Hey folks,

Our local group is looking to play some SRM in the near future. I've seen some mention of table ratings with a descriptor (like green, etc.) and/or number (1-7, I believe). Where can I find this information? I assume it's tied to total Karma earned by the characters, but after looking all over Catalyst's website, the SRM documents, and these boards, I can't seem to find a good guide for it.

Could someone give me some assistance with this?

Thanks!

It's in the beginning section of the mission. For Denver missions series, it's based on character earned karma averages. For NY Missions, it's a player selected number from 1 to 6.

Download the missions for Denver and read the initial section. Or your GM can read that section.

For the NY mission, it should be in the first one, which I think you can download free.

Thanks DireRadiant... Found it just fine now. Anyone know why they removed the Karma calculations for table rating? Even if you use it as a guideline, it seems that new players/GMs might find it useful to have some sort of character-experience measurement to determine the difficulty rating of a mission. For example, if I have a table of 4 - two PCs with 100 Karma earned and two new PCs - how are the GM or the players supposed to parse this into a table rating? There is zero guidance given in the SRM03 materials. It would be great to have something like this back in the document, with the caveat that it is only a guide, and that a group of very experienced players might opt to play above their recommended table rating.

I suggest that some mention be made of the table rating in the SRM FAQ at the very least, so in a new group everyone has an idea of how the system works before beginning play of their first mission. It's also helpful to keep them informed when this new group goes out "into the world" to play missions in public.

There are no hard and fast rules for what TR a table should take. In general, if the players aren't sure, I recommend TR 1 for brand new players to the system. TR 3 is good for veteran players with brand new characters. TR 6 is for veterans with powerful characters or for Bull everytime.

It is possible for a team of straight 400 BP characters to survive at TR 6, though it will be very difficult--the team will need to make careful choices and will likely not engage situations directly, rather they approach problems sideways. Likewise, I've seen a group of characters with an average of 60 karma all die horribly on TR 3 because they chose poorly and their dice betrayed them.

To answer the question about how you should parse the TR based on a disparate group--2 @100 karma, 2 @0 karma--the choice is up to the players. If they want an easier assignment, go TR 1-3, for harder job go TR 4-6. The benefit of higher TR is a higher payout (and of course bragging rights).

My understanding is that the TR mechanics were changed to accomodate a broader spectrum of play options. Shadowrun is a game where starting characters aren't necessarily "first level" and the capabilities of two different groups will be dramatically impacted by how well the players understand the system and the Sixth World in general. This way we empower players to choose how much of a challenge they want.

(Yes I realize that I answered your questions in reverse order...that's the way I'm thinking today.)

I always tell the players that the table rating equals the number of characters the GM can kill in the mission.

If you're gonna do it, do it RIGHT.

Course, my sorry 20 Karma character has thus far ended up unconscious and badly hurt at the end of every Shadowrun, so... Probably something all you folks out there should keep in mind if you want to follow my example.

Especially if you're playing an uncouth, trigger-happy, slightly suicidal Street Sammy.

Bull

::check his list as bull talks:: wait I don't have uncouth ont his char,

Its OK, I have a 2 Charisma and a point in negotiation, so we're set.

Don't laugh, last year at dragon con I was in a missions game, the highest char in the group was 2 and my guy had uncouth and that was um, 2 adepts a mage and a rigger heeh.

This year, I got skill wires baby!

I think Rush actually has a Charisma of 3 (And he's an Ork!), but... Bascially, he's just a pretty face with a bad attitude behind it.

Ok, not really

I know the team at Dragon Con I normally run with takes at least a 5 table rating. Heck we kept telling the GM's during the 02's that they really should bump up our table rating by at least one lvl because we would break the missions otherwise. They normally only ignored us once if at all on that one. The 02's table ratings didn't take into account the skill of the players at all. Just the Karma of the characters. The average of the tables karma is what got you your table rating. I am glad they give us an option now.

Don't get me wrong - I have zero problems with allowing the GM and/or players the ability to be flexible with the system. However, it just seems a bit difficult for players/GMs new to Shadowrun Missions (not necessarily new to SR) to parse out the differences between table ratings without some sort of guidance. Even something like the guidance BishopMcQ just provided would be really helpful in the FAQ or mission boilerplates.

Just wanted to voice this concern so that some of the SRM folks like BishopMcQ might get wind of it and consider updating the FAQ as well as future missions.

The other question I have is this - Why can't the GM modify the TR during the mission on the fly for a better play experience?

For example, the group is having a real difficult time with a TR5 mission, and they're clearly not having a lot of fun. Why shouldn't the GM drop the TR a bit, and just give them the awards for the lower TR at the conclusion of the mission?

Of course, the reverse is also true - a group that's getting bored because they're owning a mission probably could use a little bump in the TR to make it challenging again. They'd receive the awards for the lower TR they began the mission with, but at least they'd have more fun being challenged.

Well, if you read through the mission ahead of time as a GM, you'll see that generally, the TR is a multiplier. The Payout is X*TR. For every 2 table ratinsg above X, add 2 more security guards. Threshold to beat a test is TR. Etc.

So that should give the GM an idea going in how exactly the Table Rating should effect the game. And basically, you simply explain that to the players before you let them choose. There's also a guildeline for Table Ratings in Mission 00, I believe, which is really designed as a primer for the Season 3 missions.

However, I agree, this should probably be in the FAQ as well. The same way that the ID Pass color codes should be in the Manhattan Sourcebook as well as the FAQ (And should also likely be in Mission 00 too). Disseminate the info as much as possible, folks, make it easy for GMs to find stuff!



Well, keep in mind that Missions games are designed to be "Official play" games. If, as a GM, you're simply running this for your home group, you can easily do whatever you want. But for Missions games, the guidelines are there so that, as much as possible, all the games are on an "even keel". You want the players to have fun, but you also want to challenge them. Missions are somewhat of a competitive environment, really. You don't want your players choosing a high table rating, hoping they can score some extra cash and karma, but knowing if it's too tough you'll tone things down for them.

Likewise, Table Rating sets the initial run rewards, so if the players choose low, they're going to be rewarded accordingly. Jacking the table rating up means they have a tougher game ahead of them, but unless you "retcon" the initial meet to adjust the price, it's not fair to the players.

Like I said, ideally, the rules are in place for more competitive groups and for things like special events and convention play. If you're just using Missions to demo for new players, or you're running them for your home table, then you're free to do what you like.

Bull

The TR multiplier for # of NPCs is the least influential tool in the GM's arsenal for challenging the players. NPC tactics are far more important. The TR chosen not only sets the base reward/difficulty, but also the base level of NPC tactics and intelligent response. The chosen TR also tells the GM what the players are expecting as far as the challenge. Also keep in mind early encounters challenges may not be reflective of later encounter challenges, so bumping the TR just before the end might not work out how you'd like.

It's not as if the GMs aren't modifying during the mission anyway, it's hardly like the missions are locked in stone scenarios. I've never had the same mission done the same way so far.