And yet, it is still nothing but a battery. *shrug*

And yet, it is still nothing but a Fission engine. *shrug*

And yet, it's just a zero-point-energy module *shrug*

Well, all lasers have either [Clip] or [External Source]


I agree that the description of the clips in question is [Special Peak-Discharge Battery Packs] so the OR COULD be higher than 3 but the only special thing might just be the [Peak-Discharge] part.

So you need a regular portable battery with an access port for the guns clip to charge with.

So - OR3
You recharge a battery, not the gun or it's super advanced clip. Problem solved.

if your recharging a laser "battery" use the standard battery. IE w.e the OR for a battery is. do not make it over technical, charging a battery is charging a battery, no matter what its being used for

Sure, but magic is not that easy - you need 1 hit with ignite to set a rock on fire, but 2 for gasoline, because gasoline is a "Manufactured Low-Tech Object".
While a normal car battery might be a "Manufactured High-Tech Object", but even a modern laptop/cell phone battery is a "Highly Processed Object".

I would disagree with that analogy.

The problem is that the rules needs to be a bit clearer.

A flammable liquid is not in my eyes a "manufactured object" and should instead go against "Barrier rating" with a bonus to ignite due to it's nature.

The rock would have to be against it's Barrier Rating due to it being, lets face it, a rock. Common sense would have to be used here a bit more.

By that logic WATER would be easier to Ignite than Gasoline and that just smacks of insanity.

Read the Spell, it is on p. 210, SR4A. And yes, water is easier to ignite with that spell - but:


It would be extinguished that instant it begins to burn.

PS: MAGIC defiles logic ^^

Because:
*waves hands*
MAAGIIC! @.@

its a battery... how is it more processed than other batteries? in that idea if you took a model-T car, it would be easier to manipulate magically then a car today? (bad analogy, but screw it lol) a batter does the same thing, the device its powering may be MUCH more technologically advanced, but a battery is, and always will be, a storage area for electrical/chemical/biological/something else that end in cal.

can't help but say this, thus the firewater spell was born!

Try to build yourself a "Lead–acid battery" - this is fairly easy, and can be done by middle-schoolers. Now try and make the thing that powers your cell phone. And then try and make one with the size of a rifle magazine, that powers a friggin LASER strong enough to kill people with a short blast.

*Magic Finger Facepalm*

Seriously, those parts around the magic rules are fucked up when I can more easily burn water than gasoline.

Hey...

My magician will now use a F2 sustaining foci to permanently have a F2 Ignite spell on a piece of raw diamond.

The diamond will burn continously and heat up the water in his steam car but due to it being diamond never burn up.

See - perpetual energy.

Common use of the word, "battery" in electrical terms, is limited to an electrochemical device that converts chemical energy into electricity, by a galvanic cell. A galvanic cell is a fairly simple device consisting of two electrodes of different metals or metal compounds (an anode and a cathode) and an electrolyte (usually acid, but some are alkaline) solution. A "Battery" is two or more of those cells in series, although many types of single cells are usually referred to as batteries - such as flashlight batteries.

As noted above, a battery is an electrical storage device. Batteries do not make electricity, they store it, just as a water tank stores water for future use. As chemicals in the battery change, electrical energy is stored or released. In rechargeable batteries this process can be repeated many times. Batteries are not 100% efficient - some energy is lost as heat and chemical reactions when charging and discharging.

this I believe is one of the most common used, useful and simplistic batteries to date.

Its a deep cycle battery, like one that would be used to fire a laser repeatedly until out of charge.

You say Battery I say Battery

One will shock you and the other get someone arrested.

*sees what you did there* lol

Defiles or defies? Although I'm not sure the distinction matters. You could say magic defiles logic by defying it.

I know where your coming from but your thinking that all batteries are a simple as a car batter. some batteries are ever bit as complex and highly processed as a circuit board because well they are circuit boards. Look up Thin-Film Batteries.

http://designs.digikey.com/library/4294959853/4294959856/840
http://www.cymbet.com/design-center/microc...ler-back-up.php

No it's not. It generates electricity by a chemical reaction, rechargeable batteries uses a process that reverts the chemical change when subjected to an electric current.
There's nothing being stored.
As far as I'm aware there's no way to actually store electricity. Which is why modern batteries got such a limited lifespan

I had to doublecheck that since I'm no engineer, still might have gotten it wrong

However on the topics of friggin' lasers!
No matter how you twist or turn it, our definition of battery could never power a 'portable' laser cannon, It's arguing that something that doesn't exist in the realm of science today isn't bloody complex ^^

Batteries store potential energy.

Here's a better example to explain what batteries do.

Let's say you have a solar farm. The energy that isn't used on the grid is used to pump water into a retention pond. At night that water is let out of the pond past water turbines to generate electricity. Now, you're not going to get as much energy as was used to pump the water, but it's a mechanism we use to store excess generated energy for latter usage.

