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Irion
Nov 15 2011, 08:23 PM
QUOTE (Dakka Dakka @ Nov 15 2011, 04:57 PM) *
No, it's not, but nothing prevents you from using 4 of the six slots to make it FA.

Ok...
QUOTE
True, but as I said, the rigger could also invest more to be better.

Yes, but it works a bit different. It is not like pay 5 Karma get a new ability to use with your dicepool...
QUOTE
Without the power focus the summoning will be a lot more risky. This item can be lost as well. Background count and other mages can mess with the spirit. Both characters have their problems with adverse conditions.

Well, depending on the focus: Losing it without dying is kind of hard...
QUOTE
It takes the mage a complex action to summon the spirit. He then needs a simple action to command the spirit to do something. The spirit then needs another complex action to materialize. So unless the spirit for some reason is always delaying its action, it takes three IPs for the spirit to enter the fray. A lot can happen during that time.

So 2 to 6 seconds...
The point is thats quite great. You do not get your drone to fly half around the world in that time.

QUOTE
The problem is that the book does not mention when such a spirit becomes visible and when it becomes targetable from the physical plane. How you handle that, can make the action a lot more scary or less.

Well, since you have to apply it to all situations (also were no spirits are around) combat starts as soon as everybody is there. So after the spirit spends the action... (Because the other way would lead to a bunch of guys somking pot in a room beening unable to be surprised, because you need to open the door first...

QUOTE
Offensive possession is powerful. Unless the spirit leaves before the composite entity hits the ground, this may cause spirit bane for the summoner. Timing this right may be difficult.

g=10m/s²
10m: 1.41 sec
20m: 2 sec
50m: 3.16 sec.
If the spirit jumps you can easy add 0.5 to 1 sec to each...


QUOTE
How transparent are clouds on the astral? echolocation and radar can pierce them, but can physical or astral sight?

Interesting question... Does water matter? I thought only solid objects matter...
Dakka Dakka
Nov 15 2011, 09:01 PM
QUOTE (Irion @ Nov 15 2011, 09:23 PM) *
Yes, but it works a bit different. It is not like pay 5 Karma get a new ability to use with your dicepool...
It's like that for the mage only if he invests in spellcasting.

QUOTE (Irion @ Nov 15 2011, 09:23 PM) *
Well, depending on the focus: Losing it without dying is kind of hard...
Unless you do shenanigans like a tattoo focus or an implanted one there are always pickpockets. Also you may not always have it with you. So there may be burglars. an easily concealed possibly disguised as inconspicuous item worth 100k¥ will be very attractive to thieves.

QUOTE (Irion @ Nov 15 2011, 09:23 PM) *
So 2 to 6 seconds...
The point is thats quite great. You do not get your drone to fly half around the world in that time.
If the drone is half way across the world there may also be background count at the girl friends house.


QUOTE (Irion @ Nov 15 2011, 09:23 PM) *
Well, since you have to apply it to all situations (also were no spirits are around) combat starts as soon as everybody is there. So after the spirit spends the action... (Because the other way would lead to a bunch of guys somking pot in a room beening unable to be surprised, because you need to open the door first...
I don't get the pot smoking example. At the worst the combat will start after the spirit is materialized but before it has its next action. depending on initiative there is plenty to do between those two points.


g=10m/s²
10m: 1.41 sec
20m: 2 sec
50m: 3.16 sec.
If the spirit jumps you can easy add 0.5 to 1 sec to each...

QUOTE (Irion @ Nov 15 2011, 09:23 PM) *
Interesting question... Does water matter? I thought only solid objects matter...
I never heard about that restriction. Moreover even stuff that is transparent physically is opaque on the astral (for example glass).
Irion
Nov 16 2011, 06:49 AM
@Dakka Dakka
QUOTE
It's like that for the mage only if he invests in spellcasting.

Which are 16BP or 22 karma....

QUOTE
Unless you do shenanigans like a tattoo focus or an implanted one there are always pickpockets. Also you may not always have it with you. So there may be burglars. an easily concealed possibly disguised as inconspicuous item worth 100k¥ will be very attractive to thieves.

Make it a Ring. And a thieve would need to be magically talented to know that. For a normal thieve it might just be a wodden ring.

QUOTE
If the drone is half way across the world there may also be background count at the girl friends house.

So what? 1-2 Points of BC? This makes it a Force 7 or in the worst case force 6 spirit. It will still hold against some goons out of the Corebook... Yes, of course... If I send a team of prime runners it won't.... (I guess even an effective force 4 spirit would do ok...)
QUOTE
I never heard about that restriction. Moreover even stuff that is transparent physically is opaque on the astral (for example glass).

Air does not block it...

The main upside of spirits is not, that they are increadibly strong. Thats true for high force. The upside is, you are always able to count on them. (There are very few occasion, when this is not true)
Draco18s
Nov 16 2011, 03:36 PM
QUOTE (Irion @ Nov 16 2011, 01:49 AM) *
Air does not block it...


Does water?

That's the question.
Irion
Nov 16 2011, 04:07 PM
@Draco18s
Indeed...
Makki
Aug 24 2012, 07:23 AM
Final result
for a materialization tradition

Man [ 36 ]
Guardian [ 35 ]
Task [ 28 ]
Guidance [ 28 ]
Air [ 27 ]

for a possession tradition

Guardian [ 37 ]
Man [ 35 ]
Task [ 34 ]
Plant [ 22 ]
Guidance [ 22 ]


So no surprises here, I guess.
Starmage21
Aug 24 2012, 11:59 AM
Seems like thats how it turns out in play too.

Just dont forget that Voodoo is pretty much the most powerful tradition there is, and most GMs wont bat an eye at you playing it because it appears in a book. You get Guardian, Guidance, Task spirits in that tradition, the only one youre missing is Plant.
Lantzer
Aug 24 2012, 04:20 PM
QUOTE (Midas @ Nov 9 2011, 04:58 AM) *
Spirits of Man are good for their innate spell ability. Guardians are good at combat, especially as noted for Possession traditions. Task Spirits are good for doing stuff. No wonder they are bossing the polling so far.

Plant Spirits are good for regeneration, esp. for Possession traditions. Guidance Spirits are as good as their divination powers are allowed to be. Air Spirits are good for movement, and are pretty hot at engulfing when it comes to combat. Earth Spirits can be good if you need to dig a hole or stop a car dead in the road.


Actually, I like earth spirits for when a high-power team wants to destroy an entire facility. Earthquakes.
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