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Jizmack
post Nov 8 2010, 05:29 AM
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Why isn't the Intimidation skill part of the Influence Skill Group?
You can "influence" others with Etiquette, but making people do things using coercion is not influencing them!?
Anyone care to explain this, please?
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Inncubi
post Nov 11 2010, 01:51 PM
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Back to leadership, I am quite fond of the leader kind of characters and what I like about them, more than their ability to boss around NPC's (which usually I am more comfortable to role-play rather than roll-play), is the idea that they help the team work synergically. So, as a GM, I implemented a house rule: leadership can work as a generic "help" skill when two or more characters work together. The third helps them do a better job with leadership adding their successes as dice to the one with the best pool.

It makes it immensely useful, and yes prone to abuse. GM's be warned if you are using it on a table that does that kind of blatant abuse. Otherwise enjoy and see how your players find new uses for old skills (always makes me smile).
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Aku
post Nov 11 2010, 02:22 PM
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QUOTE (Inncubi @ Nov 11 2010, 08:51 AM) *
Back to leadership, I am quite fond of the leader kind of characters and what I like about them, more than their ability to boss around NPC's (which usually I am more comfortable to role-play rather than roll-play), is the idea that they help the team work synergically. So, as a GM, I implemented a house rule: leadership can work as a generic "help" skill when two or more characters work together. The third helps them do a better job with leadership adding their successes as dice to the one with the best pool.

It makes it immensely useful, and yes prone to abuse. GM's be warned if you are using it on a table that does that kind of blatant abuse. Otherwise enjoy and see how your players find new uses for old skills (always makes me smile).


Well, if you're looking to tone the abusability down, but keep some of the flavor, how about instead of adding it as a third set of dice, allowing a character w/ leadership to assist another in a teamwork test, even if they dont have the skill needed for the test.

I.E. Micky the mechanic is repairing the teams GMC Bulldog. Larry the leader doesnt know frag about vehicles, but his pop used to own a mechanic shop and put him in charge (leadership!), so he gives Micky a "hand" by "stuporvising" the project.
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Jizmack
post Nov 11 2010, 06:23 PM
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QUOTE (Aku @ Nov 11 2010, 06:22 AM) *
Micky the mechanic is repairing the teams GMC Bulldog. Larry the leader doesnt know frag about vehicles, but his pop used to own a mechanic shop and put him in charge (leadership!), so he gives Micky a "hand" by "stuporvising" the project.


If you have ever been working on a project or task, and had someone that knows little to nothing about the intricacies/details of your work standing over you to "supervise”, then you’d most likely agree that it’s more a distraction. On an extremely rare occasion the supervisor might be of some help, but it’s never anything significant.

The extra person needs to have expertise or physically assisting to be of any use!

