 Can this be done? |
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 Jun 13 2008, 01:49 PM
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#26
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Mr. Johnson  Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,148 Joined: 27-February 06 From: UCAS Member No.: 8,314  |
QUOTE (Zaranthan @ Jun 12 2008, 10:26 PM)  Once again, if astral perception trumps the Masking Ward, then there's no point whatsoever to the spell even existing. It doesn't hide anything but fine details, which makes it little more than an NPC tool ("there's a ward on the room, I can't see what they're doing inside"), in which case it doesn't need to be statted out (railroads don't need mechanics). It's illogical to assume the designers went to the trouble to stat out the drain of a spell that's only useful as a landscape feature. Masking Ward conceals itself with its own penalty, because otherwise it's not a spell, it's deus ex machina. Please re-read Masking Ward, p. 125, Street Magic. |
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Jun 13 2008, 02:16 PM
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#27
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,664 Joined: 21-September 04 From: Arvada, CO Member No.: 6,686 |
QUOTE (MadPiper @ Jun 12 2008, 09:05 PM) Would the astral mages see a airship? If you use illusion to make a chair in the astral, it works, but everyone knows its a illusion because they can see the mana of the spell, but if it was behind a Masking Ward, would they just see a chair? or nothing at all? What kind of illusion spell are you talking about? Mask could work, except it has to be of the same basic size and shape. So you could change your airship to look like... uhh, well, I dunno? A whale? The only other applicable illusion is invisibility, which states by normal visual senses (which astral perception specifically isn't one). QUOTE (MadPiper @ Jun 12 2008, 09:05 PM) Also, because wards add -force dice pool to perception tests, if the ship had a force 10 ward on it, would any astral mages with a perception pool 10 or less even see the ship? You must've missed the part of masking wards which is, SM, 125, "Since the ward is transparent, noticing it requires an outside observer to either come into contact with it (since it is still a solid astral barrier) or make a successful Assensing +Intuition (3) Test." I.E. it doesn't block astral sight, so there is no negative perception pool to it. Since masking wards aren't supposed to be seen, and its the opaqueness of a ward that causes the perception penalty, I don't think masking wards have the penalty. Instead, they get the concealing of astral activity inside the ward. QUOTE (MadPiper @ Jun 12 2008, 09:05 PM) What if you used regular invis, mana based spell for astral stuff, would they then see it? Masking ward blocking mana from being seen, but invis still active and working? They just would not see the astral mana aura? They would still see the airship, since astral perception is not normal sight, which is what invis prevents them from seeing with. QUOTE (Zaranthan @ Jun 12 2008, 09:26 PM) Once again, if astral perception trumps the Masking Ward, then there's no point whatsoever to the spell even existing. It doesn't hide anything but fine details, which makes it little more than an NPC tool ("there's a ward on the room, I can't see what they're doing inside"), in which case it doesn't need to be statted out (railroads don't need mechanics). It's illogical to assume the designers went to the trouble to stat out the drain of a spell that's only useful as a landscape feature. Masking Ward conceals itself with its own penalty, because otherwise it's not a spell, it's deus ex machina. It doesn't trump the masking ward. It hides astral activity within the space. I.E. you can have a masking ward force 6 around your force 6 magical lodge, and be summoning bloodzilla at force 6 inside it, and anyone wandering by in astral space would be none the wiser (unless they pierce the masking wards concealing). |
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Jun 13 2008, 02:30 PM
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#28
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The Dragon Never Sleeps Group: Admin Posts: 6,924 Joined: 1-September 05 Member No.: 7,667 |
What do you think about this summary?
