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xizor
Screamer grenades

grenades that contain a very powerfull speaker which blasts noise at a harmfull levels, incapacitating people and animals alike. as a side effect, these grenades make ultrasound unusable in the imediate vicinity.
notes:
- can only be standard grenades, NOT arodynamic or micro.
- can remain on for about 3 minutes before running out of power.
stats:
DAMAGE: treat as chemical attack with a power of 6, resisted by body + protective equipment or spells. if the targets willpower is less than the modified power of the grenade the target must move away from the grenade in thier next availible action.

BLAST: 15m (screws with ultrasound out to 60m)
AVAILABILITY: 6R
cost: 300

more of those neat bracer weapons (pistol, dart, crossbow, grapple and grenade launcher)

And while I'm on the topic of gear, has anyone else noticed that:
Monowire = Microwire (a little less leathal, and a lot cheaper.)
Geekkake
QUOTE (xizor)
Screamer grenades

grenades that contain a very powerfull speaker which blasts noise at a harmfull levels, incapacitating people and animals alike. as a side effect, these grenades make ultrasound unusable in the imediate vicinity.
notes:
- can only be standard grenades, NOT arodynamic or micro.
- can remain on for about 3 minutes before running out of power.
stats:
DAMAGE: treat as chemical attack with a power of 6, resisted by body + protective equipment or spells. if the targets willpower is less than the modified power of the grenade the target must move away from the grenade in thier next availible action.

BLAST: 15m (screws with ultrasound out to 60m)
AVAILABILITY: 6R
cost: 300

more of those neat bracer weapons (pistol, dart, crossbow, grapple and grenade launcher)

And while I'm on the topic of gear, has anyone else noticed that:
Monowire = Microwire (a little less leathal, and a lot cheaper.)

Y'know, I had a similar idea a couple weeks ago for something like the sonic grenades. I was trying to research decibel levels and frequency prior to turning them into SR weapons. There's also the possibility of "brown noise" grenades, a sonic frequency (inaudicble) that, at a certain decibel level, causes folks to shit their pants.

Imagine that tactical possibility of that.

I've also heard that a constant exposure to a (once again, inaudible) frequency of 5 hertz will drive people to anger and violence. Tactically interesting.
Oracle
From personal experience I can tell that the effects of infrasonic frequencys are being overerstimated.
Voran
The idea isn't full cooked yet, but I was thinking of something like "smartclothes"

The basic suit would be a combat jumpsuit kinda thing, leather looking, since leather look seems back in style with the SR4 pics. It would have 'smartfabric' that could change color and also adjust its permability to be a breathing fabric, but shift to near chemsuit protection as necessary. I was thinking of some sorta fancy almost gill like layering on the torso that was almost unnoticable but also allowed you to regulate heat of wearing the suit (it would kinda 'breathe' for you). In addition to the usual strategic armor plating, gel packs and the like, it's memory fabric could also alter its outline, allowing the wearing to (well...runners) to break up their profile so they could quickly disguise their profiles when they jump into the crowded walkways.

It;d have those muscle stimulators from the hunters armor in cannon companion to help runners who had to remain still for long periods of time too.

It's gloves would attach to the combat suit and also allow skin link smartlink kinda stuff through them.

I figure since SR4 has made 'memory' pretty damn unlimited, and powerpacks pretty much so too (remember when ruthenium suits drained packs?) that combine that with nanofriggindisguise, you could have clothes that did that.

Be expensive, but worth the investment.
Nasrudith
Stunning Spell Licenses.
It seems screwy that the government allows you to have assult weapons with a license but not a simple stun spell thanks to the F rating for combat formulas and instructors. (Not sure if it was this way in SR 3 and other games, I'm new to shadowrun and lack past information books.
ronin3338
QUOTE (Geekkake)
There's also the possibility of "brown noise" grenades, a sonic frequency (inaudicble) that, at a certain decibel level, causes folks to shit their pants.

I've also heard that a constant exposure to a (once again, inaudible) frequency of 5 hertz will drive people to anger and violence. Tactically interesting.

Heh wink.gif Watch Mythbusters. The "brown noise" seems to be a myth.


