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> Techno's....I thought I knew
Brol_The_Mighty
post Feb 6 2008, 06:56 PM
Post #1


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Alright, so here's the thing. I started a thread last week on how to build a TM, that helps against what I had thought the inherent weaknesses of the TM are. However, over the week there've been many responses, and most of them I understood, and some I did not. And it made me ponder, do I actually KNOW what the inherent weaknesses to the TM are, compared to cybered Hackers...and what're the best ways to overcome these. I'm looking for a Good Hacker, and a Fair, if not Good Rigger. I know, I know, a tall order. Here's the reasons I thought that TMs had problems.

Problems
No cyber advantage.
-The TM has no way of physically storing data that it hacks.

HUGE investment of Karma for skills, as well as Resonance rating.
-Whereas the Hacker uses nyuen for new programs, and abilities (like storage, additional DP's, and such) the TM has to use Karma.

No Matrix Condition.
-TM's use their Physical Condition, instead of Matrix. Thus the need for a higher body, for more boxes.

Reliant upon Sprites.
-The TM's greatest strength is in its Sprites. However, each time you compile, you have to resist Fading. That, and compiling a sprite takes a good amount of time.

Limited Dicepools.
- I don't know if I'm missing something, but I'm just having a hard time seeing how a TM can compete with a Hacker in dicepools for Matrix tasks.

Limited use "Meatside."
- With all the Karma costs associated with getting a TM up, its hard to allocate karma for skills and attributes needed for "meatside" operations.

Solutions

"Burning" a point of Resonance for Cyber/Bio.
-From a fluff perspective, i REALLY don't like this option, but it may be the only one. However, I'm not sure what's the best combo, choices. Best bang for the buck.

Overspecialization
-Definately a viable choice, but leaves you lacking on the meatside. That, and is still tricky to pull off. Unless I've missed something.

Threading
-Using threading with a complex form you already know, you can increase your CF's rating by the amount of hits you get.

Sprite Tasks.
-You can use a task, for the Sprite to assist, adding its rating in DP.

Re-registering Sprites.
-You can have (charisma) in registered sprites. And continually re-register them during downtime.

Houserule.
-Suggested at letting TM's buy CF's at resonance like Mages buy spells. Cost would be 5 Karma.

Storage Devices.
-A TM, or a sprite, can just wirelessly transfer the data to whatever storage device he'd like.


That's all I've got. If anyone has any other disadvantages that I missed, or Solutions, I'd LOVE to hear them. I'm fascinated by the TM, and am just trying to learn as much as I can about making mine a fluid, viable character.

