New conceptual art released.

http://www.harebrained-schemes.com.s3.amaz...eet_market1.png

For me, the background is awesome, but the characters are too cartoony to me, I would prefer if they adopted a more serious tone.

What do you guys think ?

1) The image is clearly marked as concept art (see upper left corner).

2) At that scale, you basically have to exaggerate features in order for characters to be recognizable.

That said, I love it. I think they nailed the atmosphere. I wouldn't be unhappy if the characters were a little more realistic-looking, but I honestly think they're just about at the limit of what's possible at that scale.

I LOVE IT!!!!

Nice point about the recognizable char features, Tanegar. Anyway, I dont thik they should drop the cartoon/comics-like art, just make it a bit more serious. The old editions archetypes are a great example of what Im talking about: http://i.imgur.com/jgH90l.jpg

Man, those pieces really kick you in the balls with how 80s they are...

Anyway, back on topic, I'm not sure what you mean by "serious" in this context. All of those look pretty cartoonish to me, in the sense that they could easily have leapt out of a mid-to-late 80s Saturday morning cartoon. Do you mean more "black trenchcoat" as opposed to "pink mohawk?" I would hope that the game would have content catering to both of those modes, TBH.

No. By more "serious" I mean more proportionate body parts, less vivid colors, sober faces and expressions, etc. Its not because its comics-like that it must resemble Disney.

Look at this and tell me if it doesnt resemble a Disney or Warcraft piece: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yepLu4cHQ5I...player_embedded

The 80s were the acme of our civilization.

Everything had more style back then . .

But seriously, i'd like the Fallout 1/2 Art-Style with a higher resolution better.
More dreary and drab. Used up, burned and damaged with all life sucked out.

I fell in love with Shadowrun Returns when the last couple of bits of concept art came out, and it's only getting bigger the more that I see pieces like this.

Just because it uses bright, cheery colors doesn't make it less cyberpunk; look at The Fifth Element. I'm loving this style, and can't wait to see more / play the game. Plus, Returns is supposed to be set in the 50s (so stylistically, the 80s) - look at the neon all over the place and tell me it isn't perfect for that frame of reference.

ETA: one thing I wanted to add - I love the outdoor restaurant there, but where's the cover from the rain? A silly thing to notice, but it just picked at my brain, haha.

You know what, I go the other way, I say not cartoony enough.

Seriously.

Every PC game down through the (few its been in existence) ages that has tried to look realistic, gritty, etc looks like shit now IMHO. It doesn't stand the test of time, hell, after a few years pass what was marketed as that when it was released now seems to be more recognizable by what stylistic, cartoony choices it made if at all.

I want a game that I can pretend looks just as good the day it was released years later when I am still playing it from time to time just because the gameplay was awesome. If there is to be any "serious", I hope its in the choices I get to make as a character within the setting, that there, within that world those choices have impact and consequences.

They should have done cell shading.

Yup, Borderlands is awesome, despite (really, in part because of) the 'cartoony' look. It would just be another FPS without it's unique look.

As a matter of fact, when the game was first announced in 2007 it was aiming for a much more serious look and story, complete with dull faded colors. Other differences include Mordecai's character model originally being a generic bandit enemy and only three playable characters. Anyways...

I don't find it "too cartoony". I heard this same comment about earlier concept art and honestly, I don't know why so many people keep saying that. Shadowrun was never grimdark serious, and pretty much all the artwork in previous editions would have a place in cheesy comic books if it couldn't get into a cartoon program. Has anyone here actually read up on some of the First Ed adventure modules? The first firefight(within Underground 93) in Mercurial gives the option for shamen to summon a hearth spirit of the following description:


Yeah. I don't think the artwork so far is doing Shadowrun a disservice by being slightly colorful. Except maybe the leftmost ork in this piece. The hell kind of SURGE mutations did he pick up?

Maybe he's British. You know what they say about th Brits, and bad teeth ...

That hearth spirit description is awesome, in a gonzo way.


What a huge load of crap. Did you actually tried hard to make the least sense possible or did this just flowed out like a fart ?


If by this you mean Fallout-like choice-consequence interplay then give up. The authors already said the game wont portray this kind of gameplay. Hopefully, Wasteland 2 will have plenty of that, though.


Yeah, thats awful. If the portraits end up like GorillaZ characters I will cry. I think at least the portraits should be more serious. Like the ones seen in this page. (from the SNES Shadowrun game)

Ok, looking again, the SNES game also was kind of comics-like in style.... hmmm... Im starting to like that image. I think if the other game elements (sound, dialogues, animations, etc) turn up having a more serious tone and atmosphere it will be awesome, with or without cartoon chars.

