 Perception as a [Knowledge] Skill, Optical Illusions as Cover Bonus |
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 Jun 29 2010, 01:04 AM
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#26
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 376 Joined: 20-June 10 From: Nerva L3 Station Member No.: 18,735  |
QUOTE (otakusensei @ Jun 28 2010, 04:23 PM)  I wonder what it would do to make the chameleon suit display an image of you? I'm guessing form the description that the images on the suit and the projectors are not perfect. But if they are similar enough you now have a three dimensional image of yourself, that just happens to have you inside of it, surrounded by more images of yourself. And if you let some music imaging software to go with some blaring techno, you can give your opponents synesthesia. QUOTE (kxU @ Jun 29 2010, 12:54 AM) i would give you a bonus as long as you take an action to activate your holograms. i think it was 3rd edition where the camouflage suit gave you a bonus to your dodging because the patterns break up your outline and make you harder to track. this sounds somewhat similar to that, and i don't think it would unbalance things any since you'll be sacrificing your first, and usually most crucial, initiative pass. edit: of course, using both the projectors and the chameleon suit would nullify the stealth bonus you get from the suit, since three of you is a lot easier to see than one of you. I agree that you would not be using [Infiltration] in this scenario, you can use the imperfect quality of the images to your advantage. As you move rapidly, the sensors on the chameleon suit will not be able to keep up and the image will start to tear. The holographic projectors either act the same way, or they can be programed to behave that way. The chameleon suit static helps break up your silhouette while not giving the opponents senses any depth to latch on to to properly organize the visual input it's getting. Perhaps you could make a [LOG+Palming] check? Sleight-of-hand tricks always use the most optical illusions. |
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Jun 29 2010, 01:22 AM
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#27
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Target Group: Members Posts: 49 Joined: 10-June 10 Member No.: 18,691 |
i would make it a logic + computers tests to program the hologram projectors to project the images a certain way, with optical illusions as a complementary skill. you'll probably want to apply a flat bonus should such a test succeed rather than a variable bonus based on the result of the test in order to keep it from getting too out of control.
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Jun 29 2010, 01:26 AM
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#28
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Target Group: Members Posts: 49 Joined: 10-June 10 Member No.: 18,691 |
all in all, i think this is a pretty cool and clever tactic for a character, but one he should only employ infrequently - no one else is gonna be pulling a stunt like this, so if you do it all the time, it'll make you much easier to identify and track.
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Jun 29 2010, 01:34 AM
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#29
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 376 Joined: 20-June 10 From: Nerva L3 Station Member No.: 18,735 |
QUOTE (kxU @ Jun 29 2010, 01:26 AM) all in all, i think this is a pretty cool and clever tactic for a character, but one he should only employ infrequently - no one else is gonna be pulling a stunt like this, so if you do it all the time, it'll make you much easier to identify and track. All in the name of Notoriety, neh? |
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Jun 29 2010, 06:21 AM
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#30
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The King In Yellow Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,922 Joined: 26-February 05 From: JWD Member No.: 7,121 |
QUOTE Chameleon cloaks just bend light around the wearer No, it does not (otherwise, wearing one would leave you blind). Cameleon cloak colour-changes to adapt you to your surroundings. |
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Jun 30 2010, 06:37 AM
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#31
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 104 Joined: 19-May 10 From: Melbourne, Australia Member No.: 18,592 |
QUOTE (AStarshipforAnts @ Jun 29 2010, 10:31 AM) Eh, some GMs allow things like Chemistry as an active skill, which is essentially anything non-academic you could do with Chemistry. QUOTE (tagz @ Jun 29 2010, 10:36 AM) But Chemistry an actual listed active skill. QUOTE (AStarshipforAnts @ Jun 29 2010, 10:45 AM) That also works. If I had two characters trying to use Chemistry Active Skill and Chemistry Knowledge Skill, I'd argue that the knowledge skill could identify chemicals, while the active skill involves the safe and accurate manipulation of chemicals. It's one thing to know that combining one part of A with two parts of B over a 120°C flame will bring results, but it's another thing to actually do that without stuffing up. So in the case of the holo-projectors, I'd say that a knowledge skill isn't sufficient to perform the actual visual manipulations. Computer + Intuition would make more sense to me. |
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Jun 30 2010, 06:41 AM
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#32
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Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
How does that logic apply to other purely cerebral skills like Software or Etiquette?
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Jun 30 2010, 05:51 PM
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#33
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Advocatus Diaboli Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282 |
As needed. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Basically, Active Skills are the only things that ever let you 'do' things: program software, or make social Tests.
