 Shadows of Asia, My review of this product. |
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 Aug 30 2005, 10:52 PM
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Neophyte Runner  Group: Members Posts: 2,001 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Michigan Member No.: 1,514  |
My review of Shadows of Asia is what follows. Spoilers abound. You were warned. I will be cross posting this pretty much everywhere.
Synopsis:Overall I really liked this book. It's been a long time in the making, and it was nice to see it. Uncle Jospeh bought this book for me, and I was pretty happy to get it. I like the Shadows of format, and I realize it's a trade off. Get more in, but each place has less space versus the Seattle Sourcebook style, where in depth coverage of one area is spotlighted. I wouldn't mind some in depth coverage of a few areas in asia, and other spots, but I realize they have to sell books in order to write them, The Very Good. My overall favorite thing from this book was that it definitively reconnected the fourth world and the sixth. I have always loved this connection and hated when they stepped away from it. I understood peoples frustrations with Harlequin style characters, but disagreed that they should have been completely written out. One of the best things Shadowrun has ever had going for it was it's interconnectivitiy. It's connection to our world as it is, and it's depth. Shadows of Asia strikes the perfect balance of this, in my opinion. There was just enough teasers to get you interested in asking questions and doing some leg work on your own. That to me is perfect. Just enough of a hint to make it mysterious.Tasteful and playful, but interesting. I applaud this the loudest. A close second for me personally is something I have always liked. I love seeing people I know make appearences in books. Ancient History, Raygun, Flak, Demonseed elite, DV8, and more. I think that is the ultimate nod to the fans. It makes the people at Shadowrun look very fan orientated, which I believe is what they really are. What other game can you find your name as a part of the mythos? As a part of the world? Sure it's a silly thing, and a small thing, but it matters to me. So I was pleasantly surprised and happy to see Miss tja make her appearence in SoA. (I need to get the books I am missing now to see if anyone else made appearences that I missed! Damn divorce!) So imagine just how tickled pink I was when I saw my name in SoA! Holy Crap I am in a book! This is just the sort of gigglely silly thing that makes me love the people at Shadowrun. Somebody is going to get a drink on me someday! ( I think it's Jong, but I don't know that for sure.) The Good. These are in no particular order, just my notes as I wrote them down. Social adepts. This was something that I recall beingkicked around by me and some people at DSf a while back. It was good to see that they are starting to permeate into the writing. I heard they made a appearence in SOTA 2064, so I need to get that. But it was a great to see mention of them in the Russia section. Speaking of Russia, I have to say that between that and India, and the Korea section I am having a hard time picking my favorite section. Those three spoke the most to me, but all of the sections were pretty good. The art. SoA has some of the best art I've seen in a long time. The piece on page 123, in the Russia section is just Wow. I mean really good art. The art people outdid themselves. My congratulations on a good product! I liked seeing the Organized Crime expanding beyond the big three (four I guess), and was pretty impressed with how organized the overall approach to this area. It must have been hard to keep track of it all, but they pulled it off. One thing I didn't see though was mention of Indian Tongs. I thought the Neo-Asia, and Eastren Spirituality part did a pretty decent job of setting the stage, and was a great lead up to the rest of the book. At 227 pages I certainly got a lot of information. In fact i was pleasantly surprised to see Micronesia, the Stans, and Russia. I didn't expect them to be included in this compilation. I had excpected Japan, China and Southeast Asia. So that was nice. Overall the appearence of the book is very nice, and it is well organized. I am alreayd setting about using it. The Not So Good. I don't mean any of this to be a personal attack, or to say that these are the end all end all of opinion. This is just what little