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nezumi
QUOTE (Witness)
It's about the most flagrant case of 'the grass is always greener' that I've ever seen!
But to each their own.

I think it's funny that the conversation has gone from making points to support an argument to making motivations for why other people (who are still present) voted what they voted for.

I will say, I wouldn't want to live in Kage's Shadowrun. But reading it by the books, it's not all that bad.
James McMurray
QUOTE
You've probably lost all your savings in the Crash 2.0.


Along with everyone else. Besides, what saving? All my money is tied up in debt, which I lost in Crash 2.0. biggrin.gif

QUOTE
Your corporation is now picking up your tab and owns your ass in perpetuity (as well as the asses of all future generations of McMurrays).


And? I already said I'd work for a corp and be a grunt. Nothing changes here except for my children. If I really want to change jobs and am good enough at what I do, another corp can dump lawyers on my case and get me out, or shadowrunners who come get me. smile.gif

QUOTE
You've been moved to a miserable office with grey lighting and there's no windows within 500 yards, and they don't let you decorate it with AR because that's a distraction.


And that's different from real life how? The grey lighting is a) a silly idea because corps that don't light their cubes have people that can't see to work and b) mostly irrelevant as I'd probably be working in AR or VR all day.

QUOTE
You work 12 hours a day, because if you don't someone else will, and when I say work, I really do mean work, because they're always watching you.


And that differs from real life how? You do the job you're given or you find another one. Morale still means something 60 years from now. Companies today don't watch you 24/7, despite the ability to do it easily. If they did they'd have upset workers and lowered productivity. If you're working at a place that doesn't understand that, just wait around a while and they'll go belly up.

QUOTE
You spend another three hours a day stuck in traffic because some git's blown up half the street.


I live in the corp complex, remember? Besides, half the streets in major urban areas are already under construction. 3 hours is nothing if you live in the wrong city and pick the wrong route that morning. Besides, how often do you think places get blown up in Shadowrun? It may happen at least once per gaming session, but most shadowruns are either a) criminal related so away from the mainstream areas, b) low key, or c) gargantuan. The ones in category C happen rarely, and the others generally so not insert themselves into the lives of random people on the street.

QUOTE
Hackers keep taking money out of your account, and nobody seems to want to do anything about it.


Banks will still have to be insured, or nobody will give them their money. A bank that can't keep people from having their money stolen isn't a bank that will get used, no matter how many toasters you get for signing up.

QUOTE
You can't go out at night without a) somebody picking your pockets, b) somebody picking a fight with you, c) somebody trying to sell you their 'services', or d) somebody trying to recruit you to a cult.


You're assuming that I go somewhere that doesn't have a decent security rating. If you go somewhere that the Star is being actively paid to watch you're ok. Just like in real life, those things all happen if you go where they occur.

QUOTE
You get assaulted by spam just about everywhere you go, despite spending half your life and wage upgrading your filters to the latest version you can afford. You'd turn your commlink off, but you need it on to pass the toll booths.


You can go in silent mode in most places. Most places don't allow rampant spamming. I'd assume that spam filters work as well then as they do today: pretty much good for everything, with a rare piece slipping through.

QUOTE
You are bombarded by glamorous trid shows full of cool tech that you can't actually afford (probably ever), while simultaneously getting bombarded with the message that you're just a wageslave among a billion and you'll never amount to anything more (so why not try our new SimThriller experience!).


Sweet! SimThrillers rock!

QUOTE
Your 14-year old daughter comes home one day as an Ork poser.


As opposed to a Goth with pierced nose and tattoed neck?

QUOTE
She's dating a troll called FcukU who chews pencils like some punks would chew toothpicks. And sometimes you swear she's walking funny.


At least he can protect her. If he's not good for her he'll be gotten rid of. A few bucks to the racist gaurds at the complex oughta get him tasered every time he comes near. wink.gif

Teenage dating has been a problem for a loooong time. The problem will change in 60 years, but it will still be the same general problem. If I can't raise my daughter to avoid unsafe sex now, I won't be able to do it in 60 years.