This post has been edited by Redjack: Feb 8 2008, 08:42 PM
Reason for edit: Flagged as an SR4 topic
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Posts in this topic
- Brol_The_Mighty   Techno's....I thought I knew   Feb 6 2008, 06:56 PM
- - raverbane   QUOTE (Brol_The_Mighty @ Feb 6 2008, 01:5...   Feb 6 2008, 08:02 PM
- - Whipstitch   N/M, I missed a rather crucial piece of informatio...   Feb 6 2008, 08:06 PM
- - Mr. Unpronounceable   QUOTE (Brol_The_Mighty @ Feb 6 2008, 07:5...   Feb 6 2008, 08:27 PM
- - djinni   QUOTE (Brol_The_Mighty @ Feb 6 2008, 02:5...   Feb 6 2008, 08:37 PM
|- - raverbane   QUOTE (djinni @ Feb 6 2008, 03:37 PM) has...   Feb 6 2008, 08:56 PM
- - Mr. Unpronounceable   Thought of it, but as stated above, completely unn...   Feb 6 2008, 08:41 PM
- - Blade   The TM can store data quite easily. He just has to...   Feb 6 2008, 08:52 PM
- - Brol_The_Mighty   Isn't there a downside to re-registering a spr...   Feb 6 2008, 08:53 PM
|- - Dashifen   QUOTE (Brol_The_Mighty @ Feb 6 2008, 02:5...   Feb 6 2008, 08:58 PM
|- - raverbane   QUOTE (Brol_The_Mighty @ Feb 6 2008, 03:5...   Feb 6 2008, 09:01 PM
- - Aaron   QUOTE (Brol_The_Mighty @ Feb 6 2008, 12:5...   Feb 6 2008, 09:25 PM
- - nathanross   I guess nows as good a time as ever to try to fix ...   Feb 6 2008, 11:09 PM
- - hobgoblin   nothing like "crap, that file is in my other ...   Feb 6 2008, 11:12 PM
- - Whipstitch   I think what TMs needed more than anything was a d...   Feb 6 2008, 11:17 PM
- - hobgoblin   didnt someone make a post ones about the TM only n...   Feb 6 2008, 11:25 PM
- - nathanross   That is true, there are a few that you can avoid, ...   Feb 6 2008, 11:41 PM
- - Brol_The_Mighty   No idea   Feb 6 2008, 11:43 PM
- - hobgoblin   so dont go that hard, call a sprite and thread it ...   Feb 6 2008, 11:43 PM
- - Brol_The_Mighty   Wouldn't that just be admitting defeat, and ke...   Feb 6 2008, 11:52 PM
- - hobgoblin   i dont see it admitting defeat, i see it as the TM...   Feb 6 2008, 11:59 PM
|- - nathanross   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Feb 6 2008, 06:59 PM) ...   Feb 7 2008, 12:40 AM
- - Brol_The_Mighty   All of the TM's "unique" abilities, ...   Feb 7 2008, 12:21 AM
- - Jaid   i will freely agree that the TM's echoes (exce...   Feb 7 2008, 12:45 AM
- - hobgoblin   thanks jaid, i was starting to wonder if i had mis...   Feb 7 2008, 12:56 AM
- - Whipstitch   If you want the Matrix to be more all-encompassing...   Feb 7 2008, 12:59 AM
|- - Cthulhudreams   QUOTE (Whipstitch @ Feb 6 2008, 08:59 PM)...   Feb 8 2008, 02:53 AM
- - nathanross   Brol actually classified this better than I did: ...   Feb 7 2008, 07:46 AM
|- - Konsaki   QUOTE (nathanross @ Feb 7 2008, 02:46 AM)...   Feb 7 2008, 12:25 PM
- - Ryu   Technomancers are a bit special within the RAW mat...   Feb 7 2008, 12:16 PM
|- - Konsaki   QUOTE (Ryu @ Feb 7 2008, 07:16 AM) I thin...   Feb 7 2008, 12:30 PM
|- - Ryu   QUOTE (Konsaki @ Feb 7 2008, 01:30 PM) Th...   Feb 7 2008, 01:29 PM
- - Ustio   QUOTE (Ryu @ Feb 7 2008, 08:16 AM) The st...   Feb 7 2008, 12:37 PM
- - Malicant   So, threading is da shitz and technos can run arou...   Feb 7 2008, 01:45 PM
- - Ryu   Threading is +2 for free, the sprite power of ...   Feb 7 2008, 01:51 PM
- - darthmord   Question on TMs... Couldn't they just hang ou...   Feb 7 2008, 03:03 PM
- - Nightwalker450   As far as I've understood the matrix, anybody ...   Feb 7 2008, 03:13 PM
- - Nightwalker450   Everyone has pointed out lots of flaws but there a...   Feb 7 2008, 03:32 PM
- - Mr. Unpronounceable   Oh, and another fun tactic if the team has a mage ...   Feb 7 2008, 05:11 PM
- - hobgoblin   how about a rigger cocoon on a segway?   Feb 7 2008, 08:58 PM
|- - Mr. Unpronounceable   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Feb 7 2008, 09:58 PM) ...   Feb 7 2008, 09:01 PM
- - hobgoblin   ah yes, forgot about that. still, isnt that what t...   Feb 7 2008, 09:13 PM
- - nathanross   Werent these TM's normal people before they ha...   Feb 7 2008, 09:49 PM
- - nathanross   As I said before, Technomancers are only about 5 y...   Feb 8 2008, 04:14 AM
- - Jaid   just a side note, with the new PMVs in arsenal and...   Feb 8 2008, 04:18 AM
- - nathanross   What Im saying is.......... They shouldn't HAV...   Feb 8 2008, 04:32 AM
|- - Ryu   QUOTE (nathanross @ Feb 8 2008, 05:32 AM)...   Feb 8 2008, 01:02 PM
- - hobgoblin   i wonder, can a machine sprite diagnose a smartgun...   Feb 8 2008, 05:24 AM
|- - Mr. Unpronounceable   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Feb 8 2008, 05:24 AM) ...   Feb 8 2008, 04:42 PM
