Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: So, do corporations participate in the Olympics?
Dumpshock Forums > Discussion > Shadowrun
Wakshaani
Since we have corporate land and corporate citizenship, does, say, Mitsuhama field Olympic teams?

The idea of the Shiawase team trotting out on the field, waving the corporate logo... it feels *right*.
nezumi
This is an awesome idea. I can't believe it hasn't been brought up yet, but I have to believe the answer is yes.
Sticks
According to Shadowbeat the Olympics was opened to multinational corporate teams in 2044 and winning a medal is worth big corp prestige. around a fifth of all medals are won by corporate ' Amateur ' athletes.
Wakshaani
QUOTE (Sticks @ Jan 2 2012, 10:32 AM) *
According to Shadowbeat the Olympics was opened to multinational corporate teams in 2044 and winning a medal is worth big corp prestige. around a fifth of all medals are won by corporate ' Amateur ' athletes.


Remind me to kiss my copy of Shadowbeat again.

SUCH a good book.
JongWK
SotA 2064 has an Olympic Games update, including corporations (Yamatetsu) vying for the privilege of hosting them.
SpellBinder
Don't see why not. The AAA corps are effectively countries in their own right in this game setting. Also, in skimming through Spy Games there's talk about the 2072 Winter Olympics being in Denver, with notes about Aztechnology trying to sneak their athletes into the games and Shiawase sponsoring a Shinto mission beforehand.
Snow_Fox
We've already confirmed they can field teams but the issue becomes would would want to? I mena from a 3rd world nation they certainly provide a source of training on a par with 1st world powers but would an American or Frenchman or German be as willing to compete for their job as they could their ocuntry. You can be fired from Novatech, you cannot be 'fired' from being a Frenchman or a German.
3278
QUOTE (Snow_Fox @ Jan 2 2012, 10:29 PM) *
...but would an American or Frenchman or German be as willing to compete for their job as they could their ocuntry. You can be fired from Novatech, you cannot be 'fired' from being a Frenchman or a German.

The NFL, NASCAR, NBA, Formula One, and NHL are all corporate organizations made up of professional athletes, whose numbers completely dwarf the national teams fielded for the Olympics. Nationalism isn't the only reason people compete: Ares would have no difficulty finding someone willing to run for them in exchange for money, never mind the satisfaction of competition.
Paul
That sums it up pretty well. The Olympics are a great way to garner some positive publicity, not to mention product placement opportunities. And that's just the legitimate side of things....
Christian Lafay
That would be an interesting run. "My client would like you to secure positions inside of the corporation and then try out for the Olympics. Each of you have been slated for the event(s) you would be suited best for. See attached files."

The shooting events would be INTENSE between the security teams.
Paul
It'd be a great way to scope out what kind of talent a corporation could produce as well.
Wakshaani
HUGE PR move, you gotta think.

"Mr Rosa was a SINless child deep in the Redmond barrens when we found him. To Seattle, he was just another SINless waste of life. But here at Shiawase, we respect every member of our family and we know that each member brings a unique set of tools to the corporation. We gave him a chance ... he gave us a gold medal. Now, he's on teh cover of our magazines, on our news broadcasts, and starring in a new sim from our studio. Mr Rosa started with little more than the shirt on his back and now? Now he's a multimillionaire. Join the Shiawase family, and you might be the next Mr Rosa."
Christian Lafay
QUOTE (Wakshaani @ Jan 3 2012, 01:54 AM) *
HUGE PR move, you gotta think.

"Mr Rosa was a SINless child deep in the Redmond barrens when we found him. To Seattle, he was just another SINless waste of life. But here at Shiawase, we respect every member of our family and we know that each member brings a unique set of tools to the corporation. We gave him a chance ... he gave us a gold medal. Now, he's on teh cover of our magazines, on our news broadcasts, and starring in a new sim from our studio. Mr Rosa started with little more than the shirt on his back and now? Now he's a multimillionaire. Join the Shiawase family, and you might be the next Mr Rosa."

