficiency in karate and do d6 damage per punch just like that. Also, if you assaulted someone with a pair of chopsticks you could do d3 damage per hit. How hilarious is that? Nothing satisfies you for the whole week more than hamming up a fake Japanese accent and busting out improbably damaging karate on the zombies that were rolled on the random encounter table.

1st edition also had the table where the DM could roll to automatically determine the disposition of NPCs that you hire in taverns. There was a small chance that you might end up hiring a psychotic torch bearer who would then try to kill you all in the dungeon. Nothing in 3rd edition gets that wacky, funny, or cool.

3rd edition just isn't fun. It lost all the quirky flavor from 1st and 2nd edition and replaced it with bland uniform material which is simplified and fast-tracked for the 12 year old power gamer. It has no personality; it's like McD&D or something.
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Charon
post Apr 16 2005, 07:42 PM
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Ah, sweet nostalgia. Makes every memory better.

There's still a lot of people with fond memory of D&D 1st edition. Not 1/1000th of these people still play, but they have fond memories.
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blakkie
post Apr 16 2005, 07:44 PM
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QUOTE (Charon)
What's "machocitism" or being "machocistic" anyway?

In a thread about switching, you'd think people could spell "masochism" correctly. ;)

LOL, nitpicking spelling in conversation text. The last refuge of the lost. ;)
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