that didn't set well with me. Anime/Manga/Mecha references: Two and a half pages of Technofets? I can deal with the reoccuring Godzilla and Monster Island jokes with good humor, but look we all know that the Japanese like anime.We know the fads, like in any entertainment medium, come and go. And we all know they like Manga, and yes some of us have even seen Tetsuo, but really was this necassary? In my opinion we just blew two pages on this when I could have been learning about much cooler thinsg in Japan. I get that these damn furry mecha loving technofets buy books, and sure you have to give them two pages here and there, but damn it can't it be online? Let them download it! On the good side, pretty much those two pages were it. The reoccuring Godzilla jokes aside, and some Akira based names for gangs in one spot, the restof the book took itself a little more serious than this. Thankfully. Metahumans. This isn't necassarily abad thing, but more of a spot I seem to disagree with the powers that be. (Seem maybe the operative word.) Did anyone else think the number of Metahumans seemed pretty low? I mean Orks alone breed ain what? 20 year cycles? Am I just not giving death by various methods enough credit? I think shadowrun overall seems to project a low growth rate for the world. I mean I understand why places like Japan or the Middle East will ahve low rates, but even in India where the Caste system puts everyone but dwarves down a rung, population growth would be hard to check. Sure it'd be a seething mass of metahuman poor, but that seems in line with the dystopian world of Shadowrun. South East Asia. was anyone else just confused by this section? I had a really hard time following it. I know it was supposed to convey the confusion and mayhem of the land, but I think it was a little better at that then it wanted to be. Maybe it was the way it was organized, or maybe the way it ended up looking in print, but I had to read this section three times in order to follow it. Clear up until the Phillipines I was having a hell of a time keeping track of this section and following it. It is not that the content was bad. Just the way it ended up looking, and reading in the book was hard. Questions and Comments ala Paul. There is so much in this book. I mean a ton of things. So much that I will miss some. I'm bound too. This is just what I wrote down on my notes at work. I took the book to prison with me, and read it over the last two nights. Japan related: Who was the first Mega? I was so disappointed we didn't get to know whichif the Japanese Mega's came first. I know that's a hard thing to write in, and requires a lot of fact checking and etc...But man I wanted it! Still learning more about the evolution of the Japanese megas was cool. Tibet! My vote is don't open it up! I love the mystery of it. I love the idea of keeping it one of the many secrets int he world. One of the unexplored countries! Okay what is the joke about the spirits who work for odl reruns about? Anyone know? 0110001? Clutch reference or am I silly? Was Cynical Paul a nod to me? I'm pretending it was regardless, and loving it!!!!!!!! Obsidamen! Where the rock meets the sky! Lake Bayaka! Oh baby am I happy. Perfect fourth world teaser. Verjigorm? Wild Child? tell me I got that right? So there you have it. Buy this book. It's worth it. Well worth it. This product fullfills and exceeds my expectations. I thank everyone involved in getting out to my grubby greedy paws! |
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Aug 31 2005, 12:48 AM
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Shooting Target Group: Validating Posts: 1,618 Joined: 29-January 03 From: Montevideo, Uruguay. Member No.: 3,992 |
I know from... uh... personal experience that SotA64 has quite a few of them. ;)
I'm planning to visit GenCon in a couple years, so I hope you remember your promise. :P
Yes, SotA 2064 has a good deal on social adepts. I'm also happy to see them in SR3 and SR4.
Wow, thanks. What was it that sold you on Korea and what do you think could have been better? I'm always open to constructive criticism.
Yeah, you're right. This is one of the prettiest looking books in Shadowrun. If only FanPro could have hired Katsuhiro Otomo to do the cover... (I know I'm daydreaming of course)
Shiawase. This has been part of SR canon since the very beginning (though I think it was Corporate Download that finally set upon stone that it was the very first).
Uhm, where?