That actually made me want to join the company.
3278
And in terms of views-per-nuyen, you can't put your logo anywhere more profitable than on the jersey [or fender] of the professional athlete of your choice. For, say, $10-15 million, you can sponsor a NASCAR team for a season, which means your logo on the car, on the driver's jumpsuit, on the hat worn by the driver during weekday interviews, your company name being said every time your car leads a lap or passes or gets passed in a notable way, and on race day, it'll be seen by 8+ million pairs of eyeballs, dozens of times. If you figure your logo is seen or your company name mentioned a mere 10 times during the race [an absurdly low estimate], that's 2,880,000,000 exposures for less than $15 million, or an astonishing 200-ish exposures per dollar. And that figure is likely off by an order of magnitude or more.

If corporations were allowed into the Olympics - as they are in Shadowrun - it would be big business, bigger business than the Olympics already are. Over 200 million people watched NBC's Olympic coverage in Beijing for more than six minutes: that's a lot of exposures for a comparatively small investment.
CanRay
QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Jan 2 2012, 09:12 PM) *
That actually made me want to join the company.
That tells me just how much they want to use people for as much potential as possible for themselves.
Christian Lafay
QUOTE (CanRay @ Jan 3 2012, 04:42 AM) *
That tells me just how much they want to use people for as much potential as possible for themselves.

That as well, but being the kind of guy I am (on three medical research call lists) I'm OK with that.
kzt
QUOTE (Sticks @ Jan 2 2012, 09:32 AM) *
According to Shadowbeat the Olympics was opened to multinational corporate teams in 2044 and winning a medal is worth big corp prestige. around a fifth of all medals are won by corporate ' Amateur ' athletes.

"Once again, for the 7th time running, Team Ares sweeps all the shooting events!"
"Well Bob, did they win any other medals?"
"No, they didn't complete in any other events."
kzt
QUOTE (3278 @ Jan 2 2012, 06:42 PM) *
For, say, $10-15 million, you can sponsor a NASCAR team for a season, which means your logo on the car, on the driver's jumpsuit, on the hat worn by the driver during weekday interviews, your company name being said every time your car leads a lap or passes or gets passed in a notable way, and on race day, it'll be seen by 8+ million pairs of eyeballs, dozens of times.

I think it is 10-20 million for a primary sponsor these days.

I've seen figures that a top team spends >400 million, but that is across their multiple drivers and the 20 or so cars they have.

How do you make a small fortune in racing? Start with a large fortune. ...
bibliophile20
QUOTE (kzt @ Jan 3 2012, 02:24 AM) *
How do you make a small fortune in racing? Start with a large fortune. ...


Yacht racing, too. "A boat is a hole in the water into which the owner tries to fill with money."

Hmmm... that makes me wonder: how do you think yacht racing is doing in the 6th World? It's a rich man's sport (and there's lots of rich execs that would love to have something to boast about) but at the same time, between the ecoterrorists, shadowrunners, and the Awakened aquatic life that think humans taste great, there's definitely an element of risk that wasn't there in the 5th.
CanRay
QUOTE (bibliophile20 @ Jan 3 2012, 03:37 AM) *
Yacht racing, too. "A boat is a hole in the water into which the owner tries to fill with money."
Tell that to the owners and operators of the "Bluenose". wink.gif
3278
QUOTE (kzt @ Jan 3 2012, 07:24 AM) *
I think it is 10-20 million for a primary sponsor these days.

A la carte, yes, but if you buy for the whole season, you can usually get it down around the figures I was quoting.
Paul
Can someone sponsor me? I'm pretty cheap, even if I'm also useless. smile.gif This is a fun topic-so how do people feel about corporate sponsored teams outside the AAA corporations. AA's? A's? Where do you see the lines being drawn?
Christian Lafay
Sometimes I doubt things like NASCAR advertising work. Then I see the people at Target.
Ascalaphus
QUOTE (Paul @ Jan 3 2012, 06:59 PM) *
Can someone sponsor me? I'm pretty cheap, even if I'm also useless. smile.gif This is a fun topic-so how do people feel about corporate sponsored teams outside the AAA corporations. AA's? A's? Where do you see the lines being drawn?


It depends on whether augmentation (and adepts) are allowed.

If augmentations are allowed, then smaller biotech firms could use the Olympics to show off. Likewise, you could have adept societies competing against each other.