Knowledge skill versions of each of those would let you, oh, recognize the manufacturer of a program by its style alone, or (maybe?) realize these men are Yakuza by their body language. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I'll admit, it gets a little iffy there. |
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Jun 30 2010, 08:36 PM
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#34
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 515 Joined: 27-May 10 From: Helios Space Station, L3 solar LaGrange Point Member No.: 18,624 |
QUOTE (Ol' Scratch @ Jun 30 2010, 01:41 AM) How does that logic apply to other purely cerebral skills like Software or Etiquette? I don't see how it wouldn't. Care to clarify? |
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Jun 30 2010, 09:07 PM
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#35
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Dumorimasoddaa Group: Members Posts: 2,687 Joined: 30-March 08 Member No.: 15,830 |
QUOTE (AStarshipforAnts @ Jun 29 2010, 01:31 AM) Eh, some GMs allow things like Chemistry as an active skill, which is essentially anything non-academic you could do with Chemistry. QUOTE (tagz @ Jun 29 2010, 01:36 AM) But Chemistry an actual listed active skill. The use of Chemistry as an active skill is an optional rule IIRC. As every thing it dose is doable with it as a knowlegde skill its just "slightly" unblanceing to get the ability to trun out large abouts of K-10 and such for next to no BP/karma. |
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Jun 30 2010, 09:09 PM
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#36
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Dumorimasoddaa Group: Members Posts: 2,687 Joined: 30-March 08 Member No.: 15,830 |
QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Jun 30 2010, 06:51 PM) As needed. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Basically, Active Skills are the only things that ever let you 'do' things: program software, or make social Tests. Knowledge skill versions of each of those would let you, oh, recognize the manufacturer of a program by its style alone, or (maybe?) realize these men are Yakuza by their body language. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I'll admit, it gets a little iffy there. I tend to rule any Active Skill contains its knowledge skill. Other wise you get silly skill creep also the insane max amount of knowledge skills rule might actually come in to play if you needed both. |
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Jun 30 2010, 09:47 PM
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#37
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Prime Runner Ascendant Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 |
QUOTE (Dumori @ Jun 30 2010, 02:07 PM) The use of Chemistry as an active skill is an optional rule IIRC. As every thing it dose is doable with it as a knowlegde skill its just "slightly" unblanceing to get the ability to trun out large abouts of K-10 and such for next to no BP/karma. Actually, In SR4A, Chemistry is an Active Skill... and not optional any longer... Keep the Faith |
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Jun 30 2010, 09:51 PM
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#38
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Prime Runner Ascendant Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 |
QUOTE (Dumori @ Jun 30 2010, 02:09 PM) I tend to rule any Active Skill contains its knowledge skill. Other wise you get silly skill creep also the insane max amount of knowledge skills rule might actually come in to play if you needed both. There are no limits to the number of Knowledge Skill sthat you may have except for Character Creation (No more than Double the Points you started with)... after that, you may have as many Knowledge Skills/Languages as you like... Keep the Faith |
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Jun 30 2010, 10:29 PM
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#39
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 10,289 Joined: 2-October 08 Member No.: 16,392 |
QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Jun 30 2010, 04:51 PM) There are no limits to the number of Knowledge Skill sthat you may have except for Character Creation (No more than Double the Points you started with)... after that, you may have as many Knowledge Skills/Languages as you like... What he meant was that suddenly you have to take the Pistols active skill and the Pistols knowledge skill in order to both use and talk about hand-held ballistic weaponry. |
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Jun 30 2010, 10:33 PM
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#40
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 515 Joined: 27-May 10 From: Helios Space Station, L3 solar LaGrange Point Member No.: 18,624 |
I consider Active Skills to include a knowledge skill counterpart, for the most part. It's all a matter of game balance, imho. I wouldn't want my players buying eleventy billion knowledge skills in order to pull shenanigans for cheap amounts of karma.
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Jul 1 2010, 12:12 AM
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#41
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Prime Runner Ascendant Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 |
QUOTE (Draco18s @ Jun 30 2010, 03:29 PM) What he meant was that suddenly you have to take the Pistols active skill and the Pistols knowledge skill in order to both use and talk about hand-held ballistic weaponry. No, if you actually look at what he said he is referencing (and I again Quote): QUOTE the insane max amount of knowledge skills rule might actually come in to play Which only exists for Character Creation (2x starting Knowledge skill points at Creation)... Anyways... Keep the Faith |
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Jul 1 2010, 02:35 AM
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#42
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Advocatus Diaboli Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282 |
Ah, I see what you're each saying. I didn't mean that the Active Skill *didn't* contain the Knowledge. I meant that the Knowledge didn't contain the Active. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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Jul 1 2010, 02:37 AM
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#43
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Prime Runner Ascendant Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 |
QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Jun 30 2010, 07:35 PM) Ah, I see what you're each saying. I didn't mean that the Active Skill *didn't* contain the Knowledge. I meant that the Knowledge didn't contain the Active. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Indeed.... No problems Yerameyahu... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Keep the Faith |
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Jul 1 2010, 09:11 AM
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#44
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Prime Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,803 Joined: 3-February 08 From: Finland Member No.: 15,628 |
QUOTE (Draco18s @ Jul 1 2010, 12:29 AM) What he meant was that suddenly you have to take the Pistols active skill and the Pistols knowledge skill in order to both use and talk about hand-held ballistic weaponry. Nah, thats what the fire-arms or even weapons knowledge skill is for. |
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