If you don't mind spreading the word, submitting a few reviews here and there (say, RPG.net) wouldn't hurt at all. :) Oh, and glad you liked it. :D |
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Aug 31 2005, 01:01 AM
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King of the Hobos Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,117 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 127 |
Ignore this. Nothing to see here, move along people. :)
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Aug 31 2005, 02:12 AM
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#4
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 276 Joined: 6-August 02 From: Kiel, Germany Member No.: 3,071 |
On a brief note:
Which one is correct for the ruble? The book states: 1 RUB = 0.33 Y (3 Y = 1 RUB) one of which is obviously wrong :-) |
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Aug 31 2005, 02:25 AM
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Running, running, running Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,220 Joined: 18-October 04 From: North Carolina Member No.: 6,769 |
well, considering i think currently the rub is less than the US dollar, i would think 3 rub=1 :nuyen: is probably the accurate way
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Aug 31 2005, 02:57 AM
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 265 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bangkok (sometimes Paris) Member No.: 332 |
I wrote the Indochina part of this section. I'm aware that the final draft ended up being a bit of a patchwork, because there were so many nations to cover in so little space (and I exceeded my intitial allowed wordcount of 5000 word by about 2000 more words...). I also wrote the part on the Indochinese urban centers to be at the end of the Indochina section. I don't know why this part was moved near the beginning. It's detrimental because it was written to expand on the info provided in each nation's writeup, not the other way around. Anyway, I'd appreciate if you could be more specific about what you didn't like. Please bear with me: this is the very first review that includes comments on SEA, and it's a bit negative, so I'd like to know what I did wrong, especially because this is THE piece of SR work I really wanted to do justice (even more than France). Thanks for your help. Mike |
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Aug 31 2005, 03:17 AM
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 276 Joined: 6-August 02 From: Kiel, Germany Member No.: 3,071 |
The Despoiler is Vestrivan? Region and Name seems ok...
Feng Xiansheng ??? a geomancer? lung? ryumyo? and who is sunset blossom? the spirit of yakut? |
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Aug 31 2005, 11:02 AM
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,001 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Michigan Member No.: 1,514 |
I think for me, this was it. This was what made it feel choppey. Disjointed. Just as I started to settle in Laos or Vietnam, Bham! Next country. Let me be clear, I don't thin the quality of the writing was poor, or bad or anything like that. Just that how it ended up being published made it hard to track for me.
I agree. I think they would have meshed better.
I hope this clarifies what caught my attention. For a first piece let me compliment you. It's pretty vast swath of SE asia you tackled. It was cohesive and consistent with the restof the work as a whole. I just think space constraints did you the least justice man.
We'll have to time this out. I need to get to a Gen Con. Now that my divorce is almost over, I can start saving for it :)
I've been to Korea. Spent a few months there, and some more in Japan. I could picture Korea evolving damn near exactly like you wrote. I also liked the voice of the poster who "wrote up" Korea. She drew me in pretty nicely. I could picture her. I could see her. I also liked the Bug references. I have a thing for the Invae.
The post by Shanghai Sue on page 35, just above the Shaanxi section.
I'll have to llook up RPG.net, but I hit animalball, Underworld, Live Jounral and here. |
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Aug 31 2005, 02:10 PM
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Shooting Target Group: Validating Posts: 1,618 Joined: 29-January 03 From: Montevideo, Uruguay. Member No.: 3,992 |
Well, you have at least two years. It's bloody expensive from here. :nuyen: :nuyen: :nuyen:
She's the decker in the chapter's full-page illustration, by the way. The artist did a great job with the art guidelines.
Me too. Just you wait for a certain, very delayed book. :vegm:
Cool. :) |
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Aug 31 2005, 06:37 PM
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#10
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,759 Joined: 11-December 02 From: France Member No.: 3,723 |
I'm not sure I understand your question. If it's about which one of MCT, Renraku, Shiawase and Yamatetsu is the older, it has been answered by flipping a few pages of Corporate Download. Yamatetsu was founded in 2041, Renraku in 2029. No date is given for MCT and facts are a bit contradictory. It's said it was a founding member of the Inter-Corporate Council in 2013, but also founded by Taiga Mitsuhama, who's seventy by 2061, and thus was only in his twenties at that time. Anyway, Shiawase i said to have been founded during Post-WW2 reconstruction of Japan (first precise reference being 1989, older than any of the other megas). If it's about which one gained extraterritorial privileges first, again, it's Shiawase who takes the prize, as it has been explained in several books. If you extend the search to all Japanese corporations appearing in SR, then Yokogawa descends from an electrical research lab founded in 1915 ; Daiatsu is more or less related to Daihatsu, founded in 1907 ; and Komatsu began in 1921 as a subsidiary of Takeuchi Mining Industry, founded in 1894. But even me fail to see the interest of this. |
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Aug 31 2005, 09:53 PM
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#11
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,001 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Michigan Member No.: 1,514 |
Good enough answer.