So for batteries, we use energy to create the battery so that a portion of the energy used in creating the battery may be accessed at a later date.

Diamonds are actually fairly flammable.

Seeing how they are, basically, just nicer looking coal . .

I was going to call bullshit until I looked it up. It's actually kind of cool.

most expensive heating you will ever find . .

You know you've hit it big as a Shadowrunner when you heat your squat with diamonds.

I use storage device as stating it STORES the capability to create electrical power when the circuit is "closed" and has the ability to "recharge" when the circuit is reversed. the battery itself is NOT complex, merely the items in which the circuit runs through. in a somewhat bad example, your moving forward, then moving back. (but by going back you gain NRG you spent moving forward)

I still call bullshit,it takes INSANE amounts of NRG (or heat) to cause this, and even then it would burn at a painstakingly slow rate.

Yes. It isn't going to go up when you slide your hand over a candleflame, but if your house catches fire, your jewelry will be in puddles of gold and your diamonds will be missing.

actually, from what I read the diamonds would be just fine, from a house fire. (if a little scorched or blackened from ash i should say)

I only read one thing, but I declare my one thing to be superior, because.

I'm happy we agree on this.

lol I OBJECT SIR, on account of the fact that aliens cannot nor ever will, wear hats.

You can store Electricity in a Capacitor but not for long periods as they tend to leak (and the amount is very limited), and you can store Electricity in a Superconductor, however getting a Room temperature superconductor is so far not practical (although a good room temperature Superconductor would be a major breakthrough for a megacorp in Shadowrun) the best seems to be around 138K although there are some so far unverified claims of better

back to somewhat of the OP, question about shotguns, are they treated like ARs and the like. OR are they always treated as described with chokes. also, does flechette ammo add the bonuses and penalties overtop of the normal shotgun rules? (ex, medium choke is +0DV, +4AP, with flechette would it be +2DV, +6AP?)

and what advanatages does the shotgun have over pistols/ARs/BRs? (if any)

Some have houseruled that Stick-n-Shock ammo may only be fired from Shotguns.

They have the best base Damage value, (until Battle rifles came) which is important for killing spirits and stuff.

And a BurstFire Shotgun is basically an XL SMG.

so.... treat them just like normal SMGs or ARs, with the OPTION of shooting flechette in narrow, medium or wide chokes??>

Diamond ignites at 850 °C-1000 °C in air at standard pressure [wiki]. For comparison, the average temperature of a candle flame is 1000 °C [wiki]. That's not to say that you could just apply a bunsen burner to the Golden Jubilee Diamond and watch it become CO2 instantly, but it does mean that smaller diamonds can go poof in a campfire, and will go poof if your house burns down.

Except we are discussing Batteries, not Engines. So, your point is useless to the discussion.

And there's where you're making your mistake. Why use batteries when you could use a fusion reactor to power your gun? or a fuel cell, or an arc reactor?

More seriously, a laser weapon with integrated capacitor banks and a fuel cell could potentially work, with a 'clip' in the form of a pressurized hydrogen container. It'd only be practical if there were enough fuel-cell cars on the roads that you could refill your canisters from your local gas station, but on the plus side it'd be possible to simply hook it up to any source of hydrogen and keep plugging away... Might be useful out in the sticks where the power grid is nonexistant but you can fill the back of your ute with gas canisters without raising too many eyebrows.

Nah, why bother? A backpack mounted nuclear accelerator is the only power source you'll ever need!

As far as the rules go they CAN use the same kind of ammunition as normal guns.

So a shotgun firing Ex-Explosive rounds would be essentially FRAG12 rounds.

http://www.defensereview.com/1_31_2004/FRAG%2012.pdf

Just don't cross the streams...

An AVC-7.62 modded for full auto and fitted with a hundred round drum and tripod (plus a shock pad and personalized grip for maximum recoil compensation) is mean. Throw on a suppressor and a smartgun with an enhanced rangefinder and this is a seriously mean piece of hardware for sniping.
Sure, standard sniper rifles pack more punch per bullet, but most sniper rifles can't throw out full auto firepower .
If you need to engage multiple targets at once, the Ares HVBR with similar mods can pound the crud out of two victims per pass with long bursts or cut down four lesser foes with a short burst apiece.

Converting either of these bad boys into an assault weapon is as simple as switching the tripod with a Gyro stabilizer, at which point someone somewhere is about to have a very bad day.

Of course, people might notice you trying to hide this under your lined jacket...

Yeah, I am a fan of the group skill for the reasons you give.


I don't think the SPAS gets enough love! A nice option to go with the Raecor Sting (for low-armour social do's), the Predator, the Ingram Smartgun and the sports rifle.

Cost. Liability.

More seriously. Because the rules say battery. As such, it is OR3. *shrug*

If you are firing Full Auto, you are NOT sniping. *shrug*

i still say such a battery sounds more like highly processed material to me <.<
but i guess that depends on the GM . .

No, but if you have a Dahl, you can snipe in burst mode!