It doesn't. It has a button or lever or flipout that takes an action to actuate. Or you can hook it up to your wireless and think it open as a free action.

These appear to be benefits because the old option was just to burn an action.

And yet, SOMEHOW, a Pan connection just does not suffice... I call BS. *shrug*

My actual hope is that skinlink makes a reappearance as a bioimplant (to improve the data throughput of the skin) but be vulnerable to directed jamming or electric shocks. They would make individual gear untargetable but the commlink would remain a security issue.

People without implants should get no such link and be forced to run wireless with all its issues.

What? A PAN suffices, but a PAN is vulnerable.

Vulnerable only if the PAN has a Matrix connection. Or the hacker is right on top of you in mutual signal range.

His point, I think, is that if he is commanding it with his mind the Matrix shouldn't be required, just a connection between his mind and the baton. Whether that connection be a cable or a PAN or whatever.


-k

Shinxy, please don't drag this discussion further down to a personal level. It's the best, in general, to stay within the Shadowrun context.

Bye
Thanee

No they retconned to say SR4 always worked like that... but they forget Shadowrun has more than an 8 year history. There was no "Wireless Matrix" for these devices to run on when they existed in the 2050s and 2060s unless they're retconning the entire history of the Matrix.

Also, I wouldn't say there is ANY problem with the new rules that I've seen so far. It is the way it is specifically applied to all cyberware with a blanket. It could easily be fixed with a cybertech book which provides alternate versions of these items like a cyberspur that costs a little more money but includes a DNI rather than wireless for control. I actually like this solution because it gives a wider variety of cyberware that actually makes a difference.

What part of "Didn't need matrix at all before SR5" do you not understand?
Seriously come on.

That would be total and utter waste of space in a book that really doesn't have any space to waste.
I would much rather have as much new pieces of gear as possible.

If I had to do a quick guess, off-the-cuff? Not much, except for the time and effort it takes to find out what the send-receive protocols are. For simple things (like, say, the stun baton), that would be simple. For something like the recharging of certain pieces of 'ware? That might be a lot tougher, since the remote recharger doesn't send juice without the proper protocols.

It isn't like the system's going to be flawless and unhackable. But the question of 'why isn't this like THIS', can be answered simply. And can shadowrunners hack it? I'd say 'usually, yes'. But I doubt that should be covered by the main rulebook.

Oh, I'm certain there are people doing this. No question.
But it takes time. And it takes money. And it wouldn't be 'normal'.

And again, I figure something like this would be in an expansion sourcebook.

Actually, if I were to take it one step further...
Going through security or checkpoints, I could see someone being scanned, to ensure that their goods aren't hacked. 'Please connect to the matrix for a brief scan - it's for your security'. I could see that.

Hmm, I think I'll use that in the near future...

Let me just say ... ~naw, forget it, who cares for physics anyways~



It already is hackable ... for every other purpose, by manipulating the very same protocols. That's the core principle behind the decker archetype.



And people reject these "simple" answers ...



Which again brings us back to design level and the resulting problem: The design goal of having combat hackable gear will get neutered once such options arise, therefore from a development standpoint such things must not become availible otherwise they'd have wasted valuable design and production time which could have been spent on other subjects.

The answer to wanting things SR does not give and is not supposed to give due to its genre is precisely going to play games in the genre you want.

That has worked so well historically. Besides, it's not like hackers can write their own soft - especially the kind of super-complex soft required to have a baton extend.


On a side note, is triangulation a lost art by 2075? I mean, when you have someone walk into a secure zone lit up like a new year tree with wireless transmission, detecting and pinpointing him is child's game.

He is of course referring to the tragic Baton Bashup of '68 when the Radical Ions scriptkiddie gang sold secondrate batons out of Prague utilizing their own gimped software, resulting in a series of accidents due to malfunctions in the extension/retraction software with injuries ranging from broken fingers and wrists to at least 3 cases of blunt force trauma to the groin region when local toughs carried the baton tucked in the front of their synthleather jeans.

Someone mentioned that skinlink will be back in later book, but in a changed form so it doesn't entirely remove the hack factor, but no specifics (ie reduces range, increases defense, etc)

You're now officially my hero. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

actually, as things are right now, no, a PAN seems to not be enough . .

Seriously? Who are you to judge? For me it would sell the book (or at least to my players) and probably wouldn't need to take up more than two pages.

A PAN does NOT suffice, you MUST BE CONNECTED TO THE MATRIX. I still call BS. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

So let me get this strait.

Matrix--as in the WHOLE internet--is required to extend a baton faster?

A connection to the software is required. And that's in the Matrix.

You forgot that you can already hack pacemakers and some other electronics we already put inside the human body (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)



Well pen-registers sorta are more art than science. Its only a child's game in the movies... I'm assuming your talking about cell phone triangulation ie pen-register which works off the two ID keys every cellular device has and you can "track" it as leaves signal range of one tower and hits the signal range of a new tower. Its not like sonar giving your an exact reading its more like Tarzan swinging from vine to vine.



See above for cell phones, for internet the root servers are run by the US so that is not surprising. Also I wouldn't use the word monitoring, that implies actively looking its more like recording, and frankly this happens on its own every time you hit a server, switch, router, etc. Your ISP is recording everything you do for a limited period of time which is why we have things like SSL and other encryption technologies. The news with the NSA was how long they were keeping the information for, not that it happens. Which still doesn't mean someone cant get my passwords it just means it takes longer. Security is all about being obfuscated enough that your not worth the time and effort to bother caring about whats in your TCP/IP packets. If your cell phone is actually off, it cant be tracked, but most smart phones don't actually turn off when your turn them off. Its more like they go to sleep when you turn them off. As for the email and social networking accounts, this is really complicated and has to do with hash keys, court orders, the company policy and other fun. I'm not sure I can go into that in any general way easily so I'm sure I'd break some form I signed once upon a time going into any specifics. They aren't hacking your account to get it though they just ask google, yahoo, whomever to hand over your mail.

I'm talking about radio signal triangulation. You only need two scanning antennas to pinpoint the source of any known signal: for an elementary case with amplitude method, just scan the ether until you find the direction where the signal you're looking for is maximal. Since you have two points of location, draw a line from each in the direction of the maximum, and there you have your target. Easy as pie. Sure, in real urban environment it gets a little bit more complex, but minding that such a system can be easily set up in advance, and local conditions accounted for - again, child's play.
Same goes for cell phones, actually, except it's easier to use the delay method there - estimate the time it takes for a signal to arrive at the tower, and the difference between time it takes to arrive at other towers in the vicinity - and there is your target, again, clear and simple.
The only additional issue in SR would be the fact that there are lots of wireless-enabled devices around, but as long as their network protocols allow for device recognition, the triangulation system can use those to pick the needed targets just as well.

Well ,I got good News (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
(Also for Tycho )


The BS is not as big as You think it is
to my understandiing that means you can still use Your PAN (and Your Comlink with Agents, strong Encryption,etc)to access the Matrix and your gadgets (Smartlink,etc) don't need to be connected ...."Bareskinned"(Is that the Right word for no protection & helpless ? )

HeyaHeyaHeyaJa
Medicineman

They would have to or you would risk sending the wrong information to the device.

I would assume, if that were actually how it worked, someone would have stepped up and said so already. Of course, I should know better than to assume.