I'm not saying it's a great place to live, but neither is today. Most of those things apply in some form or another right now. Instead of the corp owning you it's the bank with the mortgage and your car loan. Instead of a ork poser it's a goth. Hackers and Identity thieves already have a shot at taking your life savings.

Different strokes for different folks I assume. I'm already a corporate shill who owes his life to a mortgage and old debts. The world is already a craptacular place, and will be even more so in another 10 years. Hook me up with some SimThriller! wink.gif
SL James
QUOTE (Witness)
Your 14-year old daughter comes home one day as an Ork poser.
She's dating a troll called FcukU who chews pencils like some punks would chew toothpicks. And sometimes you swear she's walking funny.

And people here probably wonder why I'd be a charter member of Humanis.

QUOTE (nezumi)
Again, seriously, how is this different from real life?  It's not like teenage pregnancy isn't a common problem.  Plus at least now I can tell Lone Star that FcukU has been up to some BTL dealing and they can go break some knee caps.  After all, he is a troll, we know they're all dock workers or dealers anyway, right?

I'd prefer the "He's coming right for me!" defense - except he was coming right for me from half a kilometer away and instead of defending myself with a CCW, it would be with a .50 BMG Barrett rifle.
nezumi
Being the sort of person I am, I really would prefer to rely on Lone Star rather than my own shooting skill to take FcukU down.
James McMurray
I guess it all boils down to the view you have of SR and to what level the dystopian factor works. When I'm running a game, the runners and other SINless unfortunates have a crappy life. People that tow the party line and do their jobs live fairly well. That makes it even more a kick in the gut to the runners that don't have what they want, or have given it all up for individuality and the fast life.
mfb
QUOTE (James McMurray)
    * quirks of fate, like having the bad luck to be in the Arcology when Deus decides to start his reign of terror
    * personal choice by going into the seedier sides of the world
    * placing yourself in a position of importance, such as being a researcher on an important project

yes, but you have to consider the following:
* there are a hell of a lot more quirks loose in SR than in the real world
* the seedier sides occupy an even larger chunk of the planet in SR than they do now
* you probably won't know what's important until it's too late

consider the crime rate in SR to today. Seattle is a low-intensity war zone! there are multiple areas the size of modern-day metropolis that the 'cops' simply refuse to go without LAVs for backup! the reason SR is such an interesting world to play games in is because it would be an absolute hell to live in.
James McMurray
Yeah, there are large areas of crime. I'll be keeping out of those.

The quirks are bigger and different, but I imagine the average person's life is still as uneventful as it is today. You're born, you work, you die. Hopefully at some point in the cycle you find someone to spend your time with, and if all goes well and you're ready for the responsibility you have some kids so that they can be born, work, then die (hopefully with someone special of their own).

Like I said, we have different views of how SR life affects the people in society who are willing to go along with the flow. Shadowrunners and criminals have horrible lives because they go against that flow, often violently. While it is possible that I would find myself in a postiion of importance, it's not very likely. Important positions are usually filled by people with the motivation and drive to get to those parts. All I want to do is make my paycheck so I can have fun with friends and family, and carve out a future for the ones I leave behind when I go.
Witness
QUOTE (nezumi @ Jul 10 2006, 03:34 PM)
I think it's funny that the conversation has gone from making points to support an argument to making motivations for why other people (who are still present) voted what they voted for.

Well that's good I guess. I was aiming for amusing. wink.gif

Ah I don't mean to judge. I've been in places in my life where I thought I'd rather live in the 14th century, superstition, black death and all, than be where I was right then. I guess I've just come to conclude that the world today isn't quite so bad as all that.

