conjuring questions, noob ?s on materials and services Options

[Riley37]

Usually I try for new and interesting questions, but this time I'm asking for a hit with a clue stick, having never played SR before SR4. Frank T. et alia, if you can speak to game designer's intent, then please do; of course, if you think they missed a better alternative, then I wouldn't be surprised to hear you say so.

If you Summon a spirit, and get several services, then Bind it, do the services left from the Summoning carry over, or do they vanish when you start the binding attempt? Previous thread indiates so, and encourages Binding when you happen to get lotsa services on Summoning (eg summoner rolls all hits and spirit rolls all misses). If you're working with low-Force spirits and can take the Drain and have the time, could you Summon a spirit, if you get few services let it go, Summon again, repeat until you get lots of services, then bind? Some mages might well decide to spend a day on this process to get a bound spirit with max services, although others might rather spend money on rebinding materials. Eg a hard-maxed chargen conjuror, with Magic 6, Summoning 6, +2 Specialization, +2 Mentor bonus, +3 Focus, could eventually get a Force 6 spirit of her favored type summoned with 19 services, and then bind it. The odds in any given summoning attempt are (1/3^19) x ((2/3)^5), so it may take several tries at 5 hours each, for a high value of "several". More realistically, she could hold out for 8 services on a Force 2 spirit before binding. That's a fairly good use of ¥1K in binding materials, and possibly some Edge. NB example assumes summoning specialization stacking with mentor, eg Mentor: Wolf plus Summon (Beast Spirits).

If you get zero net hits in the Binding contest, the spirit is not bound; does it go uncontrolled as per BBB p. 178, same as if the caster passes out from Drain? (which any mage could prevent with a stim patch, by the way, as long as Force=<Magic) Or does it remain in its previous summoned status with services pending? Or something else? What happens to the materials; are they consumed in every attempt, or only consumed when a spirit is bound?

When a spirit is Banished to 0 service, there's a moment in which any mage in LOS can Summon it; but why would you? What's the advantage of doing so, over Summoning a new spirit fresh from the astral talent pool? The differences that occur to me are that a) the banished spirit may have taken S or P damage, and b) the summoner doesn't get to pick the powers. Neither of which is an advantage. The one exception I can think of, is the opportunity to gain services from a Spirit of Man with the optional power of a spell which the original summoner knows - and which you don't know. In which case, a mage with an obscure spell might *sell* the opportunity to banish and take over Man spirits with that spell. "Welcome to Loch Ness. Would you like me to Summon a Spirit of Man with the Detect Nessie spell, so that you can banish and take it?"

Trying to think of an obscure spell led me to the potentially-unique Detect (Object) and Detect (Life Form). Would you allow Detect Holy Grail? (yeah, I know, that's just *asking* for someone to fire an orbital Derail Gun. Have fun, *after* the first questions get answered. I already logged Detect Self, and Detect Self with Extended Area, on the silly spell thread.)