Help me choose my primary weapon. Options

[spica2501]

I'm trying to decide on a primary weapon for my character. He's an infiltrator/face hybrid. For the sake of concealability I want my primary weapon to be a pistol of some sort (not a machine pistol). I'm currently considering the following two weapons:

Ares Viper Slivergun
*Integrated Smartlink
*Electronic Firing
*Powered Folding Stock

Ruger Super Warhawk
*Revolver Silencer
*Semi-automatic firing mode
*Personalized Grip
*Barrel Mounted Smartlink

I'm also open to any suggestions anyone has to offer.

[Larsine]

Ther is no such thing as a "revoler silencer" in SR.

[Udoshi]

yeah there is.

Edit: look for the specific text "special revolver silencer" in arsenal. In the mod section. Under silencer. (its on page 53)

[Dakka Dakka]

Ares Viper Slivergun
*Integrated Smartlink
*Electronic Firing
*Powered Folding Stock

You do realize that the second burst will be at -3 dice and you cannot fire anything but flechettes?

I'm also open to any suggestions anyone has to offer.

Ruger Thunderbolt with integrated Smartgun System
+ Extended Clip
+ Personalized Grip/Electronic Firing
+ Underbarrel Weight
+ Sound Suppressor as Accessory

- Able to fire any ammunition
- 2 narrow bursts, second one at -1
- 15 round (i.e. 5 bursts)
- Observers get -4/-5 (with electronic firing) to perceive the shot

If you arte fine with a +2 Cocealability modifier add the additional clip mod to get 2x12© capacity.

[CanRay]

I'd suggest the Slivergun (with fake license to go with it) as a "daily carry" piece. Most of the mooks you'll have to deal with on the street aren't wearing armour, while cops are (So if they find it on you, they're not going to be as worried as they would a .44/.454/.500/Wristbreaker Wildcat Special Magnum Revolver.).

Carry the revolver on 'Runs when armour is an issue. You'll want the "One-Hit" drop. Even trolls tend to sit down and rethink their lives when hit by a Warhawk round.

Another option I'd suggest is a Colt Government 2066 with an optional barrel silencer (That you can remove to make it seem more legal), which can then be used as both a daily carry and as a 'run weapon. It comes with Electronic Firing as standard, so uses Caseless Rounds, as well, which is always a good thing. Just have a gunsmith contact handy to swap out barrels every now and then. (Or use rounds that won't leave ballistic evidence of the rifling.).

When I'm hassling my group over firearms, I have the cops check the load, BTW. If they have something "Less Than Lethal" loaded (Gel or SnS), the problem becomes less of one. If they have "Highly Lethal" ammo loaded (EX-Explosive), then they have some 'splainin' to do!

[Umidori]

I actually kind of like the Warhawk for non-lethal duty. Load it with gel rounds and any shot that connects is almost guaranteed to knock them down if it doesn't knock them out. Of course, some might argue that you could just as well load SnS on any other Heavy Pistol for the same damage and better armor penetration, as well as the electricity secondary effects, but to each their own.

If you want a good all-rounder, the Colt Government 2066 has one of the largest base ammo capacities of the heavy pistols, comes with electronic firing for a free point of RC (sparing you the need to use up mod slots for more RC unless you mod it to BF), and it even gets a free -1 to sound based perception of the weapon. Pretty cheap and even looks nice to boot.

~Umi

[Makki]

you could just carry a taser. fully legal and brings down armored trolls easily.

[Umidori]

Ranges are a bit sorry for tasers, though.

0-5, 6-10, 11-15, and 16-20.
VS
0-5, 6-20, 21-40, and 41-60.

If you plan on never needing to shoot anything more than 20m away, and can deal with -3 or -6 dice for things beyond 10m and 15m, then actually yes, tasers are probably superior. Unless you also want to be able to go lethal with a simple ammo swap, or you're against insulated armor.

For a niche character, particularly one based on infiltration, tasers are totally viable. I personally prefer my primary weapons to have a little more versatility, but eh. If you like, buy a taser for everyday stuff, and also buy a backup workhorse gun that can be adapted to any situation. Best of both worlds.

~Umi

[Dakka Dakka]

I'd suggest the Slivergun (with fake license to go with it) as a "daily carry" piece. Most of the mooks you'll have to deal with on the street aren't wearing armour, while cops are (So if they find it on you, they're not going to be as worried as they would a .44/.454/.500/Wristbreaker Wildcat Special Magnum Revolver.).