The noise as an irritant is more plausible, but I think it requires longer periods of exposure...
evilgenius
What about a "SR4" adaptation of tech that's just around the corner?

The US Army is experimenting with the Future Land Warrior (or whatever they call it). Anyways, what about;

Drone guns as personal weapons?

Imagine a SMG sized weapon that held an machine pistol in it, with a self correcting robotic system in the housing? With a smartlink and a laser eye designator, you could just LOOK at your target, and then then point the weapon in the general direction of your target - the self correcting system that houses the chamber, feeding mechanism and the barrell would move within the larger chassis and automatically track your point of aim (designated by your cybereyes) accurately.

They can do this with goggles and pintle mounts today (check out the chain gun system on the Apache helicopter, used since the late '1980s). Why not in a sidearm?

I would allow a total replacement of the user's firearms skill with a "drone skill", but with the user's agility (you still have to point it in the general direction). It would guess it would take a single simple action to point it at the target, but the weapon can take it's own two simple actions to shoot twice in one init pass per round (or it could take a complex action and go full auto).

The advantage is that you don't need firearms skill so to speak, and it could take a complex action whereas you only use a simple one. The disadvantage would be that it's a smaller weapon in a larger chassis, and it can take only one init pass per turn...

thoughts?
ronin3338
QUOTE (evilgenius)
Imagine a SMG sized weapon that held an machine pistol in it, with a self correcting robotic system in the housing? With a smartlink and a laser eye designator, you could just LOOK at your target, and then then point the weapon in the general direction of your target - the self correcting system that houses the chamber, feeding mechanism and the barrell would move within the larger chassis and automatically track your point of aim (designated by your cybereyes) accurately.


Why point? Just mount it on your shoulder, Predator style

Definitely feasible with SR tech.
evilgenius
Ooooooh, I had a nasty idea.

BTL chips with hidden personafix sub-routines or somethin. They are essentially moodchips (page 250 in the BBB) with RAS override. So, these things have a passive sensor in them, and when they recieve a coded signal, the BTL addict suddenly gets "personafixed" into whatever the designer wanted.

Imagine what a useful security system for a BTL dealing gang. When half the neigbourhood is on your chips, that's a lot of "mooks" you can throw at people when you turn their personafix chips on and make 'em all think they're loyal gangers.

Great for suicide bombers, great for any sort of kamikaze troopers.

Better yet, regular (legal) simsense chips progs that have this algorithm implanted, just waiting for the signal to send the user berzerk. Or, to make the user think he/she's a Buddhist Monk who must give away all their worldly posessions to the person who approaches them - including all the nuyen.gif in their commlink.

Wonderfully wicked stuff!

I think I'm gonna make an NPC who's speciality is making these things and then distributing them...
vegm.gif
TBRMInsanity
I would use a flash bang. They would be cheaper and more effective. Flashbangs bring you to the point where your almost permanently deaf and the flash disorients you for around 10-20 secs. Best part it is very localized so it is great for room clearing.
Big D
AV grenade (intended mostly for minis).
12P, -2/-4 (don't ask for the full -6--that's just wrong), -4/m, 12F, call it 55-75Y each.

Thermobaric grenade
10S(should it be P?), -2, -1/m, 16F, 80-90Y each.
Special: Only in "chunky salsa" attacks, the attack remains at full strength until it reaches maximum blast distance, which is calculated normally. Even if the damage is S, used indoors, it is generally fatal to everybody. For extra fun, throw one in an open car window and run... fast.

EMP grenade
10S(e)*, --, -2/m, 24F, 500Y each.
Special: Attacks all electronics, as per electrical attack. Does not affect meat. Do *not* get caught with one of these.

Laser taser
8S(e), -half, SA, --, 30©, 20R, 4000Y
Based on a current concept (hotly debated as to whether it works) that uses femtosecond laser pulses to ionize a channel in the air through which lightning bolts can be sent. Clip is a rechargeable (1/turn) battery, rating/price are based on new technology that is not yet available to the public. It's not illegal, per se, but you don't want to get caught with one. This AR-sized weapon uses SMG ranges. The laser pulses are invisible, but the lightning bolts leave a faint afterimage pointing back to the shooter on a successful Perception test.