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Posts in this topic
- Jizmack   Influence Skill Group - why no Intimidation?   Nov 8 2010, 05:29 AM
- - Yerameyahu   It already has *four* skills in the group. I guess...   Nov 8 2010, 05:32 AM
- - Karoline   Because Influence is just a name, and it is the na...   Nov 8 2010, 05:39 AM
|- - Hound   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 8 2010, 01:39 AM) Y...   Nov 8 2010, 09:15 AM
|- - Neurosis   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 8 2010, 12:39 AM) B...   Nov 9 2010, 04:53 PM
|- - Mäx   QUOTE (Neurosis @ Nov 9 2010, 06:53 PM) C...   Nov 9 2010, 05:27 PM
- - Critias   QUOTE (Jizmack @ Nov 8 2010, 12:29 AM) Wh...   Nov 8 2010, 06:56 AM
- - phlapjack77   Isn't Intimidation just a form of aggressive N...   Nov 8 2010, 09:50 AM
|- - Aku   QUOTE (phlapjack77 @ Nov 8 2010, 04:50 AM...   Nov 8 2010, 05:29 PM
- - Rotbart van Dainig   Flight is in the Athletics Group, making it 5 ther...   Nov 8 2010, 05:54 PM
|- - Karoline   QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig @ Nov 8 2010, 12...   Nov 8 2010, 06:26 PM
||- - Axe   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 8 2010, 01:26 PM) Y...   Nov 8 2010, 06:38 PM
|- - StealthSigma   QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig @ Nov 8 2010, 01...   Nov 8 2010, 06:36 PM
- - sabs   because 1 point in a skill group is equal to the c...   Nov 8 2010, 06:55 PM
|- - StealthSigma   QUOTE (sabs @ Nov 8 2010, 01:55 PM) becau...   Nov 8 2010, 06:58 PM
- - Ed_209a   I have thought about renaming the RAW Influence gr...   Nov 8 2010, 07:27 PM
|- - Karoline   QUOTE (Ed_209a @ Nov 8 2010, 02:27 PM) I ...   Nov 8 2010, 08:11 PM
|- - StealthSigma   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 8 2010, 03:11 PM) P...   Nov 8 2010, 08:17 PM
- - Karoline   Which would kind of fall under my theory of droppi...   Nov 8 2010, 08:26 PM
- - Shinobi Killfist   The real question for me is why did they feel the ...   Nov 8 2010, 08:44 PM
- - Karoline   I think five is reasonable. Maybe could have trim...   Nov 8 2010, 08:49 PM
|- - sabs   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 8 2010, 08:49 PM) I...   Nov 8 2010, 08:52 PM
|- - Shinobi Killfist   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 8 2010, 03:49 PM) I...   Nov 8 2010, 09:03 PM
|- - StealthSigma   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 8 2010, 03:49 PM) I...   Nov 8 2010, 09:42 PM
- - Yerameyahu   Entirely renovating the skill system isn't rea...   Nov 8 2010, 09:46 PM
- - sabs   Sometimes I think the game would be better with no...   Nov 8 2010, 09:53 PM
|- - Karoline   QUOTE (sabs @ Nov 8 2010, 04:53 PM) Somet...   Nov 8 2010, 10:24 PM
|- - Redcrow   QUOTE (sabs @ Nov 8 2010, 03:53 PM) Somet...   Nov 8 2010, 10:47 PM
- - Ascalaphus   Well, the number of different skills needed to be ...   Nov 8 2010, 11:48 PM
- - Zyerne   Personally, I'd take leadership out if I was g...   Nov 8 2010, 11:52 PM
|- - StealthSigma   QUOTE (Zyerne @ Nov 8 2010, 06:52 PM) Per...   Nov 9 2010, 01:06 PM
- - Karoline   I don't think a face really needs intimidation...   Nov 8 2010, 11:56 PM
|- - Ascalaphus   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 9 2010, 01:56 AM) I...   Nov 9 2010, 12:20 AM
|- - Mongoose   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 9 2010, 12:56 AM) I...   Nov 9 2010, 02:33 AM
|- - Tymeaus Jalynsfein   QUOTE (Mongoose @ Nov 8 2010, 07:33 PM) I...   Nov 9 2010, 03:13 AM
|- - Mongoose   QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Nov 9 2010, 03...   Nov 9 2010, 03:30 AM
|- - Tymeaus Jalynsfein   QUOTE (Mongoose @ Nov 8 2010, 08:30 PM) T...   Nov 9 2010, 03:45 AM
- - Zyerne   Arbitary exclusion, yes, but also perhaps the most...   Nov 9 2010, 12:39 AM
|- - Ascalaphus   QUOTE (Zyerne @ Nov 9 2010, 02:39 AM) Arb...   Nov 9 2010, 01:14 AM
- - Karoline   Leadership = persuasion. Persuasion is very impor...   Nov 9 2010, 01:33 AM
|- - Saint Sithney   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 8 2010, 05:33 PM) L...   Nov 9 2010, 11:08 AM
- - Zyerne   A loaded gun can be equally persuasive.   Nov 9 2010, 01:38 AM
- - Karoline   Not really.   Nov 9 2010, 01:40 AM
- - tagz   The stick stops working as soon as it's not fe...   Nov 9 2010, 01:54 AM
- - Raiki   Well, there would have to be at least one more ski...   Nov 9 2010, 02:51 AM
- - Yerameyahu   Or maybe they're all styles of Intimidation. O...   Nov 9 2010, 03:17 AM
- - Jizmack   Thanks for everyone’s comments! Not sure abou...   Nov 9 2010, 03:57 AM
- - Yerameyahu   On the contrary, social skills can be way too stro...   Nov 9 2010, 04:02 AM
- - Karoline   The fact that a face archetype exists and is commo...   Nov 9 2010, 04:04 AM
