 Are you switching?, Simply, will you convert from SR3 to 4? |
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 Apr 17 2005, 03:37 PM
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#51
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Prime Runner  Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51  |
For non-traditional fantasy, my group also had a lot of fun playing The Burning Wheel last year. I certainly want to give Burning Wheel some more playtime soon.
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Apr 17 2005, 03:46 PM
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#52
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Target Group: Members Posts: 80 Joined: 3-May 04 Member No.: 6,299 |
I don't know yet. I'll buy the SR4 book, read it, and run a few games. If I like it and my players like it, I really don't see any reason I wouldnt switch. If not, we'll just keep with 3ed.
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Apr 17 2005, 05:21 PM
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#53
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Target Group: Members Posts: 85 Joined: 24-September 02 From: Centerville, UT Member No.: 3,307 |
There's no point in having this poll yet. When the book is out and people can read it and make an informed decision, then it would be interesting to see if people want to switch over or not.
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Apr 17 2005, 05:34 PM
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#54
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
Yes there is a point. Cable wanted to rant some, you somehow missed the red angry face next to his post? :P I'm guessing a big factor in the speed at which current SR3 players convert to SR4 will depend on how much of the "extra" rules for SR4 are in the BBB, and how much gets put off to the companions books. The real surprise is how many people voted they weren't going to switch but were here. Unless a lot of them are waiting for the Matrix rules and want to try retrofit them into SR3. |
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Apr 17 2005, 06:04 PM
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#55
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Resident Legionnaire Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,136 Joined: 8-August 04 From: Usually Work Member No.: 6,550 |
Yes, Synner, I realize that. I'm not expecting everything from every book to be in there. More akin to what glyph already said. edit: What would really piss me off is if my books fall apart within 2 months of me getting them. |
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Apr 17 2005, 06:46 PM
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#56
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
i'm hoping the main book will have all of the 'basics' in it: some cyberware, some bioware, some nanite stuff, maybe even some geneware. later books would simply add more gear to the lists, rather than expanding the types of gear available.
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 Apr 17 2005, 07:49 PM
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#57
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,095 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle Wa, USA Member No.: 1,139 |
I played first, then second, moved to third and I plan on going to fouth. Ive owned at one point every rpg book except third hard back and I even have some issues of ?shadowfiles? or whatever the name of the mag was. I really didnt like 3rd edition and stoped playing shadowrun a couple years ago because it seamed to add rules for the sake of adding rules. With all the holes in 2nd I still liked it better. Now I use Mutants and Masterminds or the latest revision of the Storyteller system for about everything. SR4 looks like a simplification from what I have read so far. Hopefully it will turn out that way and bring back my love for the game.
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Apr 17 2005, 07:55 PM
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#58
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
I'm hoping they manage to keep the total of the companion crunch books to two. That Street Magic is already popping up doesn't bode well for that. But if they could combine all the 'ware, gear, and firearms into one, and have the BBB complete enough to avoid the usage for Shadowrun Companion (which would be a book full of "rules creep" looking to happen). |
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Apr 17 2005, 08:01 PM
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#59
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Resident Legionnaire Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,136 Joined: 8-August 04 From: Usually Work Member No.: 6,550 |
Exactly. |
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Apr 17 2005, 08:45 PM
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#60
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
BTW that would mean all the matrix (and electronic warfare) rules go into the BBB, and any relavent gear beyond solid basics moves from Rigger & Matrix books to the BBG&G (big book of gagets & guns). I could even live with them splitting the BBG&G into a 'ware & firearms and a second for all things hacking, as long as it's gear and not lots of rules. As per mfb's post. The Shadowrun Companion could still exist, but as a book of out there things. Like the weird PC species (but that all use PC creation rules and such laid out in the BBB), and lots more "life in the 70's" background fluff, and Johnson's Little Black Book type info, maybe some basic threats. What would also be great is if they moved a lot of spirit stats, all the dragon stats (in SR3 dragons might as well have been statless till MitS anyway) and also included other magical threats, etc. into Street Magic. They would again all use the rules structure laid out in the BBB. |