I'd try to wing it with lasers or grenade machine guns, but I suspect official ones are already planned. It'll be interesting to see what DV/ranges are.
Nikoli
Smart launchers, given a pilot rating, it feeds in from your smartgun camera feed and determines what sort of person you are gunning for, then discreetly targets large groups with mission appropriate grenades, or for a more controlled approach, you simply use your currently linked weapon to choose target areas and through your link have it adjust and fire.

Think along the lines of somewhere betwixt a grenade launcher and a mortar launcher. Bigger oomph available, but not so big you're a threat to your own folks.
nick012000
Big D: Tasers like that were around in the previous edition, if memory serves.
Rotbart van Dainig
QUOTE (Nikoli)
Smart launchers, given a pilot rating, it feeds in from your smartgun camera feed and determines what sort of person you are gunning for, then discreetly targets large groups with mission appropriate grenades, or for a more controlled approach, you simply use your currently linked weapon to choose target areas and through your link have it adjust and fire.

Install a Pilot (with ClearSight & Targeting Autosoft) on your Ares Alpha. wink.gif
DrowVampyre
How about a monowire grenade? Have a thin outer shell, a layer of small balls consisting of two semispherical weights and a monowire line between or the like, a layer of thicker material that would resist the actual explosion a bit to protect the monowire balls, and then the explosive itself. Throw the Oster Bomb and watch as a blast of spining monowire frappés your enemies. wink.gif
Ophis
On that thought hows about a gun that fires a pair of bouncy balls linked by monowire. Decapitates the original traget then bounces around slice whoever os unfortunate to get in the way.

[ Spoiler ]
Nikoli
"It slices, it dices, it makes Julian into fries! New from Ginzu munitions."
BlackHat
QUOTE (Ophis)
On that thought hows about a gun that fires a pair of bouncy balls linked by monowire. Decapitates the original traget then bounces around slice whoever os unfortunate to get in the way.

[ Spoiler ]

I don't know the reference, but in SR3, I believe they had "bola" rounds for Shotguns, and in the flavortext they said that it was monowire between the two balls. Of course, the damage stats for the ammo didn't work the same as monowire, but I had a troll that enjoyed them just because I liked the image of some guy lossing an arm to a monowire bola.
BlackHat
I'd like to see dart guns. They're even mentioned in the drugs section as being a way that some injection-vector drugs are delivered, but they don't oficially exist yet (but did in SR3). RFID "tag" rounds would be nice too. (Found one rules-legal way to implement them in SR4, but our group tends to frown on the idea of being able to put RFID tags inside of regular ammo.)
xizor
monowire grenades, as described, are way too expensive.
Granted, they can cut thru armor like butter, but you get a much cheaper effect using Microwire (which is only stopped by repelling gloves rotate.gif , and costs 0.5 nuyen.gif per meter compared to monowire at aprox 1500 nuyen.gif per meter) the net loss of effective ness would be the AP value, because Microwire does the same damage as monowire (8P)

some greate ideas in here. thanks
Voran
1. Legguards. This came up around the time monowire in SR3 became more heavily in use in both printed adventure books and source books for corpsec. Since monowire tended to be setup in situations to cut your legs out from underneath you when you moved through a hallway, I just figured addition of specific ceramic/dikote/whatever legguards otherwise usually associated with security grade armor, being added to a runner's normal armor gear. Functioned as forearm guards in effect, giving you a bonus to impact armor, hardened and stackable like a shield but only for leg type damage. Also gave a bonus to dmg for unarmed combat, since kicking someone with an armored leg, is going to hurt a bit.


2. The kneepad camera. Want to avoid getting shot in the gut at your table like Greedo? A simple camera attachment to the above mentioned guards, or standalone, that could be strapped to your knee and connected via (at SR3 time) dataline to your display link. Multiple imaging options available. Also compatible with the rearguard camera, a minicam the size of a box of matches that could be attached to your knee, belt, shoulder harness or helmet. Motion control so you can have it on when moving and not get sea-sick. Basically gives you eyes in the back of your head.
NightHaunter
QUOTE (Ophis)
On that thought hows about a gun that fires a pair of bouncy balls linked by monowire. Decapitates the original traget then bounces around slice whoever os unfortunate to get in the way.