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Aug 31 2005, 11:44 PM
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#12
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
My gaming group and I were reading SoAsia yesterday... and we were impressed that you managed to cram so much information, but some of them think that the writers dropped the ball when they wrote the chapter for Southeast Asia (particularly since we live here!).
Indonesia fracturing into many different "kingdoms", good. Kicked the Sultan of Brunei(one of the richest guys in the world) from his home, ok (if you keep telling yourself - suspension of disbelief, you can swallow it, don't forget the "secret" defense alliance between Singapore and Brunei). Malaysia and Singapore, believable (especially since it seems that the writers simply copied and pasted the contemporary history of Malaysia and Singapore into the book after altering a few names and dates). Overall rating for the chapter: 6/10 |
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Sep 1 2005, 12:50 AM
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#13
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,001 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Michigan Member No.: 1,514 |
I can see where they got the basis for running the Sultan out though. How many times have you seen a rich powerful enemy defeated by a smaller, more determined prepared to lose their asses force?
Maybe the Sultan just wasn't prepared to drop the money it took to fight. Or maybe the current Sultan lacks the nuts to put a real fight up. Or maybe he was caught off guard. Magic is supposed to be the great leveler, right? I am not saying you're completely off base with your asessment, I am however suggesting that you consider the situation completely. |
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Sep 1 2005, 02:07 AM
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#14
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
Dude... Currently people in Brunei... DO NOT PAY TAXES! Everyone wants a piece of that paradise. :P
And IRL, the Brunei Sultan is a close personal friend of the Lees. You should see how fast the Brunei royalty relocated to Singapore during the SARS outbreak(even though Singapore had SARS cases and Brunei did not!) and every crisis that hits the region. We were not so much surprise that the Sultan had to evac but that he chose to evac to (of-all-places) Sumatra! And he had the cash and the balls to fend of the Javanese army on Sumatra but not retake his own kingdom back(take a good look at the map, Brunei is WAY smaller than Sumatra). But ok, it is canon now and as Mr Canon, I MUST swallow it! :D It would have been much better if they had asked a native of the area to write it up like they did for SOE. |
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Sep 1 2005, 02:20 AM
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#15
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Shooting Target Group: Validating Posts: 1,618 Joined: 29-January 03 From: Montevideo, Uruguay. Member No.: 3,992 |
Yeah, because a lot of East Timoreans play Shadowrun. ;)
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Sep 1 2005, 02:34 AM
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
No, but (my gang and)I do. And I surf here nearly everyday too.
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Sep 1 2005, 03:20 AM
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King of the Hobos Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,117 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 127 |
Depends on when he got kicked out. If it's any time after the recognised Awakening and magic is a fact of life, I figure one of the richest men in the world would be willing to drop what to him is small change to either train up locals and also darft in outside contractors. We've got a battalion of Gurkhas stationed there, funded by the Sultan, since the British Army does a lot of its jungle warfar training there and have strong ties since supporting the Sultanate during Sukarno's attempted little empire building exercise in the 60's. So I'm a bit unconvinced by it unless we're falling back on the old native magic beats imposible odds and westernised forces schtick. Even if the oil ran out, which isn't happening any time soon IIRC, they've been plowing the revenues back into the country to try and build up the economy and move it away from oil dependency so having the economy shut down as an excuse is iffy as well IMHO. |
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Sep 1 2005, 04:05 AM
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 265 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Bangkok (sometimes Paris) Member No.: 332 |
Well, in most instance, that's what happened. As JWK already said, there was a native or someone who had good knowledge of the area helping with the writing (when they didn't do the writing themselves). In the case of Indonesia, it appears there was no native to help. The closest thing was me, who live in Bangkok and admitedly only have a general understanding of the Indonesian Archipelago. Believe me though, it could have ended up worse than that. Anyway, your comments and notation (6/10) seem to relate only to the South of SEAsia (Malaysia and below). What about Indochina? Mike |
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Sep 1 2005, 04:36 AM
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
I don't live there, Mike. So I'm not in any position to judge. But my brother's girlfriend is Vietnamese, and she gives a 6-7/10 for Indochina.