Yes James is right: it comes down to how dark and dystopian you make your shadowrun universe for the everyday joes who live in it. It's been a useful conversation. Given me some ideas.
stevebugge
Time for a spin-off thread I think
mfb
QUOTE (James McMurray)
Yeah, there are large areas of crime. I'll be keeping out of those.

i tend to play up the idea that these large areas of crime tend to create a lot of spillover. gangs live in the Barrens, but they work and play in the rest of the city.

but, yes, even in SR, the chances are that if you're a Joe Average corp employee, you'll live a normal, uneventful life and die in bed. however, the chances that you'll lead a short, interesting life are much higher than they are today. if we say there's only a 10% chance, today, that something terrible will happen to you--get killed in a mugging gone wrong, lose your life savings in a massive financial error, die in a terrorist attack, whatever--then, in SR, there's a 25% chance. obviously, these 'statistics' are bullshit i just made up, but you get the idea.

and i'm not saying that it'd be bad to live in SR simply because something bad might happen to you--the bad things, themselves, are not what repels me. what i wouldn't want to deal with is the crap i'd have to do to try and ameliorate the bad things that might happen. today, if you stick to brightly-lit areas and don't do stupid things, the only thing you really have to worry about is looking both ways before crossing the street. in SR, because of the wider, larger array of things that might randomly end/ruin your life, you have to maintain a constant vigil. loud noises scare you, you're afraid to be alone, you watch the stock market with trepidation because your livelihood is tied to quickly-changing factors that are far beyond your control.
James McMurray
Or you go about your life blissfully. I'm sure that's what the vast majority of the masses do. Those that pay attention to the stock market are probably very careful never to put all their eggs in one basket, and never in the basket that they work in. Like today though, most folks just go under the assumption that if it isn't in their living room or cube then it doesn't exist.
mfb
i should have explained the stock market thing better--i don't mean that people are worried about investments, i mean that people are worried that the company they work for might get ripped apart in some corporate maneuver.

and i think you're giving people either too much or too little credit. regardless of which it is, people will be afraid because they'll have friends and family who fell victim to one horrible disaster or another. i mean, have you looked at the number of people who died during the decades immediately before and after the Awakening?
SL James
QUOTE (mfb)
today, if you stick to brightly-lit areas and don't do stupid things, the only thing you really have to worry about is looking both ways before crossing the street. in SR, because of the wider, larger array of things that might randomly end/ruin your life, you have to maintain a constant vigil. loud noises scare you, you're afraid to be alone, you watch the stock market with trepidation because your livelihood is tied to quickly-changing factors that are far beyond your control.

I guess it's a matter of comparison: Living in Los Angeles I would be able to walk through the most "violent" neighborhood in the county without threat of intentional violence (though that isn't to say I'm not going to be harassed, or otherwise told to simply get the fuck out). When it comes down to it, it's because I am not a threat (perhaps a customer, even). And there is no inherent value in killing me.

If I were to do the same thing in Puyallup in 2064, I am subject to all manner of things that want to eat me (including metahumans), sell me for parts, use me for a magical ritual, or just kill me because unlike 2006 L.A., no one will care because I should have known better.
hyzmarca
QUOTE (mfb)
consider the crime rate in SR to today. Seattle is a low-intensity war zone! there are multiple areas the size of modern-day metropolis that the 'cops' simply refuse to go without LAVs for backup! the reason SR is such an interesting world to play games in is because it would be an absolute hell to live in.

That's the same as today only substitute 'Iraq' for 'Seattle'.

QUOTE (nezumi)
  Being the sort of person I am, I really would prefer to rely on Lone Star rather than my own shooting skill to take FcukU down.


Or you could be a progressive parent and just buy her a box of troll-sized condoms.
mfb
QUOTE (hyzmarca)
That's the same as today only substitute 'Iraq' for 'Seattle'.

heh. i'm getting into a game right now, in SR, where we're playing a group of PMCs heading into a low-intensity conflict.
James McMurray
I meant that people wouldn't follow the stock market because they wouldn't know what signs to look for to know that their company is about to be bought out. The ones that do know would diversify assets to try and avoid a really hard hit.