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Apr 17 2005, 10:17 PM
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#61
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
The point they're trying to make is, if there's no room for both Smartlink and Smartlink-II in the core rulebook, leave out the Smartlink and just go with Smartlink-II, priced as the default standard for smartlinks. The setting is supposed to be 2070, not 2050. The baseline standard tech that's in the SR4 core rulebook shouldn't be the same stuff that we've seen since SR1, some of the advanced versions of that tech that we've seen in the splat books should have become the new baseline standard, and SR4's splatbooks should have versions that are advancements over and above that. (Coming in SR4's Street Chrome supplement: the new Smartlink-III, which in addition to all the advanced ballistics available with Smartlink-II, can be set up to send out an Instant Message through the wireless matrix, routed through multiple blind IM remailers, to whoever you just shot. Now you can taunt your victims just as easily as your great-grandfather did when he was playing First Person Shooters around the turn of the century!) Would it be power-creep? Perhaps, but back in SR1, your deckers were never more than a fiberoptic cable length's away from their jackpoint, and certainly weren't "mobile digital wizards". Power creep is bound to happen in any tech-heavy near-future setting with an advancing timeline, all that's being asked for is that it's applied across the board to all segments of technology. |
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Apr 18 2005, 12:34 AM
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#62
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 775 Joined: 31-March 05 From: florida Member No.: 7,273 |
i'm gonna continue to wait and see, but as things look so far it looks like the only good thing to come out of this will be that its easier to play as live action at cons
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Apr 18 2005, 12:38 AM
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#63
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
Only if they cheapen up the prices on non-obvious cyberlimbs. :cyber: P.S. This is the second time I heard this. Is it suppose to be a jab based on nWOD also using fixed TNs, albeit with d10s? |
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Apr 18 2005, 03:03 PM
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#64
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Target Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: 5-April 05 Member No.: 7,292 |
Apparently, i'm going at least to try it (since my usual game master, regularly posting on this forum, has said that he will make the move). I'll base my opinion after a couple of games....
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Apr 18 2005, 04:31 PM
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#65
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Incertum est quo loco te mors expectet; Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,548 Joined: 24-October 03 From: DeeCee, U.S. Member No.: 5,760 |
*sigh* We'll see. Right now, I'm just hoping the advertising and FAQ campaign is so bad because they're dedicating all their brain power towards actually writing the game. So I've decided I'm going to blindfold myself and see how the reviews are come September (give DSF a month to cool off and become semi-rational again) before I decide.
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Apr 18 2005, 04:39 PM
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#66
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 368 Joined: 11-December 04 From: Michigan Member No.: 6,879 |
Im gonna ahve to say no for the same reason the dude that posted this is. THIS IS A SCAM. they are out for our cash adn rather then develope and perfect a awsome system they are going to throw it to the side of the road and "dumb" it down as i noticed they said " make it easier and more streamline" in the FAQ. They DESTROYED D&D with this crap by taking a good system (2nd edition) and murdering it so any 2 year old moron could play 3rd editiona nd buy all thier neat but overall STUPID books.
I believe with this edition that from what i ahve seen thus far they are out for the "rebuy" our books and are "dumbing" it down so more peopel can understand.... why? why? Its a easy system as it is in fact its the ONLY role playing system where in 1 night of playing you can get a good idea of almost everything in the game. From all the FAQ posts all i hear is "taking this outand this and this and this" Not a well we are improving this this and this. Are there some thigns they need to imrove in R3... yeah.... overall ask yourself does it need a full new edittion for any other reason then so u can fork out 40 bucks a book? They are ripping it apart to put it back together... and god i only hope they know what they are doing cause if not this will flop and SR dies just like DnD has. |
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Apr 18 2005, 05:04 PM
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#67
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 120 Joined: 26-February 02 From: UK Member No.: 1,873 |
Well, here's my 2 cents worth.