- - Jizmack   Yeah, I suppose it’s really specific to the campai...   Nov 9 2010, 04:09 AM
- - tagz   Shadowrun being the setting that it is has enormou...   Nov 9 2010, 04:26 AM
- - Redcrow   The one long-term social interaction in SR that I ...   Nov 9 2010, 08:11 AM
- - Ascalaphus   Intimidation is also used to resist Intimidation. ...   Nov 9 2010, 01:33 PM
|- - StealthSigma   QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Nov 9 2010, 08:33 AM)...   Nov 9 2010, 01:35 PM
- - KarmaInferno   I see the various Influence skills as cooperative,...   Nov 9 2010, 03:24 PM
- - Ascalaphus   I think most of the social skills are antagonistic...   Nov 9 2010, 04:43 PM
|- - Jizmack   QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Nov 9 2010, 08:43 AM)...   Nov 9 2010, 06:45 PM
- - KarmaInferno   Yeah, but the Influence skills generally get their...   Nov 9 2010, 04:51 PM
- - Yerameyahu   I'd go for that. Everyone needs Etiquette anyw...   Nov 9 2010, 07:50 PM
- - Irion   To get back to to the question: First: A skill gro...   Nov 9 2010, 07:52 PM
- - Tyro   Y'know, Leadership gets a lot of dirty looks, ...   Nov 10 2010, 09:22 PM
- - Yerameyahu   I dunno if I've ever seen Leadership used, act...   Nov 10 2010, 09:24 PM
- - Zyerne   Having been looking over the pregens again I'v...   Nov 10 2010, 09:25 PM
- - Karoline   Well, the pre-gens are generally fairly bad. Face...   Nov 10 2010, 09:27 PM
- - Zyerne   I think it's partly an illustration of the ...   Nov 10 2010, 09:30 PM
- - Karoline   True, but it seems like an absurd waste for 1 extr...   Nov 10 2010, 09:38 PM
- - Zyerne   I'm not disputing that at all, had a long conv...   Nov 10 2010, 09:41 PM
|- - Karoline   QUOTE (Zyerne @ Nov 10 2010, 04:41 PM) I...   Nov 10 2010, 09:49 PM
|- - StealthSigma   QUOTE (Karoline @ Nov 10 2010, 04:49 PM) ...   Nov 10 2010, 09:56 PM
- - Zyerne   If I ever recreate my old SR2 merc, she'd take...   Nov 10 2010, 09:53 PM
- - Karoline   Okay, I shouldn't say never take it, but gener...   Nov 10 2010, 09:59 PM
- - Zyerne   Can't argue with that one   Nov 10 2010, 10:05 PM
- - Aku   People swim in SR, i thought it was like GTA where...   Nov 11 2010, 01:50 AM
|- - Karoline   QUOTE (Aku @ Nov 10 2010, 08:50 PM) Peopl...   Nov 11 2010, 02:40 AM
- - Ascalaphus   The problem with swimming skills seems to me that ...   Nov 11 2010, 12:37 PM
|- - StealthSigma   QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Nov 11 2010, 07:37 AM...   Nov 11 2010, 01:17 PM
- - Inncubi   Back to leadership, I am quite fond of the leader ...   Nov 11 2010, 01:51 PM
|- - Aku   QUOTE (Inncubi @ Nov 11 2010, 08:51 AM) B...   Nov 11 2010, 02:22 PM
|- - Inncubi   QUOTE (Aku @ Nov 11 2010, 09:22 AM) Well,...   Nov 11 2010, 02:30 PM
||- - Aku   QUOTE (Inncubi @ Nov 11 2010, 09:30 AM) I...   Nov 11 2010, 03:32 PM
||- - StealthSigma   QUOTE (Aku @ Nov 11 2010, 10:32 AM) O got...   Nov 11 2010, 03:45 PM
||- - Inncubi   QUOTE (StealthSigma @ Nov 11 2010, 10:45 ...   Nov 11 2010, 06:28 PM
|- - Jizmack   QUOTE (Aku @ Nov 11 2010, 06:22 AM) Micky...   Nov 11 2010, 06:23 PM
|- - Aku   QUOTE (Jizmack @ Nov 11 2010, 01:23 PM) I...   Nov 11 2010, 06:50 PM
|- - Shinobi Killfist   QUOTE (Jizmack @ Nov 11 2010, 02:23 PM) I...   Nov 11 2010, 06:59 PM
|- - Jizmack   QUOTE (Shinobi Killfist @ Nov 11 2010, 10...   Nov 11 2010, 07:40 PM
|- - Shinobi Killfist   QUOTE (Jizmack @ Nov 11 2010, 02:40 PM) N...   Nov 11 2010, 08:03 PM
- - StealthSigma   New Specialization for the Leadership skill... Le...   Nov 11 2010, 03:20 PM
- - Yerameyahu   Well, any *reasonable* number can assist on skills...   Nov 11 2010, 03:46 PM
|- - StealthSigma   QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Nov 11 2010, 10:46 AM...   Nov 11 2010, 03:51 PM
- - Yerameyahu   Really can't, in SR4. Either the sniper can se...   Nov 11 2010, 03:54 PM
- - Mäx   Yeah for some to be able to help in sniping with t...   Nov 11 2010, 05:21 PM
- - sabs   I would allow someone to use their Logic+longarms ...   Nov 11 2010, 05:35 PM
- - Jizmack   The listed Leadership Specializations: Gut Check, ...   Nov 11 2010, 07:31 PM
- - Inncubi   Well, the house rule was effective in my game, tha...   Nov 11 2010, 08:33 PM
- - Yerameyahu   I'm pretty concerned about the Strategy and Ta...   Nov 11 2010, 08:42 PM
- - Jizmack   In the context of a typical Shadowrun Team, I basi...   Nov 11 2010, 08:51 PM
- - sabs   Leadership as a tactician would not be a 'char...   Nov 11 2010, 09:17 PM
|- - Jizmack   QUOTE (sabs @ Nov 11 2010, 01:17 PM) Lead...   Nov 11 2010, 09:29 PM
- - Yerameyahu   Perhaps it means 'Leadership in combat' (...   Nov 11 2010, 09:21 PM
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