QUOTE
If I were to do the same thing in Puyallup in 2064, I am subject to all manner of things that want to eat me (including metahumans), sell me for parts, use me for a magical ritual, or just kill me because unlike 2006 L.A., no one will care because I should have known better.


So... umm... Don't go to Puyallup?
mfb
it's not just Puyallup, though. every district has several gangs, and so do all of the major highways.
Witness
Some way above I took a whole bunch of everyday annoyances and extrapolated them out to Sixth World dimensions, which seems like a pretty good Make-Your-Own-Shadowrun-Universe strategy.
One thing that comes across loud and clear from this thread is the immense dissatisfaction felt by fairly ordinary people in this world (dissatisfied to the extent that the SR universe looks attractive by comparison). It seems to me that this phenomenon would be super-sized in the Sixth World as well. After all, everyday joes end up painting their walls with AR, hooking themselves up to BTLs, or plunging themselves into the shadows just to get some sense that their life is ok, even if their original life was much safer.
ShadowDragon8685
That's more of a human phenomina. Almost anything seems better than what you're in right now.

You ever heard an old guy grumping about the good old days? That's because he's in the now, and he's forgotten what life was actually life back then, and he just remembers all the good things, like being 20 years old and courting his beau.

Or any of us, who love escapist fantasy. D&D, Shadowrun, whatever. We hate modern day life. Iraq, Afghanistan, terror in the air, 9/11...

Some of us pine for a future where mages and trolls exist and you can master your own destiny with a cyberdeck/comlink/set of cyberware/magical powers.

Some of us pine for heroic fantasy, where the elves were beautiful and put out, the heros were huge and heroic, and evil was powerful but dumb, and thus overcomable.

Some of us pine for romantic notions about pirate gold and treasure, and high adventure on the high seas. (Watch Pirates of the Caribbean again, it'll come back to you.)

Hell, some of us think that being back in the Cold War would be better than now. In a way, it's true. We were 99.99% certain that the Soviets didn't want to see their way of life anhilliated any more than we wanted to see ours anhilliated, and we were at least 50% sure they didn't nessessarily want to anhilliate our way of life, only safeguard theirs.

You could understand and reason with the Soviets. The modern day terror? No way. How can one reason with someone who will strap a vest of explosives on and detonate it in a crowded bus? They literally think that if they blow up the world and in doing so anhilliate our way of life, they'll get on the express straight to heaven and their 77 virgins.

Or worse, Kim-Jong Il, the lunatic nut who takes brinksmanship to a whole new level. The North Korean has no freedom of information, he only knows what he's allowed to know, and he's been brainwashed and propagandized into believing that we could sweep over the border at any minute to wipe out their democratic people's republic. (Even if it's democratic and a republic in name only.) Thusly, he'll fight to the death.

You can't reason with that. And frankly it's scary.*


Or hell, you could pine for the days of WWII, where everything was clean-cut, everybody knew without doubt that we were fighting a war that was not only just and rightious, but that would dictate the terms of our civilization's unfolding for at least a century to come, and probably longer. Sure, the technology sucked and yadda yadda, but at least you could look in a mirror and say "I'm doing what is right, and if I don't, my children are either going to be shipped to a gas chamber, or grow up swearing Heil Hitler."

You can't get that today. Freedom of information and the sensationalist press cloud things and tint them to the point that you can't do anything without being called a bully. And when you try, shit gets ploughed in your face.

Yes, I do believe Afghanistan and Iraq needed to be invaded. I do not believe invading Iraq under false pretenses was good. I do not believe going in with only vauge goals and no definable exit strategy was good. The only good thing that has come so far of the war in Iraq is the nipping in the bud of the Hussein Dynasty.