- - The Monk   One of the things that frustrated me about SR3 was...   Feb 8 2008, 07:26 AM
- - Dashifen   How would you suggest going about this disconnect,...   Feb 8 2008, 02:08 PM
- - Ryu   You can base all matrix attributes on Resonance. S...   Feb 8 2008, 02:53 PM
- - swirler   since this is a TM thread its as good a place as a...   Feb 8 2008, 04:57 PM
- - Malicant   Mine does. It's a nice front.   Feb 8 2008, 05:00 PM
- - Mr. Unpronounceable   Like the guy with type-O organs, being a technoman...   Feb 8 2008, 05:16 PM
- - Malicant   At least the Type-Owen will have a quick, painless...   Feb 8 2008, 05:18 PM
|- - Moon-Hawk   QUOTE (Malicant @ Feb 8 2008, 12:18 PM) A...   Feb 8 2008, 05:28 PM
- - Mr. Unpronounceable   AFAIK, there's no regeneration spells in SR4. ...   Feb 8 2008, 05:44 PM
|- - darthmord   QUOTE (Mr. Unpronounceable @ Feb 8 2008, 12...   Feb 8 2008, 06:20 PM
- - Moon-Hawk   Hmmm, with a high-power heal backing you up, I won...   Feb 8 2008, 06:26 PM
|- - Ryu   QUOTE (Moon-Hawk @ Feb 8 2008, 07:26...   Feb 8 2008, 08:50 PM
- - Malicant   I'm pretty sure Heal is intended to close woun...   Feb 8 2008, 06:36 PM
- - swirler   in our old SR1 campaign the gm had a spell an enem...   Feb 8 2008, 06:43 PM
- - Nightwalker450   I'll add this realization of another Bonus her...   Feb 8 2008, 08:37 PM
- - Malicant   Pesky egocentric shapeshifters. As if they needed ...   Feb 8 2008, 09:16 PM
|- - Fortune   QUOTE (Malicant @ Feb 9 2008, 08:16 AM) A...   Feb 8 2008, 09:39 PM
- - Malicant   One metamagic is cheapter than Submersion+Resonanc...   Feb 8 2008, 09:53 PM
- - nathanross   While going off topic, the fact that we are discus...   Feb 9 2008, 01:58 AM
- - Malicant   I even think the TM is more karma draining, since ...   Feb 9 2008, 02:25 AM
|- - nathanross   QUOTE (Malicant @ Feb 8 2008, 09:25 PM) I...   Feb 9 2008, 05:35 AM
|- - jago668   QUOTE (nathanross @ Feb 9 2008, 01:35 AM)...   Feb 9 2008, 05:41 AM
- - hobgoblin   so i guess one could summarize that anyone picking...   Feb 9 2008, 05:47 AM
|- - Ryu   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Feb 9 2008, 06:47 AM) ...   Feb 9 2008, 12:36 PM
- - Gargs454   Personally, I don't think the problem lies wit...   Feb 9 2008, 05:01 PM
- - nathanross   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Feb 9 2008, 12:47 AM) ...   Feb 9 2008, 08:22 PM
- - Ryu   Hackers are not to cheap, everyone should dabble i...   Feb 9 2008, 09:00 PM
- - Nightwalker450   I just noticed that Sprites in general can't a...   Feb 10 2008, 10:58 PM
- - Malicant   Ever noticed fault sprites are effectivly blind?   Feb 10 2008, 11:30 PM
|- - Fortune   QUOTE (Malicant @ Feb 11 2008, 10:30 AM) ...   Feb 11 2008, 12:20 AM
|- - nathanross   QUOTE (Fortune @ Feb 10 2008, 07:20 PM) D...   Feb 11 2008, 12:40 AM
- - Malicant   Actually, no. They can default on INT. What can a ...   Feb 11 2008, 12:50 AM
|- - Mr. Unpronounceable   QUOTE (Malicant @ Feb 11 2008, 01:50 AM) ...   Feb 11 2008, 05:14 PM
- - nathanross   I was hoping it would be understood that I was bei...   Feb 11 2008, 03:50 AM
- - Malicant   Yeah it is. I should know. More smileys help, s...   Feb 11 2008, 04:01 AM
- - Ryu   I am of the opinion that stealth disguises you as ...   Feb 11 2008, 05:57 PM
- - hobgoblin   im guessing people are referring to matrix percept...   Feb 11 2008, 06:16 PM
|- - nathanross   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Feb 11 2008, 02:16 PM)...   Feb 11 2008, 08:42 PM
- - Brol_The_Mighty   Okay, so now, Unwired is FINALLY out. What's ...   Nov 2 2008, 11:12 AM
- - hobgoblin   there goes the neighborhood...   Nov 2 2008, 01:06 PM
- - Brol_The_Mighty   Lol....and that means?   Nov 2 2008, 09:54 PM
- - hobgoblin   the opinions on TM's, as just about any other ...   Nov 2 2008, 09:56 PM
- - Brol_The_Mighty   Gotcha, and I completely agree. I was just hoping...   Nov 2 2008, 10:35 PM
- - hobgoblin   if anything, TM's are even more karma hungry. ...   Nov 2 2008, 10:49 PM
- - ElFenrir   I'm sort of tempted, reading about this, to tr...   Nov 2 2008, 11:20 PM
- - hobgoblin   i suspect he would be sprite focused rather then s...   Nov 2 2008, 11:25 PM
- - ElFenrir   Probably. I'm just starting to learn the ropes...   Nov 2 2008, 11:36 PM
- - Brol_The_Mighty   I would be highly interested to see the results.   Nov 2 2008, 11:37 PM
- - hobgoblin   a submerged TM can gain some nice equivalents to c...   Nov 2 2008, 11:57 PM
- - ElFenrir   One thing I'm debating is an extra meat-pass. ...   Nov 3 2008, 12:02 AM
- - Tiger Eyes   A combat techno becomes very possible with several...   Nov 3 2008, 12:05 AM
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