You may want to rethink that. Even a leather jacket has Armor 2/2.

Carry the revolver on 'Runs when armour is an issue. You'll want the "One-Hit" drop. Even trolls tend to sit down and rethink their lives when hit by a Warhawk round.

SnS does that even better, and you can get the 6s(e) in every pistol. No need to mod for SA of BF.

[spica2501]

You do realize that the second burst will be at -3 dice and you cannot fire anything but flechettes?

Ruger Thunderbolt with integrated Smartgun System
+ Extended Clip
+ Personalized Grip/Electronic Firing
+ Underbarrel Weight
+ Sound Suppressor as Accessory

- Able to fire any ammunition
- 2 narrow bursts, second one at -1
- 15 round (i.e. 5 bursts)
- Observers get -4/-5 (with electronic firing) to perceive the shot

If you arte fine with a +2 Cocealability modifier add the additional clip mod to get 2x12© capacity.

The two reasons you have listed are the reasons I didn't just go with the sliver gun without a second thought. I've gone the Thunderbolt route before. I was thinking about doing something different for a change, but I'll keep it in mind.

I'd suggest the Slivergun (with fake license to go with it) as a "daily carry" piece. Most of the mooks you'll have to deal with on the street aren't wearing armour, while cops are (So if they find it on you, they're not going to be as worried as they would a .44/.454/.500/Wristbreaker Wildcat Special Magnum Revolver.).

Carry the revolver on 'Runs when armour is an issue. You'll want the "One-Hit" drop. Even trolls tend to sit down and rethink their lives when hit by a Warhawk round.

Another option I'd suggest is a Colt Government 2066 with an optional barrel silencer (That you can remove to make it seem more legal), which can then be used as both a daily carry and as a 'run weapon. It comes with Electronic Firing as standard, so uses Caseless Rounds, as well, which is always a good thing. Just have a gunsmith contact handy to swap out barrels every now and then. (Or use rounds that won't leave ballistic evidence of the rifling.).

When I'm hassling my group over firearms, I have the cops check the load, BTW. If they have something "Less Than Lethal" loaded (Gel or SnS), the problem becomes less of one. If they have "Highly Lethal" ammo loaded (EX-Explosive), then they have some 'splainin' to do!

The great thing about the sliver gun is that it has an integrated silencer, but is restricted rather than forbidden. Flechette ammo is also not forbidden.

I had originally intended to use the Ares Predator IV, but I had some spare nuyen leftover at the end of character creation. Not enough to do convert back to karma, but enough to upgrade my gun to something a little more threatening.

you could just carry a taser. fully legal and brings down armored trolls easily.

A taser is my secondary weapon.

[Umidori]

Oh, something I meant to mention, remember that the Thunderbolt specifically mentions it can get you extra harassment from Lone Star officers. If you deal more with Knight Errant, then hey, no big, but I personally feel that if the gun was designed for police work it should earn you a certain level of suspicion from LEOs of any stripe, probably even moreso than carrying a Warhawk.

It's one thing to have a cop think you're a wannabe-badass compensating for something with your Warhawk, it's another thing entirely to have them think you've gotten your hands on something they feel shouldn't be carried by a civilian, laws be damned.

~Umi

[Aerospider]

If you're not married to having a gun for a primary weapon, I like the monofilament garotte for infiltrators. Base damage 8P, silent and ultra-concealable.

[Stahlseele]

Don't know if that changed, but in SR3, the only way to get a Thunderbolt was to take it from an LS Guy, because they were the only ones who officially got these guns in the first place . .
So every single Thunderbolt in the shadows was previously owned by a cop.

And it was specifically designed to be loud. And LoneStar Cops are specifically trained to recognize the sound of one of these being fired.

[DuckEggBlue Omeg...]

It's one thing to have a cop think you're a wannabe-badass compensating for something with your Warhawk, it's another thing entirely to have them think you've gotten your hands on something you're more likely to get off a cop you just murdered than at your local Weapons World, laws be damned.

Atleast that's how I've played it in the past. As though it's a signature weapon that is produced, almost, exclusively for the Star, partly because it let's me point out to players that LoneStar is a corp and it's part of their 'branding'. Can't remember if that was the official line.

Edit: And beaten to it by Stahlseele.

[Xenefungus]

It all depends on how you houseruled SnS and Flechette, actually.

