Edit instead of Spoofing command?
Ok, I want to take over a drone, but I can’t reach the user and I cannot spoof it, so what do I do? First I find the hidden signal (Electronic Warfare+Scan) (4) (I know what signal I’m looking for, otherwise its threshold 15+). I find the signal and realize I have to decrypt it so I make an (EW+Decrypt) then I make (Hacking+Sniffer) (3) test to tap the signal.
Now I want to edit the signal to the drone. I make a (Hackingr+Edit) test to make an illegal file editing. In this case it’s an order to rewrite it’s subscription list.
Would this be possible?
Full Version: Edit instead of Spoofing command?
You couldn’t use edit until you had logged onto (hacked into) the drones computer. So that would be your next step.
Then you would probably need to acquire an administrator account to change the subscriptions. It’s not a file it’s an operational parameter.
Edward
Then you would probably need to acquire an administrator account to change the subscriptions. It’s not a file it’s an operational parameter.
Edward
| QUOTE (Edward) |
| Then you would probably need to acquire an administrator account to change the subscriptions. It’s not a file it’s an operational parameter. Edward |
Well, I don’t edit the actual list, what I do is to edit the information that the owner sends to the drone. This way I can put in a command that the drone should change its own subscription list by itself.
That’s the point in editing information in a wireless transmission, to give misinformation. I could also send data back to the owner that the drone has veered of course while I give information to the drone to land.
I'd allow it, but I'd still make you roll versus the Pilot + Firewall to allow the drone to realize that this part of the information didn't come from the same commlink as the rest of the information or something like that. Sure, you can roll Hacking + Edit rather than Hacking + Spoof in that situation, but you've also made an extra Intercept Wireless Signal test in order to get there.
| QUOTE (Dashifen) |
| but you've also made an extra Intercept Wireless Signal test in order to get there. |
True, but I dont have to see the owners persona in order to impersonate him/her so its a fair trade.
Indeed. 'Course, that's my rational for still requiring the Pilot + Firewall test on the part of the drone 
I would also rule that you probably need to intercept a confirmation message going back to the Rigger as well. With something as important as de-subscribing a drone ther must be an: "Are you sure you want to do this?" message.
| QUOTE (mdynna) |
| I would also rule that you probably need to intercept a confirmation message going back to the Rigger as well. With something as important as de-subscribing a drone ther must be an: "Are you sure you want to do this?" message. |
Unless of course the owner removed that annoying feature ( if you are used to not having to respond to them all the time.)
Hrm, so that confirmation dialogue would mean, what, an extra Free Action needed to complete the command? It sounds like it might be worth it for some things.
Although, since the spoofing process is necessarily abstract, it might already include redirecting any confirmations to the spoofer. The Spoof action itself may also already include dealing with confirmations like that.
Although, since the spoofing process is necessarily abstract, it might already include redirecting any confirmations to the spoofer. The Spoof action itself may also already include dealing with confirmations like that.
Intercept Wireless Signal is oddly bare on the subject, but Intercepting Traffic has pretty good rules for how you would change traffic between sender and recipient and what it would mean. In that case, you roll Sniffer + Hacking vs. the target's Firewall + System in order to convincingly forge communications. I would use essentially the same roll in this case, although I'd make it Sniffer + Electronic Warfare vs. the drone's Pilot x 2 (representing System + Firewall).
As far as the RAW go, they just don't cover it, so some interpretation is necessary. Strictly, by the rules, you just can't do this; you can Edit traffic to your heart's content, but the moment you want to issue a command to a drone you have to Spoof at it.
As far as the RAW go, they just don't cover it, so some interpretation is necessary. Strictly, by the rules, you just can't do this; you can Edit traffic to your heart's content, but the moment you want to issue a command to a drone you have to Spoof at it.
| QUOTE (Azathfeld) |
| As far as the RAW go, they just don't cover it, so some interpretation is necessary. Strictly, by the rules, you just can't do this; you can Edit traffic to your heart's content, but the moment you want to issue a command to a drone you have to Spoof at it. |
Which is kinda funny in itself since editing traffic should yield the same result.
| QUOTE (Azathfeld) |
| Intercept Wireless Signal is oddly bare on the subject, but Intercepting Traffic has pretty good rules for how you would change traffic between sender and recipient and what it would mean. In that case, you roll Sniffer + Hacking vs. the target's Firewall + System in order to convincingly forge communications. I would use essentially the same roll in this case, although I'd make it Sniffer + Electronic Warfare vs. the drone's Pilot x 2 (representing System + Firewall). |
I guess that works for me, but the Intercept Traffic action specifically states that it's for intercepting wired traffic, not wireless (i.e. commcalls routed through a node). 'Course, making it an Electronic Warfare + Sniffer test seems to cover the distinction between wired and wireless very well as far as I'm concerned.
| QUOTE (Dashifen) | ||
I guess that works for me, but the Intercept Traffic action specifically states that it's for intercepting wired traffic, not wireless (i.e. commcalls routed through a node). 'Course, making it an Electronic Warfare + Sniffer test seems to cover the distinction between wired and wireless very well as far as I'm concerned. |
Remember though that the firewall is stated in all drones as part of the device rating, which is 3. Happy hacking.
