This may true, but any runner worth his salt would do well to invest in a discreet method of international travel and take their own gear along. I don't know about you, but I've had one bad experience too many with weapons I picked up on location not performing as advertised...

I always like to get my gear from someone I know and trust (or steal it myself), so that I know exactly what I am going into battle with. Just my two bits..

-Thal`aen

Assuming, of course, that you're a globe-trotting super-agent. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Runners can be local, and carry their special guns around.

True, true - I was just saying that if you WERE to do international work, you'd be a fool to rely upon public transportation.

Totally. Smuggling is half the fun!

What about 2 long bursts to attack 2 enemies, or 4 separate short bursts to attack 4 enemies every IP?

Well, if your home ground is Denver, that advice still applies (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) .

In more normal cities, you'll also want a series of cheap disposable guns if your GM is the type to worry about forensics. Otherwise, go to town, but don't bother tricking your assault rifle out for stealth - if you're worried about getting through MAD detectors and such, use a handgun instead. If you need an assault rifle it's because you're going to, well, assault someplace rather than sneak go through security (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) .

Machinegun with underbarrel cannon.

If you're gonna go loud, go loud!




-k

It mostly comes down to the recoil issue and the relative lack of 4-in-one-burst opportunities. Unless your character is Rambo (which hey, is entirely possible) odds are there will be times where you find Full Narrows to be both deadly and unwieldy enough to make you want to stand pat. With that said, I do sometimes find it hard to pass up on a gun that goes to 11.

longbowrocks, you'll never hit them if you split your DP that much. It's nothing you can't do nearly/exactly as well with FA… without wasting all your mod slots and having no RC. If you must attack 4, Suppressive Fire with FA.

There's a big difference between splitting, and subtracting from, your dice pool. Large DPs are almost immune to subtraction, whereas splitting is their worst enemy.

Suppressive fire is only your weapon's base DV, not OKO level.

There's no DP spliting involved when shooting multiple targets with Full-Auto.

So? Again, you're not going to hit (let alone 'OKO') 4 targets a round anyway, and FA can already do 3. You'd need 4 targets within 1 meter of each other, and you've got 11 points of recoil and -0/-2/-4/-6 from multiple targets. It *can* be done, but only by shifting a lot of resources away from other places, and the benefit isn't worth it.

I'm sorry, I didn't mean you were using the capital-S Splitting rule. I meant that you were significantly reducing your DP (and the burst effects) in order to make multiple attacks. Everyone breathe. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

*Whew!* I almost suffocated there! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I would argue that the 4 bursts can be at any targets you want. the one meter restriction appears to be limited to when you use a full burst against multiple targets.

As for recoil, I know there are additional rues in arsenal, so maybe I should check that, but I'm see 9 RC from combining just gyro stabilization and gas vent II, as per the core book.

You would argue wrong. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) HV is a variant of FA, and multiple targets from any burst fire (Long, Full, Full HV) are 'walked' within 1 meter.

Gyro stabilization is a big deal; it's a harness you wear and attach the gun to. That is indeed an option, but it has drawbacks. Other options are the optional Strength/RC rule, gyro cyberarms, tripods, vehicle mounts, etc. Whatever method you use is a lot harder than just using FA, just to make a fourth attack at -11. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) It's not quite so bad for the dual long bursts (second attack at -8, perhaps?), but it's also not much *better* than a normal FA 6/3 burst combo.

I'm not saying it's impossible, at all. I'm saying it's not worth it in most situations. As Whipstitch said, 3 targets or -9 dodge or +9 DV is usually plenty, especially if 4 targets/-11 dodge/+11 DV costs more (ammo, mod slots, RC needs, etc.).

Thanks for catching me on the 4 short bursts. I forgot that short bursts by themselves are illegal with an HV weapon.

If you're going to have enough RC for normal FA, you're probably going to have one of those heavy duty recoil reducers, such as a gyro mount. 2 More points on top of that can come from a heavy barrel and foregrip or something.

And as you said, there's still the two long bursts you can do in terms of utility!

Honestly, I usually aim for 5 or 6 RC, and we use the Strength rule; no gyromount/tripod, cuz those are uncool. That gets you up to about 8, which is enough for 6/3. It's *not* enough for 12… and again (at the certainty of being repetitive), 12 isn't really better than 9/10.

Yeah, upon realizing that the 4 short burst were actually an application of 1 supercharged full burst, I changed my argument in that last comment to: "what about the extra long burst it grants you, which *can* be used on anybody"

Okay. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) 6/6 isn't that much better than 6/3.

Tripods are uncool for shadowrunners but what's wrong with a gyromount?
6 points that can be used either to compensate recoil or running modifiers is great.

An AR (HV or otherwise) in a Gyromount is ridiculous however. Use at least an LMG.

Unless that "LMG" is GE Vindicator Minigun, an HV modded AR is a better shoice then an LMG.

But my shoice for Gryromount might be HV modded Battle rifle with a 100 round drum (IMG:style_emoticons/default/love.gif)

Probably because by strict RAW... the idiots who wrote the rules for recoil and HV mods...

They made the HV mod only available to AR's and SMG's. (there is one Battle rifle which is built that way... but that doesn't mean the mod is available by strict RAW reading to all BR's). It's not available to belted MG's which is where I'd most like to use it.

Similarly the idiots gave a double recoil penalty to MG's which are designed for sustained high volume fire (even on the move) while only giving lightweight weapons like SMG's and AR's a non-doubled recoil penalty getting it completely backwards.


Personally though, I'm all in favour of a HV modified white Knight.

I know it's late for the party, but I might add that my favorite automatic weapon is actually the viper slivergun. At 8 DV/+5 AP, it won't often deal outright physical (stun track is usually shorter anyway) but still packs a punch on (meta)humans. It's not a forbidden weapon despite having sound suppression, it can operate in burst fire (easily modded to full auto), and it has a concealment of +0. That's better than most SMGs, which will often garner significantly more attention.

Yes, it's less versatile than most SMGs option-wise, it can only take one type of ammo, and the recoil comp options are pretty crappy (best used in burst fire, one in each hand). It's still an awesome gun.

BR:s count as Assault Rifles for what accessories and mod they can get.

This is actually wrong, because its misleadingly printed. There's actually two kinds

Only SMG's and Assault rifles can be constructed as high velocity weapons.

the high velocity modification on the other hand, can be applied to any full-auto capable weapon.

Agh! We've got to stop meeting like this, Udoshi. No, that's nuts—loophole! The mod just says 'refer to the HV rules on p26', where it clearly says 'SMG/AR only'. There *is* no weapon 'construction' in SR4, and it's deliberately abusive to assume they mentioned it for no reason.