Sure, it violates the "pure human" idea, but if they're barred from the Olympics, they might set up a rival event, perhaps Ultimate Olympics, where they use superhuman performance to make the Olympics look cute but small and limited, kind of like how ice hockey cramps the attempts of figure skating to look manly...
CanRay
QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Jan 3 2012, 02:57 PM) *
Sometimes I doubt things like NASCAR advertising work. Then I see the people at Target.
My character, Nas, drove the 711 Stuffer Shack car. biggrin.gif
3278
QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Jan 3 2012, 07:57 PM) *
Sometimes I doubt things like NASCAR advertising work. Then I see the people at Target.

It definitely works, the same way that advertising almost certainly works to get you to buy the stuff you do. Hell, I'm about as ad-blind as you can get - no television, radio, newspaper, or magazines, and almost no ad-supported websites except Google - and I'm sure it works on me. I've seen the Home Depot car, even though I don't watch NASCAR, and that will play a role in deciding where I shop when I think, "Hmm, I need to pick up this home improvement widget." [Of course, I'll just go to the local hardware store, but you get the point!] Advertising is whack, but what's most whack of all is how well it works.

QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Jan 3 2012, 08:00 PM) *
It depends on whether augmentation (and adepts) are allowed.

As of the 2056 games, neither are allowed. [Shadowbeat, p63.] The only other place I know of that the Olympics are discussed is SOTA:2064 [p164], and there's no mention of augmentation and magic there. If anyone can think of any other books they'd like me to look in, I'd be happy to. [This will get easier once I've finished scanning all the SR and ED books and OCRing them; sorry!]

QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Jan 3 2012, 08:00 PM) *
Sure, it violates the "pure human" idea, but if they're barred from the Olympics, they might set up a rival event, perhaps Ultimate Olympics, where they use superhuman performance to make the Olympics look cute but small and limited, kind of like how ice hockey cramps the attempts of figure skating to look manly...

Yeah, I can't imagine that at some point, someone wouldn't start a competition which allows such things. [Unless they started it themselves, it wouldn't be called "Olympic" anything: they're really, really, really serious about that.] Now, granted, these sports all have their own leagues and such where augmentation and magic might be allowed, but it's hard not to think that someone, somewhere, would find it profitable to start the Ultimate Games, where athletes from every nation and megacorporation compete in all the major events during a month-long every-four-years event.
Paul
Just for the record, I imagine corporations would have no shortage of non-augmented personages to stock an Olympic team with. It's big business today, the future likely holds nothing different on that front.

As for Augmented individuals I am sure I'll catch hell for this, but I imagine there are plenty of markets-niche markets mind you-for displaying them in some public manner. TV Shows like Mythbusters, and many more are immensely popular. Now project them 70 years into a dystopic future! Truck drivers fighting awakened creatures. Loggers with built in chainsaws. Really the only limit is the market share. Sure the local street samurai might not make it into the Olympics-although i am sure there's some market for messing with the opposition's team by injecting nanites, etc...-but maybe you can be UCAS Pickers 207x?
3278
QUOTE (3278 @ Jan 3 2012, 08:41 PM) *
As of the 2056 games, neither are allowed.

Oh! I forgot to mention: performance-enhancing drugs are, though. What the limits are of that is anyone's guess.

QUOTE (Paul @ Jan 3 2012, 09:39 PM) *
Just for the record, I imagine corporations would have no shortage of non-augmented personages to stock an Olympic team with. It's big business today, the future likely holds nothing different on that front.

It's also worth pointing out that there's nothing canon about the legality of genetic engineering and the Olympics.

QUOTE (Paul @ Jan 3 2012, 09:39 PM) *
As for Augmented individuals I am sure I'll catch hell for this, but I imagine there are plenty of markets-niche markets mind you-for displaying them in some public manner.

Niche, nothing: I would assume there would be some "broadcast channels" on which it would be odd for more than a few minutes in a day to not feature someone Augmented, doing something crazy. biggrin.gif I would think a pretty substantial portion of the "airtime" is filled with people, real and virtual, doing insane things with their augmented bodies. It's all humans have ever done, and the potential to ratchet that shit up a notch is unreal! The "purity" of the Olympics would be, I would think, the exception, by a long shot.