Think of it this way: The art style helps characters stand out better from the background. Rather nice when you think about the bleak, drab urban grays of the barrens or the nice, tidy and clean white and blues of corporate lobby's and shopping centers. It's makes the characters seem like they have more personality, such that they can be recognized even against a crowd. Granted, standing out isn't normally something professional runners want to do at all, but for the sake of art and gaming, it's a good thing in this case.

I think we're good for atmosphere, anyway. It just so happens to make a good wallpaper.

Farside-esque Caption: "Damnit Steve, this is exactly why we don't let you drive!"

Since you clearly don't know what you are talking about, here is this helpful video that will give you some sense of how games that were released in the past in their attempts to look realistic look either decidedly cartoony or janky compared to modern advances in how scenes are rendered in games. Take a good hard look at say Soldier of Fortune, that was meant to be realistic and serious. And there were many other titles there that meant to be realistic but now the more fantastical elements of their settings are now their more defining visual attributes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVEw5_zInBg

And don't think for a second this doesn't happen in other types of game than FPS either. Abstraction aka "cartoony" as a visual design aesthetic simply lasts longer in trying to give a game character than trying to skirt the Uncanny Valley.

Ok Canadian, now I got it. By "cartoony" there you meant "hand-drawed/2d ilustrations" enduring more the test of time than 3d graphics. I agree with that. Thats one of the reasons old games like SNES Shadowrun or King of Dragon Pass are much better on the eyes nowadays than, say, early pure 3d games like Dungeon Siege or Neverwinter Nights 1.

But Im not really objecting the fact of it being hand-drawed/comics-like, mind you. Im just objecting to that particular style of hand-drawing, that falls more on the World of Warcraft side than, say, Akira or Laubenstein´s archetypes one or any other 80s art style (these last ones would be prefereble in my opinion, since the premise of the project in the first place is returning Shadowrun to its roots - that I understand here as 1e and 2e).

The original Soldier of Fortune always looked cartoony, like a boob-less edition of Heavy Metal.

BLASPHEMY!

Yeah, that's close enough to what I was trying to get across that I think you may understand (but obviously not agree) with my following stance:

Some of my favourite games that still manage to look good to me (and possibly objectively to many others as well) despite their use of obsolete rendering technology has had to do with the stylistic choices in presentation with the tools they had available to them at the time. XCOM, Doom, Star Control 2 (Urquan Masters), No One Lives Forever, XIII, and Freedom Force (which that concept art totally made me think of due to its particular top down perspective) down through the gaming ages when I recall the multitude of WWII games that were meant to look serious in lock step with them, these more cartoony looking games win hands down for me every time. Freedom Force's look compared to say Jagged Alliance 2's look, I think Freedom Force wins - and its the more cartoony parts of Jagged Alliance 2 that I recall looking good still.

So I think we still disagree on style, especially when I consider what stands out to me from the roots of Shadowrun, it wasn't their choices for what was serious but what pops out from the dystopian setting despite being shrouded in shadows.



And you're nuts (on this), Ronin. At the time it was released, SoF was being praised by game reviewers and fellow PC gamers for its "realistic violence" which has everything to do with its look. Graphic violence that to us now looks ridiculous and cartoony. Like Heavy Metal, bah, bollocks!

Even John Mullins himself said it wasn't realistic. "A glock in 9mm won't usually blow someone's head off, but I guess for a game you need a little pizzaz."


I felt that SoF II was more realistic in terms of gore and mangling, personally.

I think most games exagerate a bit on the glitz and explosions, to give a more hollywoodian feel. Only games like ARMA 2 or Operation Flashpoint: Cold War Crysis strive to be really realistic. But those are the exception, I think.

Soldier of Fortune 1 cutscenes: http://youtu.be/3-JUmTHkkFQ

Here's the real John Mullins, which is funny after watching the cutscenes: http://youtu.be/2KR3lwSMgnA

I really wanted to see a Shadowrun game that breathes 80´s zeitgeist style-wise (art, music, comics, fashion, etc) - Kreftwerk, Blade Runner, Akira, Watchman, Road Warrior, Terminator, Ramones, etc. (having Eddie Murphy as an NPC would be a plus. )

Lets hope the upcoming Cyberpunk 2020 pc game hears me.

New art released on PAX Prime: http://kotaku.com/shadowrun/

I specially liked the Stuffer Shack firefight.

Also, the new models feel more serious/less silly, and the new illumination effects got the previous redmond screen more dark and gritty.

Now we are talking baby.

I'm goinna shoot me up a Stuffer Shack BUT good!

i like it, its what i would imagine a true SR: MMO would look like