*Yes, I am expressing my own opinions. Islamic fundies scare the shit out of me, just like fundies of any stripe would if I had reasonable cause to believe they could get their hands on some very nasty weapons of mass death. I'm not accusing every moslem or arab of being a lunatic - I'm just saying that the lunatics amongst them scare me pale.
SL James
I wouldn't call Dumpshockers ordinary by any stretch. But the collective dissatisfaction on these related threads is palpable enough to roll into balls and toss around in a game of Emo Ball (It's like Calvin Ball, but as a meandering of people bitching about how no else gets them and how they think they're so fucking special).
Witness
Yes, as I was typing that I was aware that the term 'ordinary' could easily be contested!

Shadowdragon: yes, like I was saying: 'the grass is always greener...'
Nidhogg
QUOTE (Witness)
After all, everyday joes end up painting their walls with AR, hooking themselves up to BTLs, or plunging themselves into the shadows just to get some sense that their life is ok, even if their original life was much safer.

Well, at first, I was like "no damn way you could EVER convince me to live in a hellhole future". Then I read this little tidbit, and got me thinking. Now I definately want to live in the SR universe, with my AR wallpaper, and a BTL rig sitting in the corner. I must go there, NOW! Pretty please, with novacoke on top?
Witness
Doh.
nezumi
QUOTE (mfb)
i should have explained the stock market thing better--i don't mean that people are worried about investments, i mean that people are worried that the company they work for might get ripped apart in some corporate maneuver.

As James said, you can't do anything about it, so why worry? Ultimately, if you work for a megacorp, they're likely going to find somewhere else you'll be useful. It may be better than where you are now, it may be worse, but it would be a little silly to just toss you away after they've already spent so much time building up the corporate loyalty (and paying for training and whatever else). Sure, it's a buyer's market when it comes to getting employees, but using what you already have is generally cheaper than hiring someone new.

QUOTE
and i think you're giving people either too much or too little credit. regardless of which it is, people will be afraid because they'll have friends and family who fell victim to one horrible disaster or another. i mean, have you looked at the number of people who died during the decades immediately before and after the Awakening?


That's why I specified 2060 and not 2020 nyahnyah.gif


Again though, I'm running with the assumption that I could pick up all my stuff and simply *appear* in 2060, already settled in, with a job, with a family, and still have my previous knowledge as a comparison. Otherwise it either isn't 'me' living there, or I'm not going into an equivalent position. If the question is if I'd want to be born in 2035 to a middle class family and go from there... I don't know. Tough question. I'm not particularly interested in living the rest of my natural life in a previous time, because I'm used to soft chairs and a/c. But I don't see much of a reason not to enjoy Shadowrun. It's sort of like asking, if they were setting up a colony on Mars, would you go? Sure, life will be tough and you'll miss what you left behind, but come on, it's a colony on Mars!! How cool is that?
Neverborn
this is my inner nerd speaking by all means

Well i personally would really like to live in the shadowrun Universe, I really dig the whole commlink and AR thing, it just seems really appealing to me. Things would be a little more dangerous yet interesting, sure instead of running into a gang of humans you could run into a gang of Troll Physical Adepts which would probably suck

Magic would be there and that never really gets old. I wanna know what its like to cast a fireball spell or something of that nature. Trid would be really entertaining, yea the corprate world would kinda be a bummer but i mean i know i wouldnt really be apart of it.

Cyberware would be interesting imagine delta wired reflexs level three and how crazy that would be. Concert would be bad ass to, plus i want an animated tattoo and glowing hair.

Oh and the main reason is because id be really eight deep in some hot elf chicks would pretty much seal the deal im not gonna lie

SL James
Gah. Your description sounds like hipster Hell.
Neverborn
I think i was shooting for that
Nidhogg
QUOTE (Witness)
Doh.

What can I say? I like geeky thing, and I like recreational drug use. BTLs are like, my wet dream.
NightmareX
QUOTE (mfb)
jesus christ, no. the fact that the real world is starting to soud like an RPG setting is scary enough.

I voted yes for this very reason. At least in SR you can go outside the law/corps and have a (slim) chance of making a better life for yourself if you have the proper means ('ware, skills, magic, etc). In real life, the system owns you and there is nothing you can do about it.