[ Spoiler ]

Sound like an old school, Games Workshop, Space Ork, Hop-Splat Field Gun.

Or that could just be me.
Ophis
the hop splat was linked with chains... so no karma
ah old school GW such fine Ork weapons
damaleon
I think a "trap in a can" would be handy. I see 2 variations being useful, a monowire trap and a grenade add-on.

The first could quickly lay a monowire trap in a hallway as you flee. Designed and prepared for different sized hallways to minimize packaging and visibility when planted. Just plant it on the wall as it meets the floor or ceiling, activate, and 3 seconds later 4 small spikes trailing monowire are ejected at various angles and plant themselves into the wall on the other side of the hallway. Those approaching at a walk would get a perception(1) test, those running perception (3) test, to notice the spikes in the wall or light reflecting off the wires. As it wouldn't be to securely anchored, it would only do 4P damage (half monowire fencing damage) to those that collide with it.

The grenade/explosives add-on would be a palm sized device with a capacity of 1 allowing a sensor of your choice to be mounted. It would also contain a signal 0 radio receiver allowing remote activation and deactivation of the sensor. With this kind of device you could place a grenade almost anywhere and triggered by almost anything. With a mic sensor it be triggered by a specific voice, a camera for movement, a MAD detector for the first person with a weapon, etc. The receiver would allow you to send a deactivate command if you have to pass that way again, though you won't get any confirmation signal that it was accepted.
Kyoto Kid
Brass knuckles or Hardliner Gloves (from SR3 CC) +1 to unarmed DV

Tagger Darts - Microdarts with RFID/GPS technology built in. Could also be made similar to Stick & Shocks for tagging vehicles, drones, etc.

More vehicle choices - pickups, vans (eg VW SuperKombi), 4WD (eg. Land Rover), heavy submach transport aircraft (eg Lockheed Titan - in my last campaign the team actually "borrowed" an Antonov 335 cargo jet).
Voran
The "Quiet Bag"

alternately, the "Quiet Box". Basically a dufflebag or suitcase kinda thing that is designed for two big purposes, squelch any squealer type transmitters via bag/box material, and active internal jammers, and #2, have a side function that records over time whether or not something is trying to squeal.

In SR3 this was my loot bag. Paydata, r&D items, prototypes, weapons whatever, goes into the bag, hopefully lessening the chance the strike team rolls in on you during trade time.

For better security, you open the bag in a shielded room, after checking the bag's monitor to see if anything has tried to peep your location.
evilgenius
QUOTE (Voran)
The "Quiet Bag"

alternately, the "Quiet Box". Basically a dufflebag or suitcase kinda thing that is designed for two big purposes, squelch any squealer type transmitters via bag/box material, and active internal jammers, and #2, have a side function that records over time whether or not something is trying to squeal.

In SR3 this was my loot bag. Paydata, r&D items, prototypes, weapons whatever, goes into the bag, hopefully lessening the chance the strike team rolls in on you during trade time.

For better security, you open the bag in a shielded room, after checking the bag's monitor to see if anything has tried to peep your location.

That's fucking brilliant.
Voran
With the boost in power/memory capabilities in SR4, I'd think it'd almost be possible to carry around portable barricades. Basically some sorta geltype, memory material, that in its default state is like a blanket, but you give it a charge and poof, instant barrier.

Another idea I toyed with back in SR3, mostly due to watching too much bubblegum crisis, were punch bombs. Basically like the hardsuit versions, in this case you'd have armored gauntlets with shaped charges on the knuckles or something, if you successful hit the target, boom they take a shaped charge in the gut.