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Sep 2 2005, 11:07 PM
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#20
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,314 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Lisbon, Cidade do Pecado Member No.: 185 |
*bump* With all the fuss about SR4 and System Failure this is getting buried. So anybody else out there read the book? Comments and reviews? Is the artwork as cool as I've heard?
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Sep 3 2005, 12:18 AM
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#21
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Great, I'm a Dragon... Group: Retired Admins Posts: 6,699 Joined: 8-October 03 From: North Germany Member No.: 5,698 |
I read 2/3 of it so far. Nice Artwork, yes, though i don't like the pics in the middle east-chapter (guess it's larry mcdougall).
It's well written and has a lot of useful information in it. Escpecially the chapter about Russia is very good and gave me a lot of insight into this huge country. |
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Sep 3 2005, 12:19 AM
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#22
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 276 Joined: 6-August 02 From: Kiel, Germany Member No.: 3,071 |
Quick Comment: One of the best books pubished till now...
Only thing I dislike was the AMiddle East chapter... Dunno why, but it was boring... I think each one of the last books publuished was better than the one before... So really good job ;-) |
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Sep 3 2005, 06:09 AM
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#23
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Uncle Fisty Group: Admin Posts: 13,891 Joined: 3-January 05 From: Next To Her Member No.: 6,928 |
I get mine in next Friday, as my FLGS has ordered it, and things always deliver slow there. It exists in this strange vacuuam of time/space where shipping always takes 4+ days more. So until then..... Swordfish Mustardball!? BTW<,my wife came home tongiht saying that SoA was supposed to have some sort of reference to obsidimen, which is a big deal since I introduced her to Earthdawn about a month ago (Worry when the one you love plays a convincing nethermancer.... I do...worry that is). Some verify/dispute? |
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Sep 3 2005, 07:16 AM
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#24
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Great, I'm a Dragon... Group: Retired Admins Posts: 6,699 Joined: 8-October 03 From: North Germany Member No.: 5,698 |
I read something about Stonemen, that's right. But is was said in the shadowtalk that it's just a version of the stoneskin-spell.
There are some more hints to ED scattered all over the book. |
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Sep 3 2005, 11:45 AM
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#25
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The King In Yellow Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,922 Joined: 26-February 05 From: JWD Member No.: 7,121 |
Art? Yeah, it's quite cool. Some I don't like much, but overall, all the artists I love are in there and featured with great art at that. :) I've got it and am reading through it. India will get special attention by me (as I am very interested in that country in general), I'll show Japan to a friend though (who's with a Japanese and thus knows by far more about the coutnry than I do). Hello, ZenZen, I liked that Squid! More details wghen I'm finished reading. Oh, and I haven't forgotten about LA either, just haven't had much time to compile something sensible. :) |
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Lo-Fi Version | Time is now: 6th November 2025 - 01:42 PM |
Topps, Inc has sole ownership of the names, logo, artwork, marks, photographs, sounds, audio, video and/or any proprietary material used in connection with the game Shadowrun. Topps, Inc has granted permission to the Dumpshock Forums to use such names, logos, artwork, marks and/or any proprietary materials for promotional and informational purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not affiliated with the Dumpshock Forums in any official capacity whatsoever.