As for being scary, who's afraid of death anyway?

To tap into Shadowdragon's analogy, IRL if an Islamic terrorist jumps on your bus with a gun and a vest full of explosives and tells the driver to go to X building you really only have three options - 1) rush him and get shot, 2) try to shoot him before he can do anything to get you killed (in the off chance that you're one of the rare people that carry), or 3) set back, obey, and die.

In SR, if a crazy ganger with a gun and a vest full of explosives jumps on your bus and tells the driver to go to X building there is a much higher chance that you or one of the other people on the bus is carrying and can thus use option 2 above. Sure, you might still buy it, but at least you had the opportunity to try to save yourself. Or at least the choice of how you wished to die.

mfb
*shrug* you're assuming you'd be a badass shadowrunner. in my games, at least, the streets are full of people who'd like to be badass shadowrunners--and Potter's Field is even more full of 'em. besides, one of the benefits of the here-and-now is that you're much, much less likely to be on a bus that some crazy terrorist decides to blow up.

and even if i could be a badass shadowrunner, i still don't think i'd choose to live in the SR world. being a badass has baggage that they don't tell you about in the movies.
NightmareX
QUOTE (mfb)
*shrug* you're assuming you'd be a badass shadowrunner.

Not really. I'm just assuming I'd be an average schmoe. There are plenty of examples in SR fiction of average or slightly above average schmoes who drop (or are forced) out of the corp-a-day world and survive and/or thrive in the shadows. Of course, as you said, for every one that survives there are undoubtedly hundreds of others that buy it. That's why I used the qualifier "slim". wink.gif But a slim chance is still a chance, and even if you died you would have the satisfaction that you actually lived instead of just dying a little bit inside every day and waiting for your body to catch up to your soul.

"You've been down that road Neo. You know exactly where it leads, and you know that isn't a place you want to be."
- Trinity (probably misquoted, but you get the idea)
hyzmarca
You don't have to be a baddass shadowrunner so long as the other guy isn't. If he's a suicide bomber then he probably isn't baddass. Baddasses don't blow themselves up unless their bombs rhyme with 'bucklear.'
mfb
if you really want that, you can join any number of military or paramilitary organizations right now, in the real world. there are plenty of people who enjoy that lifestyle; if you think it's for you--if you want the chance to "really live", stop sitting in front of a computer and go live. go see the sights, meet interesting people, and kill them. and then, if you get tired of it, you can come home to a nice consulting job.

and your wife and kids won't have to worry about being on that bus.
NightmareX
QUOTE (mfb)
if you really want that, you can join any number of military or paramilitary organizations right now, in the real world. there are plenty of people who enjoy that lifestyle; if you think it's for you--if you want the chance to "really live", stop sitting in front of a computer and go live. go see the sights, meet interesting people, and kill them. and then, if you get tired of it, you can come home to a nice consulting job.

Touche, save for the unfortunate fact that the meat is not of sufficient quality to meet the spirit's demands. frown.gif
mfb
then, regardless, your chance at "really living" would be largely limited to saying "oh shit that guy's got a--"

if that sounds like fun, catch a bus to a large city and walk around some of its less savory neighborhoods for a while. you'll get that same experience, and--like i said--your wife, kids, family, friends, pet ferret, etcetera won't have to worry about being on that bus.
Shadow
I want the the guns, cars, cyber and other toys. Sure life sucsk, the world has gone to hell in unimaginable ways. Life is a state of mind, for those few of us who have lived in a cardboard box at one time or another, we know this. At lease in 2070 I could carry guns, be faster than the Six Million Dollar man, and blow the crap out of people who were idiots.
James McMurray
QUOTE (NightmareX)
I voted yes for this very reason. At least in SR you can go outside the law/corps and have a (slim) chance of making a better life for yourself if you have the proper means ('ware, skills, magic, etc). In real life, the system owns you and there is nothing you can do about it.