We have an airship with Improved Invisibility, then a Masking Ward around it. Normal Vision will not see the space ship because of the Improved Invisibility Spell. Assensing will not see the the Improved Invisibility Spell because of the Masking Ward concealing astral activity. Assensing will see the Airship, because the Masking Ward doesn't hide what's in it, just any astral activity, e.g. spells? |
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Jun 13 2008, 02:54 PM
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#29
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,664 Joined: 21-September 04 From: Arvada, CO Member No.: 6,686 |
QUOTE (DireRadiant @ Jun 13 2008, 08:30 AM) What do you think about this summary? We have an airship with Improved Invisibility, then a Masking Ward around it. Normal Vision will not see the space ship because of the Improved Invisibility Spell. Assensing will not see the the Improved Invisibility Spell because of the Masking Ward concealing astral activity. Assensing will see the Airship, because the Masking Ward doesn't hide what's in it, just any astral activity, e.g. spells? Bingo! For bonus, you could mask the airship to look like something else similarly sized which would affected the astrally perceiving people as well. |
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Jun 13 2008, 02:55 PM
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#30
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,148 Joined: 27-February 06 From: UCAS Member No.: 8,314 |
QUOTE (DireRadiant) Normal Vision will not see the space ship because of the Improved Invisibility Spell. Assensing will not see the the Improved Invisibility Spell because of the Masking Ward concealing astral activity. Assensing will see the Airship, because the Masking Ward doesn't hide what's in it, just any astral activity, e.g. spells? All that, plus: Assensing might see the ward around the airship. |
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Jun 13 2008, 02:57 PM
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#31
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,148 Joined: 27-February 06 From: UCAS Member No.: 8,314 |
QUOTE (Tarantula @ Jun 13 2008, 09:54 AM) For bonus, you could mask the airship to look like something else similarly sized which would affected the astrally perceiving people as well. I'll bite. How would one go about doing that? |
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Jun 13 2008, 03:01 PM
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#32
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The ShadowComedian Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,538 Joined: 3-October 07 From: Hamburg, AGS Member No.: 13,525 |
i'll bite too: what else is there in the size category of one of those frigging huge airships?
specifically, what else is there in that size category that floats around in the frigging sky ? |
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Jun 13 2008, 03:18 PM
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#33
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
A Dragon??!!?! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
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Jun 13 2008, 03:23 PM
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#34
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The ShadowComedian Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,538 Joined: 3-October 07 From: Hamburg, AGS Member No.: 13,525 |
noo . . not big enough and not cigar-shaped enough either . .
but it's the only thing that comes remotely close . . well, aside from those giant algea things they manufactured for use as zeppelin or whatever that was . . |
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Jun 13 2008, 03:32 PM
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#35
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The Dragon Never Sleeps Group: Admin Posts: 6,924 Joined: 1-September 05 Member No.: 7,667 |
Clouds...
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Jun 13 2008, 03:39 PM
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#36
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,664 Joined: 21-September 04 From: Arvada, CO Member No.: 6,686 |
Yeah, best bet would be to mask as a cloud and come in very very slowly.
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Jun 13 2008, 03:40 PM
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#37
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Awakened Asset Group: Members Posts: 4,464 Joined: 9-April 05 From: AGS, North German League Member No.: 7,309 |
QUOTE (Fortune @ Jun 13 2008, 05:18 PM) A Dragon??!!?! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Had someone offered that approach at my table, I´d now have a pretty hard time NOT grinning and chuckling. As for the needed spell: Mask on the astral plane. Tarantula pretty much said it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) |
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Jun 13 2008, 03:42 PM
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#38
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The ShadowComedian Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,538 Joined: 3-October 07 From: Hamburg, AGS Member No.: 13,525 |
yes, of course, why did i not think of that . . clouds . .
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Jun 13 2008, 03:52 PM
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#39
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,148 Joined: 27-February 06 From: UCAS Member No.: 8,314 |
QUOTE (Tarantula @ Jun 13 2008, 10:39 AM) Yeah, best bet would be to mask as a cloud and come in very very slowly. I'll ask again. What exactly are you using to "mask" a zeppelin? Are we talking the Mask spell now, or are we still talking about masking wards? |
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Jun 13 2008, 04:10 PM
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#40
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,664 Joined: 21-September 04 From: Arvada, CO Member No.: 6,686 |
Mask spell.
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Jun 13 2008, 05:43 PM
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#41
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Mr. Johnson Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,148 Joined: 27-February 06 From: UCAS Member No.: 8,314 |
Ah. That makes way more sense.
*starts singing "I am just a little black cloud"* |
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Jun 14 2008, 06:26 PM
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#42
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
QUOTE (Aaron @ Jun 13 2008, 12:43 PM) Ah. That makes way more sense. *starts singing "I am just a little black cloud"* *Opens Umbrella* Tut, Tut. Looks like rain. |
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