I thought On The Run looked great initially. I read it cover to cover at least 3 times and used a yellow highlighter all over it to mark key passages before I ran it for my players. Then I ran it and realised how replete with problems it was. It can be salvaged and I think principally, the story is great for starting players - but not without significant modification by the GM.

- J.

I'm not trying to be funny, and I'm not trying to denigrate any legit concerns about anything we've published or will publish. Just pointing out that our consumer and communications culture has changed a lot since the early days of Shadowrun, as have expectations of what a publisher "should do" to earn a customer's business. That's not a complaint -- I love my job and I love making games -- but I know full well that things remembered so fondly often don't hold up to scrutiny years later [especially when one is a teenager when falling in love with something...]

Aye, I've learned the hard way to NEVER watch the shows that I loved as a child.

Still, although I can't really disagree with your basic point Adam when the old modules do get discussed I think we bitch and whine about them almost as much as we do the new stuff so I'm not sure how much has actually changed other than before the net it was harder for the devs to actually see their work getting disected.

Yeah, I guess I WAS a teen at the time, but that's besides the point.

Just as an example, I will tell you that generally I have been impressed with the product Catalyst has turned out since putting their imprint on the line. I have more issues with the CBT stuff, but that's not this forum. Compared to the rest of the generalized RPG industry, Catalyst stands out IMHO, and that's not sycophancy. Compared the the likes of Mongoose (some neat ideas, lousy implementation and what cheeze monkey actually writes that Munchy drek, anyhow?) or the coastal wizards and their attempt to turn a beloved landmark of the industry into a pen-and-paper CCG, or any of many other firms that tried to resurect a life-support-only RPG (Traveller comes to mind for T20 right off the top) and show some promise and originality only to go precisely nowhere? Sorry, Adam, but Catalyst has demonstrated the ability to turn out a well designed product, and I intend to hold you folks to that standard; Where you fail, I intend to call you on it, but where you make (and surpass) my expectations, I will extoll your many virtues to the uninitiated and attempt to corrupt their souls by introducing them to the reborn 6^th World.

Now... you've got some promises to keep in the closing half of the year, don't you? I know I'm waiting like a kid at 23:59 on Christmas Eve for my new Seatle 2070 and 6^th World Almanac; I would love to have those as an early Christmas present. And if you wind up releasing a digital re-make of the old Street Samurai Catalog, I won't even check my balances first before I whip out the credstick and memory chip for a download.

If we sound like we're bitching, ignore us; It's a sign of our devotion that we want every product to be as perfect as possible. (Mind you, taking our general consensus into account when writing/editing product in the pipeline wouldn't be UNwise, by any means.)

Few things to keep in mind.

1. Criticism is written by critics.
2. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. (A bad adage to follow in most real world situations.)
3. You'll never please everyone.

Sales I would imagine are the real success indicator, it means someones happy....like the non vocal majority.

All that being said there's 6-12 folks who I'm pretty sure get out of bed in the morning to piss and moan. Most of the folks here on DS find them thoroughly entertaining. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/notworthy.gif)

Sorry, no Seattle 2070, ever! Will Seattle 2072 work? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)



And it's something that we always do. But as I've said before -- we can listen to everyone, but we can't do what everyone wants. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I just want to be fawned over and kvetched at for PACKS. The playtesters even liked it.

On the Run was Fanpro, not CGL for the record (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) .

1. Ghost Cartels is a solid campaign book.
2. From what I've seen of it Dawn of the Artifacts: Dusk looks great.

Overall, the quality behind the CGL products has been above average, good, and very good. Fan Pro, towards the tail end of their Shadowrun legacy felt like they were pumping out books for production value. Even though the elitist board on Dumpshock will be negative and critical, one thing I cannot dispute is the time, energy, thought, and passion the current developers at CGL are putting into their product. That and I love how everyone from the company comes onto Dumpshock to interact with the fans. Over the past few months I have asked questions in threads and sent questions via PM, and each and every single time someone from CGL has taken time to answer it.

-That's customer service right there. Thanks guys.

-From a fan of SR since the early 1990s.