I won't be making the switch. I spent tons of cash buying up the books I needed for Shadowrun 2nd Ed. Then we changed to 3rd Ed. So I spent tons of cash buying up the books I wanted for 3rd Ed. I have finally gotten myself into a place where I have the books I want. Now 4th Ed is coming, and by the looks of the system changes, there isn't going to be too much common ground with the 3rd Ed books. I simply can't justify spending all that money all over again. :( |
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Apr 18 2005, 05:06 PM
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#68
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Target Group: Members Posts: 81 Joined: 12-April 02 From: the shadows.... Member No.: 2,548 |
Yes indeed... Oh, and don't look now, but I think the sky is falling too... |
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Apr 18 2005, 05:17 PM
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#69
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Man In The Machine Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,264 Joined: 26-February 02 From: I-495 S Member No.: 1,105 |
I know what THAC0 is. I also know that its a 0 and not an O. Going to 3rd edition was a change for the better. Its much slicker, less invasive, and generally a much faster and less math based mechanical system. I just hate that they killed so many settings. I want Planescape back.
I will get a copy of SR4 before I make any judgements. I will of course have to know 4th edition well enough to run Con games, so Im just going to hold my judgements. I dont feel this is a money grab, and there had been some speculation about Sr4 for a while now. 3rd edition has had a great 8 year run. Lets see what the new run brings. |
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Apr 18 2005, 05:35 PM
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#70
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,011 Joined: 15-February 05 From: Montréal, QC, Canada Member No.: 7,087 |
DnD has died?! OMG! Nooooo... When did this happen? When you stopped playing it? Then please don't stop playing SR, please! |
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Apr 18 2005, 07:33 PM
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#71
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 775 Joined: 31-March 05 From: florida Member No.: 7,273 |
no blackie its not, i'm just noting the simularities to WoD and that the similarities make it a more viable option for LARP than any previous incarnation |
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Apr 18 2005, 07:41 PM
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#72
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
How so, the possibility that might only need to carry around 2 or 3 rules books rather 4 or 5? Or that you'll only need to learn 1 game system's worth of mechanics rather that 3 1/2 worth? I don't LARP, for safety reasons. :wobble: Seriously i'm curious what changes you are talking about. |
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Apr 18 2005, 08:44 PM
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#73
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 511 Joined: 19-August 02 Member No.: 3,139 |
You really don't believe that this will be the case, do you? Sr will start out with just the one, yeah. But then comes Magic, then Guns, then rigger, then Matrix, etc and your back where we are now. And what if they do do a PhysAd book - there's another. Then Hey, Let's break Shamanism and Hermetic into thier own books... (Sounds like WOD. I know, SR has never done this in the past, but if it were to become as wildly popular as D&D or WOd don't you think Fanpro would take advantage of that? And publish As moany books as they could? The WuJen book, the Otaku book, The cultof the Dragon...On and On.) And yeah you don't have to buy those books, but then you don't need them now, do you? Unless you want the full Package. All the good stuff. This time next year there will still be the 4 or 5 'core books' again. With old stuf, new stuf all mixed in. Yummy. |
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Apr 18 2005, 08:54 PM
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#74
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
But you'll only need 2 or 3 for -your- character. My hope is that the rest of the world is abstracted away so you don't need to cross reference your character's relavent entries in Street Magic to Big Freakin' Guns In The Shadows, Matrix Redux IV, and Rigs: Not Just For Heroin Anymore.
EDIT: And the ideal would be that a good character sheet would reduce it down to just the BBB. |
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Apr 18 2005, 09:02 PM
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#75
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 468 Joined: 17-March 05 Member No.: 7,185 |
Hopefully the system is changed or refined enough that instead of needing to have smartlink I and smartlink II rules they can just give a single entry and just use used cyberware rules to accomodate those people who never upgraded.
Overall I think if the cyberware is currently of limited value in most people's games it should be either removed or significantly modified to take advantage of the new system. Cyberware that directly impacts the values of attributes unless some rule is established that skill rolls use the unaugmented attribute value should be increased in cost to reflect the greater value that attributes will have in the new system. |
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