Well her magical brown elf nipples fell off. No one seemed to care what happened to her after that...

If you go back you will see I mentioned nothing about wanting magic out of SR, I gave examples of modern and scifi stories but you also can't tell anything about mystical mystery or discovery because the answers are already known, as long as SR is chained to ED the big story is always going to be: the horrors come back everything that can't hide dies or the horrors get beat back.

Honestly the best thing for the game line would be to have the horror's come back in the next couple years a major conflict comes of it and ultimately the horrors are pushed back to their portals and a large WMD is flushed into said portal ending the threat forever, then SR storytelling can move forward.

I came back to the boards mainly because my roommate was talking to some of his friends and they got into the idea of playing Shadowrun. So I was going to run the game and decided on 4e to lower the learning curve (I know 3rd Ed very well, but never really dug into 4e) since they normally play nWoD stuff and a lot of the concepts would be similar. Turns out, their normal GM wants to run a Cyberpunk 2020 game and asked me "Is there any way you guys could combine them?"

Now, for the record, I'm working on converting Harlequin to 4e...going to run them through Universal Brotherhood and the related stories while that's going on (even going to have my roommate play and Infected from the start who undermines them and eventually turns on them when they get too close, leading them into an ambush). Then I start creeping in with the Enemy, going through Harlequin's Back (yes, I'm serious, I want to run that damn thing), then the elections and aftermath...basically going to go through the entire canon timeline.

My Crowning Moment of Evil GMing though is going to be when the group does an extraction from the Renraku Archology...on December 24, 2061. I'm going to have everything go perfectly for them...all the security guards are distracted or on break or just not paying attention, bystanders will be helpful, it's going to be the smoothest run ever...and I'm going to wait...and wait...and the SECOND any of them even breaths anything remotely similar to "This is too easy", that's when Deus locks the place down. If they can hold it in until they get out, they'll be alright. The gates close just after they leave...but if they say the magic words, they get locked in.

You just flat out can't run that kind of game in Cyberpunk, it's not built for it. It's built...well, frankly, like Shadowrun 4e's world is. Street-level play. That's never interested me. I'm already a cog in the machine working in my cube 40 hours a week as it is...I don't want to spend my free time pretending to be a cog in the machine but eating out of a vending machine and sleeping in a coffin...

That's kinda what happened in the Dragonheart trilogy.

This. Well, sorta. But I see no appeal to pretend I am living a life of poverty and petty crime. I have seen enough of that to just not consider it interesting. I like SR because it offers something else, something a little more epic and less made of teen angst and cheap 90s gangsta rap.


Will you also delve into the Corp war and the fallout from Dunkelzahn's assassination?

I actually very much agree with this sentiment especially because of what i've said above. I find the number of ED leftovers who just happen to be immortal, magically powerful, annnnnddd just happen to be rich and secretly own large chunks of megacorps or secret societies basically says there is nothing new under the sun since the fourth world, and the fourth worlders knew all there was to know about the universe.

No, that's not the case, especially with knowing all there is about the world (and nevermind Earthdawn always was focused on European Russia, the Caucasian and Europe, with most of the world hardly ever touched upon. Lots of possibility formysterious mystery there and adding your own stuff, actually, if you're so inclined.

Again: if you want sci-fi and aliens, play another game. SR is about the 6th world's dawn and the 4th world's legacy, and has always been.

Careful, dude. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/extinguish.gif)

Sorry. Edited.

This exactly. You can play SR without ever knowing what an immortal elf is. You can do a run for a dragon and never see the scales. The connection to Earthdawn is part of the root of the game, and if you remove it you remove something of what makes Shadowrun what it is.

Ninja-edit! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/ninja.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

Because the horrors would have totally never gone into asia the big extermination of all life plotline would have totally never reached those shores. I do not see why I am required to play another game to get elements that are represented as part of the game setting.

I announced! But I confess I did WANT to ninja it.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)

That's pretty much it for me. Like I've said before, I read Shadowrun books more for fiction than I do for rules since I can rarely get a game together. But for me, it's about the ending to the original Harlequin adventure...

...like, just for that brief moment, I was a part (even if a small one) of something really important in the world. Then I go back to my drudgery.

That, to me, is what the Shadowrun world is about.

Let us just say that my take on things and whether Harlequin was an enjoyable module is entirely different.

The original Harlequin set the tone of my games for many years after and was probably one the most memorable and influential early adventures (Along with Bottled Demon and Dragon Hunt) for me personally.

I played Earthdawn for years. I loved the setting, it was by far the most comfortable setting for me to GM in a long time.

I had played SR 1 before earthdawn, and I came back to SR in 4th Edition. To me the Earthdawn link is part of what makes Shadowrun so much fun. It really expands the world. And, I love horrors, and I love the idea that they're going to come back. Horrors vs Cyber and Magic. It's going to be Epic.

The individual chapters left something to be desired, but I loved the concept and execution of the overall story. For some reason, though, I didn't like the way it was done in Survival of the Fittest...maybe because it was trying to recapture that feel and felt like a pale imitation by comparison...

You can't deny that Shadowrun would be a much different game without the connection to Earthdawn though. I'm finding it hard to swallow that the path forward in a creative sense involves cutting off a leg. And a very interesting one at that.

It's important o remember that Shadowrun came first. The intimations of immortal elves and a past age of magic were intrinsic to the setting a long time before Earthdawn made it on the scene.

I should probably look it up before posting, but didn't Earthdawn come out after even the 2nd Ed. of Shadowrun?

Yep. 2nd edition was 92, Earthdawn was 93.

Whatchoo talking bout Willis?

Lucy, You got sum splainin to do.

Seriously though, WHAT happened with her?

THIS!!! times a 1000 man.

You have put everything I love about the IE's and GD's in this game in the best words I've seen.

Graywulfe