Depending on the exact implementation, this idea could easily remove the biggest hurdle I always have with new players - the sheer multitude of options regarding gear can be pretty overwhelming when you're just starting out. A moderate number of prebuilt gear packages for different roles sounds ideal.

Oh! You know, you almost made me want to cry for a second there... mean old bad meanine man! Teasing's not very nice...


Oh, that's a given... as I understand there was a little internal ... friction with some of the 4A revisions, but that's understandable. Just don't listen to [REDACTED] or [REDACTED] or [REDACTED] or ESPECIALLY that total slot [REDACTED]! [REDACTED] doesn't have a clue what they're talking about, and [REDACTED] is just a slitch... and creepy. Ignore THEM and you should be just fine.

*Fawns dreamily over Ancient History*

You know, I thought those PACKS were just SOOOOOooo cool! I mean, did you get a look at them?



(Was that what you sort of had in mind? *Thbbbbbbbbbt*)

Emphasis mine.

I find it's more like the "Squeaky nail gets the hammer" in my experience.

I LIKE discussions of how to improve on the existing framework, or how to fill in the gray voids that inevitably come up (Players exist for more resons than just to bribe the GM with food, you know). My favorites discussions are about intent and how to make the rules better fit the feel of the universe.

Let's face it, every game system has holes in it, and the Shadowrun system is a little... odd if you were to take it out of the 6^th World entirely. It's for love of that ficticious setting that those of us who have BEEN addicted to fans of Shadowrun from the beginning keep putting up with the new printings and the erata(s) and FAQs and license changes and arguments over Waffles about how to read any given 13 words based on the (intentional) placement of a comma. I have pre-ordered every core rulebook since Augmentation, sight unseen because I believe in what Catalyst is doing with OUR 6th World, and I want them to continue... I consider my credstick sort of like my voter registration card: a means to make my voice heard and to re-ellect the guys in office.

The fact that I think somebody was asleep at the switch on that whole "ID Verifiation and Genuine Citizen Act" nonsense when somebody slipped legislation through committee at the last minute and stampeeded the lawmakers into signing something they hadn't even read is entirely besides the point!

I sincerely hope you'll be impressed. If PACKS gets enough acclaim, I might be able to pitch an e-book with additional kits and profiles.


Keep going...actually, I expect at least three WTFs and a couple people with mad calculator skillz bitching, but I have a little faith left. It's a small, twisted, blackened faith, much maligned and abused, but it remains.

3 WTF's, 2 IRC's and 1 IMHO-STFU= Success!

*gently pets and strokes the small, twisted, blackened, maligned and abused faith*

"Aw, poor thing... It's going to be ok... nobody's going to hurt you any more..."

I've got money in hand for Toolkit based of the GM screen alone. I have battle scarred screens form every edition of SR that I use to make a "GM Zone" while playing. Yet here's my wife with her fancy new World of Darkness hard backed screens...

um, as to #2. as a repair technician I usually find the squeaky wheel gets removed, tossed in the junk pile and replaced.. much more fitting to a dystopian future ruled by corporations (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

So this is still coming out, right? I thought I remembered a news post on the main SR4 site suggesting it would be hitting the street along side SR4A, but since then there has been no mention of it and its not on the upcoming product pages.

has it been dropped, or just pushed back? the compiled tables and improved GM screen are really compelling reasons to spend money.

I don't remember us saying it would come out at the same time as SR4A, although we announced it at the same time. It's still in progress!

Adam, thanks for the update!

I'm looking to purchase this item, upon it's release. I am not asking for a street date, but is it possible this product will be out sometime in the fall?

I refuse to speculate on that.

Looking forward to a quality product, Adam. That's all I'm saying.

Technically there are an infinite number of "fall" seasons so he could answer yes and be right. At least as long as it's released before the rotational gravity of the Earth runs out and we become tide-locked to the Sun. But by then it might not matter. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Now I'm wishing I had money to spend...

Boxed stuff is usually more expensive than just the books. What kinda price point is in mind for this thing?

well, it'd probably be fall *somewhere* on the earth (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)