And you can upgrade it to six for a mere 3000 nuyen if you so desire. Or, as others have commented. By Firewall 6 once, crack it, and load it on everything you want to.
you do know, one day someone is gonna make a spoof program that makes fun of the slang where spoof means ejaculate
Forget it. I just red the signal interception rules and you can apparently use an edit command to block a command on a wireless transmission you are monitoring.
This makes no sense as the target of the transmission received the signal at the same time you did (to within a fraction of a pico second) so logically if you wanted to block a signal you would need to do so before you received it and knew what you would be blocking, and that you cant edit a EM wave because your only listening, not acting as a pas threw node, you have to jam it.
Given this very illogical rule I don’t see a problem with replacing the command you edited out with one of your own devising, you would of cause need to make some test to make it convincing, maybe forgery your skill at copying signatures is the most relevant for this test.
Edward
This makes no sense as the target of the transmission received the signal at the same time you did (to within a fraction of a pico second) so logically if you wanted to block a signal you would need to do so before you received it and knew what you would be blocking, and that you cant edit a EM wave because your only listening, not acting as a pas threw node, you have to jam it.
Given this very illogical rule I don’t see a problem with replacing the command you edited out with one of your own devising, you would of cause need to make some test to make it convincing, maybe forgery your skill at copying signatures is the most relevant for this test.
Edward
Given how fast your reactions are in the Matrix, and that all of the SR programs are at least semi-autonomous, there's no reason to believe you wouldn't be able to edit traffic in realtime. You give the Edit program a command for what it should send, and it makes the traffic match as it passes through. That's why the Sniffer program is involved in making it convincing; your ability to match the traffic is dependent on your ability to decode the telltale signs that someone on the other end would be looking for.
Inserting a command I could believe. (Although I wouldn’t have called it an edit operation. That is not a big issue)
Knowing what your overriding or deleting before you give the command to do so I can’t.
For example if the drone your intercepting the transmission from is between you and its controller and the controller sends the drone a kill command the drone reseves the signal before you do (buy a fraction of a pico second) but you can still edit the command out of the airwaves without hacking into the drone’s systems or having a readied action. (as apposed to sending a fake cancel order)
I don’t care how fast your matrix initiative is, that shouldn’t be possible.
Edward
Knowing what your overriding or deleting before you give the command to do so I can’t.
For example if the drone your intercepting the transmission from is between you and its controller and the controller sends the drone a kill command the drone reseves the signal before you do (buy a fraction of a pico second) but you can still edit the command out of the airwaves without hacking into the drone’s systems or having a readied action. (as apposed to sending a fake cancel order)
I don’t care how fast your matrix initiative is, that shouldn’t be possible.
Edward
You could also say that you dont actually EDIT someones transmission in the sense that you remove something and putting in something else. One could just ADD something without actually removing something.
So in the sense of "Kill" command it could also receive "Trashcan" - so instead of shooting at you it aims at the trashcan five meters away from you.
So in the sense of "Kill" command it could also receive "Trashcan" - so instead of shooting at you it aims at the trashcan five meters away from you.
| QUOTE (The Jopp) |
| Edit instead of Spoofing command? Ok, I want to take over a drone, but I can’t reach the user and I cannot spoof it, so what do I do? First I find the hidden signal (Electronic Warfare+Scan) (4) (I know what signal I’m looking for, otherwise its threshold 15+). I find the signal and realize I have to decrypt it so I make an (EW+Decrypt) then I make (Hacking+Sniffer) (3) test to tap the signal. Now I want to edit the signal to the drone. I make a (Hackingr+Edit) test to make an illegal file editing. In this case it’s an order to rewrite it’s subscription list. Would this be possible? |
You have some of your operations in reverse I think...
It's Electronic Warfare+Sniffer to locate the signal. Scan is for locating specific information or devices on a node.
It's Hacking+Exploit to tap or crack into the admin account to access the device.
Now I suppose you could use a Hacking+Edit to change the admin login file and boot the current user, but that would probably draw the attention of the rigger who should counter attack. (if he's smart)
| QUOTE (Dranem) |
| You have some of your operations in reverse I think... It's Electronic Warfare+Sniffer to locate the signal. Scan is for locating specific information or devices on a node. It's Hacking+Exploit to tap or crack into the admin account to access the device. Now I suppose you could use a Hacking+Edit to change the admin login file and boot the current user, but that would probably draw the attention of the rigger who should counter attack. (if he's smart) |
no no. Im not trying to HACK the drone, im trying to use another way of making a SPOOF COMMAND without using said command.
See INTERCEPT WIRELESS SIGNAL page 225 SR4
and EDIT page 218 SR4. (for illicit editing one use hacking+edit instead of computer)
With those two rules one should be able to intercept, tap and edit information going between two wireless sources, like between an operator and his drone.
Buy the rules it can be done.
The rules make no sense for reasons described above but it can be done.
Edward
The rules make no sense for reasons described above but it can be done.
Edward
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