[Thanee]

Ruger Thunderbolt: The Thunderbolt was developed by Ruger in cooperation with Lone Star’s Technical Research Department due to the needs of the security corporation. Despite the fact that the weapon has been sold to other licensed buyers for years now, some Lone Star officers still view the weapon as their ”private property,” so shadowrunners should keep their licenses updated to prevent being harassed during searches or at checkpoints.

I prefer it with a built-in sound suppressor (as weapon modification), because those are 50% more effective.

Ruger Thunderbolt
+ integral Smartgun System
+ internal Sound Suppressor (modification)
+ Special Chamber System (2)
+ Underbarrel Weight (modification)
+ Personalized Grip (modification)
+ Skinlink (accessory)

Bye
Thanee

[ZeroPoint]

What's the current errata status of the slivergun? the SR4A i have still has it as 8P(f) +2 AP.

[ikarinokami]

You do realize that the second burst will be at -3 dice and you cannot fire anything but flechettes?

Ruger Thunderbolt with integrated Smartgun System
+ Extended Clip
+ Personalized Grip/Electronic Firing
+ Underbarrel Weight
+ Sound Suppressor as Accessory

- Able to fire any ammunition
- 2 narrow bursts, second one at -1
- 15 round (i.e. 5 bursts)
- Observers get -4/-5 (with electronic firing) to perceive the shot

If you arte fine with a +2 Cocealability modifier add the additional clip mod to get 2x12© capacity.

The thunderbolt already has -2 rc built into the chamber. You don't need the underbarrel weight or grip.

Thunderbolt
- level 3 ceramic
- electonic firing
- internal sound suppressor
-built in smartgun system

[ZeroPoint]

The thunderbolt already has -2 rc built into the chamber. You don't need the underbarrel weight or grip.

Thunderbolt
- level 3 ceramic
- electonic firing
- internal sound suppressor
-built in smartgun system

If your only going to fire one burst sure...(since the second burst will have -5 recoil penalty to deal with, so a -2 penalty after compensation)

Also with that lvl 3 ceramic thats going to be a very expensive gun.

You'd be better off with either underbarrel weight if you want more recoil, extended clip, or barrel extension on the thunderbolt. Then get a separate WW Infiltrator (or a Morrissey Elan with manual breakdown) for when you want to sneak something past security.

[Dakka Dakka]

The thunderbolt already has -2 rc built into the chamber. You don't need the underbarrel weight or grip.

You may be reading the rules for recoil wrong. Recoil is cumulative across the action phase. So the first burst gets -2 the second one an additional -3 for a total of -5. so you will need 5 points of RC do fully compensate two short bursts. I didn't quite get there (4 RC), but that is the best I can do without a GasVent.

[ikarinokami]

You may be reading the rules for recoil wrong. Recoil is cumulative across the action phase. So the first burst gets -2 the second one an additional -3 for a total of -5. so you will need 5 points of RC do fully compensate two short bursts. I didn't quite get there (4 RC), but that is the best I can do without a GasVent.

I stand corrected. You could just add an external gas vent 2. That gets you to 5.

[Dakka Dakka]

I stand corrected. You could just add an external gas vent 2. That gets you to 5.

GasVents may not be added to Heavy Pistols.

[ikarinokami]

GasVents may not be added to Heavy Pistols.

We will have to agree to disagree here. I know RAW says- machine pistols, SMG, assault rifles and machine guns. However my interpetation of that rule is that they mean any weapon capable of burst or FA fireotherwise the rule creates paradox'es within itself.

[Dakka Dakka]

We will have to agree to disagree here. I know RAW says- machine pistols, SMG, assault rifles and machine guns. However my interpetation of that rule is that they mean any weapon capable of burst or FA fireotherwise the rule creates paradox'es within itself.

I totally agree that GasVents should be allowed for any firearm (SS and SA only weapons don't get much out of it though), I just pointed out that by RAW pistols (except machine pistols) cannot take that accessory/modification, as we don't know if the OP's GM will agree with this.

Where is the paradox?

[ikarinokami]

I totally agree that GasVents should be allowed for any firearm (SS and SA only weapons don't get much out of it though), I just pointed out that by RAW pistols (except machine pistols) cannot take that accessory/modification, as we don't know if the OP's GM will agree with this.

Where is the paradox?

1. I would note that the a-16 a shotgun, not one of the catagories comes with a gas vent

2. The paradox is that you could take a light pistol- mod it to have bf/fa have the exact same stats and capabilties, not similair but the exact same stats as a machine pistol but it can't have a gas vent system?