Layering Vision Enhancements? Options

[Jaid]

read the description. they explicitly can be placed over meat eyes. there are no modifiers listed, so i see no reason to introduce any.

for the record, what kind of capacity do you think the eye covers would have? and also, how much capacity would each vision enhancement take up?

[Nikoli]

That is likely the single most retarded concept that's been pointed out to me today.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

[Cheops]

You can't claim to be discussing something as a standard rule when it isn't explicitly in the rule book. Eye covers make no mention to being able to have any vision enhancements whereas every single other piece of gear that can--contact lenses, SL guncams, goggles, and cybereyes--explicitly state that they can. You are specifically arguing about a house rule you are introducing.

The benefit of cybereyes over any piece of gear is that since you pay for them with essence you get to use your body to resist damage to them unlike gear which uses their own body. Hope your uber sensor suite character doesn't get caught in the middle of a grenade blast or some sort of environmental effect. Oh and BTW have fun in the desert or swimming with those contacts in chummer.

Finally, the Awakened get no benefit from gear that is not paid for with essence for their spellcasting except for the magesight goggles. Otherwise it gets extremely silly and makes mages unstoppable. I pull out my left eye, the one with the iBall, and roll it into the room and use it to start flinging spells through it.

[Nikoli]

ooooh. that's an interesting idea.

[Jaid]

so a mage can't look through optical magnification binoculars to reduce perception modifiers from range?

i mean, yeah, you aren't going to be casting through a camera.... but there are some benefits to be gained, even from stuff you didn't pay essence for.

and, incidentally, as i read it you can apply vision enhancement to magesight goggles.

as far as eye covers on meat eyes being the most retarded concept ever... i can't see how it's any more silly than saying you can't put vision enhancements on the eye covers, but you can put them on contact lenses.

oh, and i still haven't seen any statements on how much capacity a vision enhancement would take up... is it the same as cybereyes?

[apple]

[Jaid]

perception test situation modifiers(P.117):

not in immediate vicinity
far away
perceiver has active enhancements*

all apply to perception checks.

* this may or may not apply... not entirely certain.

page 173, Step 3: Choose the Target. if you can't see the target, you can't cast a spell at them.

the perception modifiers are not directly applied to the spellcasting test, but they may determine if you are even able to make the test.


[this part is all theory, and can be largely ignored if you prefer. for this part, i'm just playing devil's advocate]

one could argue that the ranged combat table includes an entry of image magnification negating range modifiers, and therefore the magnification could potentially eliminate that. however, you would first have to make a houserule where spells suffer from range modifiers, and you would have to make a houserule about what constitutes short, medium, long, or extreme, so that's pretty much useless. an argument could be made that by magnifying the image, the mage can lose visibility between him and a larger area (ie, when you look through binoculars, you see a much smaller area), and thus not affect it with a direct combat spell or something like that, but that would also be a houserule, so that doesn't really apply either.


[this part is RAW as i understand them]

the awakened get no benefit from vision enhancing gear (for spell targeting purposes) that replaces their senses unless they pay for it with essence, but if it does not replace their senses no such limitation is in place. that's a little unspecific to me, as it doesn't really say what constitutes replacing, but generally speaking if it is electronic in nature, then it probably replaces their vision. (so no thermal goggles to reduce visibility modifiers, for example). there is a little bit of wiggle room, but i think it's fairly evident that the intent would restrict stuff projected from image links and the like just as much as cameras.

[edited for clarity]

[edited again for page number, and further clarification]

This post has been edited by Jaid: Oct 6 2005, 06:25 PM

[Rotbart van Dain...]

[Azralon]

[blakkie]

[Rotbart van Dain...]

[blakkie]

[Rotbart van Dain...]

[blakkie]

Which table are you talking about (page #)? Is it using a different word? I can only find one use of the word 'infinite' in the PDF, and it has to do with lifestyle.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

Basically, there is no hard range limit on perception.

On p. 117, there are modifiers listed for distance - just, only for vision and audio... so, smell perception would only be modified in threshold.

Not that it would matter in cases other than RFID Sensors - 100m distance to point of interest is likely to be enough in all normal situations for any Sensor.

Just... relying on your RFID-sensor-tagged boots to detect mines might be quite a gamble. :grinbig:

[blakkie]

[Siege]

Even without the detector, most boots will detect landmines.

-Siege

[blakkie]

[Jaid]

[Siege]

Blak - I think that was the initial point about being quite a gamble.

On a less humorous note, by the time you're about to take a step and the boot screams an alarm, you'd best hope your weight isn't already shifting forward, along with your gear.

-Siege

[Nikoli]

That is why you swing through the local indigenous orphenariums, to hire some locals for baggage handling and ordinance discov..err disposal.

[blakkie]

[hyzmarca]

[apple]