Massive changes in pornography, too.
Snow_Fox
QUOTE (3278 @ Jan 2 2012, 05:14 PM) *
The NFL,..., NBA,.... , and NHL are all corporate organizations made up of professional athletes, whose numbers completely dwarf the national teams fielded for the Olympics. Nationalism isn't the only reason people compete:

I'm not going to go along with that, I removed NASCAR/formula 1 because those aren't team sports in the olympics. but to look at NHL and NBA these are leagues and pay big big bucks in professional sports but the players proudly go back to their home nations, especially Baseball, the MLB might be the big deal if you play in America but when it comes time for the Olympics the naitonal pride is big and that's now. the same for soccer/football- the euro-leagues are the big deal but when the torch is lit, people return home. So what can the corp offer? Me RL worked for Xerox in the 90's and had soem pride in that but I'm not with them now...ok I'm probably not the best choice for htis since I tend to be a snarky sarcastic pain in my bosses' collective buts no matter where I go but still..
CanRay
Hockey is always popular in Canada. wink.gif

I never worked for a company big enough to field a team. (No, the Gubbermint job doesn't count, I was a Temp.).
Paul
When corporations become as powerful as Nation States-in terms of influence wielded, and actual square footage controlled, it's easy to see how in various places in Shadowrun setting material, and fiction various employees take as much pride in their corporate affiliation as others do their national affiliation. It'd be virtually identical in terms of most things.
3278
QUOTE (Snow_Fox @ Jan 4 2012, 03:44 AM) *
I'm not going to go along with that, I removed NASCAR/formula 1 because those aren't team sports in the olympics. but to look at NHL and NBA these are leagues and pay big big bucks in professional sports but the players proudly go back to their home nations, especially Baseball, the MLB might be the big deal if you play in America but when it comes time for the Olympics the naitonal pride is big and that's now. the same for soccer/football- the euro-leagues are the big deal but when the torch is lit, people return home.

The simple canon answer to that is, as Paul mentions, that the corp is "home," is "nation," for a large number of people. They willingly get zaibatsu tattoos, and care deeply about the personality quirks of their leaders. For some people - not all, by any means - loyalty to the corporation would supplant nationalism. Again, this doesn't have to be true for everyone, just enough people to field a decent track team. smile.gif

One thing I don't know, and wouldn't know where to start looking: if you're an Ares citizen, can you compete for the UCAS in the Olympics?

QUOTE (Snow_Fox @ Jan 4 2012, 03:44 AM) *
Me RL worked for Xerox in the 90's and had soem pride in that but I'm not with them now.

The less simple just-me answer is that most people are like you [and me]: their loyalty to the corporation that feeds [and houses and clothes and governs, in Shadowrun] you is pretty minimal, and very mercurial. [Of course, national loyalty is often remarkably plastic, as well.] They're not competing in the Olympics because they love the corp, any more than most modern Olympic athletes are doing it for their pride in their nation. You mention a lot of today's athletes play hockey in the NHL for Canada but go home to Russia to play in the Olympics, but if Canada was paying twice what Russia could, how many guys would stick around? Enough to field a decent team? I mean, that has to be true, or else they'd be playing professional hockey in Russia still! They go where the money is.

QUOTE (Snow_Fox @ Jan 4 2012, 03:44 AM) *
So what can the corp offer?

A roof over your head, forever; for many, this alone would be worth selling your soul.
Free PR, and exclusive access to endorsement deals worth millions.
The chance to compete at an international level; for any athlete I've ever known, this would be more than enough.
Training and equipment at no cost, for life.
Access to pleasures and vices that would be considered extralegal in nation-states.
Money, money, money.
Fame, the chance to be well-known and publicly appreciated.
World-class nutrition and supplements, aka free food.
Sex. People really like to have sex with famous athletes. I mean, so I hear. [Call me, Shaq?]
The simple pleasure of bringing glory to the people who feed and clothe you, who educated you, who bought [and made] your first car, who paid for [and produced] the song you lost your virginity to. Nobody loves the company store, and the company boss less so, but the company is something people will even fight and die for, in Shadowrun, and why wouldn't they? The corporations have done more for most of their citizens than any government ever did for you or I, and all they ask for in return is everything.
CanRay
I just threw up. A little. In my mouth.

And a lot. In the toilet.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Dumpshock Forums © 2001-2012