Then, due to watching too much Gundam, the charge axe. Basically a combat axe/shaped charge. You smack someone with the axe, thunk, and then boom. Never actually tried to introduce it into a game. Partly cause I have no idea how it would actually work out smile.gif
DrowVampyre
Hmm...here's one that could be easily made using the SR4 book: a microwire armor enhancement. Coat your armor in a layer of the same material used in the rappeling gloves, then wrap strands of monowire around it as loosely as possible without inhibiting your mobility. Oughta give those martial artist physads and grapple happy trolls something to think about. wink.gif
juggertroll
Anime is always a problem in cyberpunk/high tecnologic rpgs, like shadowrun. The most of the good ideas (and the irrealistic ideas) are too much powerful or too much complicated to transfer without any significant problems. Other thing is weapons from movies. I like the x-ray rail gun from eraser (the governator kills a middle numbers in this film, but commando is his master piece), but this weapon is to danm powerful for shadow run, because the grotesque armor piercing number. The damage is even worse, its like flechette in mach 5 speed with built-in suppressor (i remember the high velocity bullets in ghost in the shell).
Austere Emancipator
The Steyr ACR fires a flechette at Mach ~4.5, and the terminal effect on humans is sub-par. Penetrates body armor just fine, though.

QUOTE (Voran)
[...] armored gauntlets with shaped charges on the knuckles or something, if you successful hit the target, boom they take a shaped charge in the gut. [...] Then, due to watching too much Gundam, the charge axe. Basically a combat axe/shaped charge. You smack someone with the axe, thunk, and then boom.

Uhh, why? Wouldn't it be more efficient to launch the same shaped charges at the enemy by means of, I don't know, a grenade launcher or LAW?
juggertroll
well, my lack of tecnical information is very bad i think. Even with that information, the "eraser" gun is very potent. For now i prefer to use the BBB without any major modifications until i can get along with the rules system
Shrike30
The Eraser weapons pushed slugs up to something like half the speed of light. They were a little ridiculous.

Previous SR books have made it pretty clear that railgun technology hasn't progressed much behind mounting them on battleships or MBTs. If you honestly want to put something like that into a weapon the size of an assault rifle, well, it's your game...
Austere Emancipator
Even on battleships or MBTs, they aren't awe-insipiring in SR. In SR3, the railguns in the Rigger 3 book are heavier (with the exception of the Light Railgun), more expensive and shorter ranged than their conventional counterparts (the Naval Guns). Their only advantage is lighter ammunition. That's 9-year-old information, of course.
Shrike30
I don't have Rigger 3 in front of me, but I thought railguns had a ROF advantage over some of the naval guns? I may, of course, be totally wrong.
Austere Emancipator
They actually have a RoF disadvantage: All railguns take a full CT to "charge up" and are Single Shot weapons, so they can be fired only once every other CT. Additionally, after 20 shots they require 10 hours of recharging. A Light Naval Gun is a "Semi-Automatic" weapon, while a Medium Naval Gun is Single Shot.
Shrike30
Jeez. Sucks to be them.
Voran
Yeah the punch bombs and the bomb axe were kinda silly smile.gif Toyed with the idea in SR3, but never came up with it in play.

I'm interested to see what happens if/when they bring back lasers in SR4. I never used them as personal weapons back in SR3, but I had a nice rear firing laser on my car back in the day. In SR4 I wonder if they'll show improvement in powerpack capacity, leading to more shots, or they'll do the quicker recharge time thing like they're doing with some of the SR4 things that burn energy packs.

For the rail gun, I imagine one of the benefits of it vs conventional cannon tech would be that they're less likely to explode due to ammo room mishaps.
Austere Emancipator
QUOTE (Voran)
For the rail gun, I imagine one of the benefits of it vs conventional cannon tech would be that they're less likely to explode due to ammo room mishaps.

You mean, the kind of mishap where an enemy SSM hits the ammo room? Yeah, a railgun would probably be safer in that situation.
ronin3338
QUOTE (Voran)
With the boost in power/memory capabilities in SR4, I'd think it'd almost be possible to carry around portable barricades. Basically some sorta geltype, memory material, that in its default state is like a blanket, but you give it a charge and poof, instant barrier.

Another idea I toyed with back in SR3, mostly due to watching too much bubblegum crisis, were punch bombs. Basically like the hardsuit versions, in this case you'd have armored gauntlets with shaped charges on the knuckles or something, if you successful hit the target, boom they take a shaped charge in the gut.