There are all sorts of people out there operating outside the law and making a good living at it, at least here in America. Not letting the system own you is as simple as moving to a neighborhood where people don't ask questions, quitting your job to freelance in whatever crime floats your boat, and finding the perfect balance between hard work and goofing off to be a successful criminal but not have to work anywhere near as hard as you'd work in a real job. You have to do all of those things as a Shadowrunner as well, unless you're maintaining soem sort of double identity (also an option here).

IMO SR crime is flashier, grittier, and more likely to involve weaponry. It's also more likely to see you permanently screwed if you get caught, because you're a noncitizen with nowhere to be deported to.
James McMurray
Does living under a bridge count? It was spring so I didn't see the need for a box. smile.gif
ShadowDragon8685
It's all about the cyberware for me. Unless I got lucky enough to become Awakened - hell, I could roll with that.

But if not... Load my head up with shit, man. I'm jacking in, and if I can go GitM, so much the better.

Who needs the meat world when you can breeze through the Matrix, battling it out with IC and corp deckers? Okay, so it's dangerous... But in 2060, what isen't? At least it'd be cool as hell.

Though I should note that the qualifiers about "Me" appearing straight in 2060, as opposed to having been born in 2045 or something apply. If I could go in forearmed with my knowledge of the SR world and plot and stuff... Hell yes. If not? Well..... Heh. I guess in 2060, there's 80 year old guys who reminisce about how good things were at the dawn of the 21st.
Grinder
Being able to get some cyberware installed (especially eyes and ears) is enough for me o live in 2060/70. I don't think my profession will be outdated then (teacher of mental handicaped people), but still bad paid. Anyway, living in a world with elf chicks, magic and cyberware is an awesome thought.
Witness
I could happily live in a future with elf chicks, cyberware, AR and other cool stuff (though magic, as I've said before, would be bad IMO).
But I'd rather live in the future world that has all those things without all the dystopian horror of Shadowrun.
Grinder
Or you could do your best to make the world a better place then. Even when trying at a small scale.
SL James
Like any hot elf chick would be interested in a mediocre human.

As for your job... Depends. Some would be "fixed" in utero. Others would be "fixed" in other ways. You'd be busy among the SINless, though.
Grinder
As long as I enjoy my job, I don't care if I'm working with SINless, mental handicaped or bad monkeys. wink.gif

NightmareX
QUOTE (James McMurray)
IMO SR crime is flashier, grittier, and more likely to involve weaponry. It's also more likely to see you permanently screwed if you get caught, because you're a noncitizen with nowhere to be deported to.

Agreed, although you can get permanently screwed just as bad IRL. I had friends that learned that the hard way.
NightmareX
QUOTE (mfb)
then, regardless, your chance at "really living" would be largely limited to saying "oh shit that guy's got a--"

That's why I said I was assuming being an average schmoe wink.gif Joe average doesn't have asthma (sp?) and by definition has average vision (which is why I'm not in the Air Force btw). Even if he does have a condition that would hold him back from physical action, he can skill deck or sling magic if he has the skills and/or talent.
mfb
QUOTE (Grinder)
I don't think my profession will be outdated then (teacher of mental handicaped people), but still bad paid.

waitaminute, you're getting paid to post here?
Grinder
rotfl.gif

Germany is a wonderful country, isn't it?
Milton
QUOTE (Shrike30)
Live in the SR world? Where the OTHER 1% of the population has magic, strange and new wonderful diseases crop up every day, people shoot at medics and firefighters to try and steal their cars, and the happy middle class lifestyle is only possible if you're willing to expose yourself to corporate media and brainwashing 24/7? I think I'll pass.

What is the difference to nowadays corporate euro-america? Bio- and Cyberware, the 1% Magic thing, Simsin, Lavs, Control Rigs, Elf-babes... (i read that before...)

I choose the SR Reality Fugitives Camp!
Milton
QUOTE (Grinder)
rotfl.gif

Germany is a wonderful country, isn't it?

Austria too! rotfl.gif
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