For the barricades, Battletech had inflatable mylar chairs which were quite strong and lightweight, and batman Begins had the memory material that he used for wings... sounds possible to me, but it wouldn't be a heavy barrier, it'd be more like a riot shield or something like that.

For the punch bombs... without a full suit, wouldn't you break your hand/arm/shoulder?
FanGirl
I'd like to be able to use incendiary devices and/or acid in the field, in case I need to destroy DNA evidence (like dripping blood) and the group mage can't do it himself for some reason. I can't find any such things in the gear listings; perhaps I'm missing something, but I can't see any way for me to burn something. Can someone make up stats for a lighter or an acid vial? Thanks!
dcpirahna
I'm sure your GM would let you just by some lighter fluid and a Bic lighter for a few nuyen though.
If not, you could use Termite Gel (p327) or have the mage summon a rank 1 fire elemental nyahnyah.gif

Stats for a Termite Grenade of some sort would be nice though.

edit: Fixed the missing 'h', but removed it again since a Termite grenade does sound a lot funnier.
Geekkake
QUOTE (dcpirahna @ Apr 27 2006, 03:30 PM)
I'm sure your GM would let you just by some lighter fluid and a Bic lighter for a few nuyen though.
If not, you could use Termite Gel (p327) or have the mage summon a rank 1 fire elemental nyahnyah.gif

Stats for a Termite Grenade of some sort would be nice though.

Grenades with termites suspended in gel? That'd be great for structural sabotage on older buildings...
ronin3338
Emo'd love those!

Thin orichalcum shell containg a termite spirit, which shatters when thrown, releasing said spirit to thwomp the nearest person.
Geekkake
QUOTE (ronin3338)
Emo'd love those!

Thin orichalcum shell containg a termite spirit, which shatters when thrown, releasing said spirit to thwomp the nearest person.

My God. I'd throw something like that at my characters. It's so insane and out of character for me and the usual flavor of my runs, it'd completely stop them in their tracks. They'd have NO idea what to do.
Mr. Unpronounceable
QUOTE (ronin3338)
Heh wink.gif Watch Mythbusters. The "brown noise" seems to be a myth.

You know...

Once a grenade lands at your feet, "the brown note" is pretty much redundant anyway.
Big D
I'm kinda surprised that nobody's mentioned blended metal body rounds.

Exex (maybe even better on the AP side) without the blowing up thing.
Austere Emancipator
If only they worked. nyahnyah.gif
It's a decent excuse for (Ex-)Explosive ammunition for 2060s+ small arms, though.
Red
I hereby submit the following two ideas;

1. The Anonymizer. This electronic device can be attached to any conventional, small arm gun barrel. It is a complex nanite controller with a limited, but rechargable supply of nanites which are consumed each time it is used. When activated it has three options. Option one is to memorize grooves, nicks, and other distinguishing patterns of the barrel. Option two is to randomly reconfigure these identifiers. And option three is to match the barrel to a memorized pattern as closely as possible (subject to GM approval based on the type of weapon, and other factors). Option three is only valid for weapons of the same type, caliber, barrel, etc... The quantity of nanites used depends on the surface area of the barrel.

2. The Vanishing Shot. This is a very special nanite injection which lingers in the blood stream for 8 - 24 hours. The nanites are specially designed to destroy the DNA, and RNA of dead cells. While useless for hair, and nails, the vanishing shot nanites will destroy the DNA left behind from bloodloss. However since blood cells do not immediately die on explusion from the body, and the nanites require a non-instaneous time to activate the user is still able to pass through DNA scanners which take live samples of blood for immediate identity verification.

It is rumored that those capable of affording a constant and sustained supply of the vanishing shot in their bloodstream will acquire DNA protected hair and nails so long as they were grown completely during the duration of exposure to the nanites. However even a brief lapse in the medication schedule can render this benefit useless as DNA will make it into those bodily materials during those windows of opportunity.

Some conspiracy nuts actually suspect such nanites have been utilized in nanite hive implants...
Shrike30
It seems likely that taking the Vanishing Shot might make all my hair fall out and exfoliate my skin quite nicely.
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