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> The Great CGL Rumors and Speculation Thread
FrankTrollman
post Mar 16 2010, 07:30 PM
Post #1


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OK, as you may well have been able to surmise from release schedules, Catalyst Game Labs is in a bit of a financial pickle, and it is somewhat unlikely that they will retain the license to make Shadowrun products. This is not because Shadowrun hasn't been selling enough to cover expenses, but merely because a significant quantity of money is missing outright. Reliable sources put this figure at roughly $850,000. Which sounds like a lot, and it is. It is roughly 40% of Catalyst's entire sales for last year, missing over a three year period. There will of course be lawsuits, and there are already people drawing up legal documents accusing Loren Coleman of having hired people to construct an extension on his house through the company as "freelance writers" and somehow reporting an estimated $100,000 of convention sales as $6,000. Whether that is actually true or not is - of course - a matter for the courts to decide. And decide they presumably will.

But what that means for Catalyst as a company is pretty bad. It costs several dollars to print a book even when the pdfs are finished and ready for publication. A print run of say, 50,000 books (like the print run of Runner Havens) would cost somewhere between $150,000 and $250,000 to print and ship to distributors. And while it eventually sold to distributors at ~$15 a book (a total take home of $750,000), it did so over a period of three years, during which time they were paying interest on loans and paying for storage, and advertisement and so on and so forth. A book like that isn't actually taking home half a million in profits. Which is a bad thing, because it means that even if there was a complete book printed and ready to sell, even a total and rapid sell through would not pull the company out of the financial hole it is in - and the shortfall means that it does not have the cash on hand to start the ball rolling with a new major printing.

The tiny amount of drachmas that are left in the coffers are being used to print up tiny print runs of books that have sold through - another 3,000 books of Runner's Companion for example (~$15,000 to start up, maybe $30-40k towards paying creditors if it sells out). There simply is not the startup cash to bring upcoming books like the SR4 sixth world almanac or corporate guide forward. The writing is there, but the printing costs are not. Beyond that, the freelancers have not been paid, and some of them are withholding copyright until they are - meaning that even a tiny print run of these new materials is simply not possible.

Many SR writers are quitting, have already quit, or have handed in notices contingent on demands which - word on the street - will not be met. And CGL does not even own Shadowrun, it leases the intellectual property from Topps. It seems unlikely that they will be able to make their licensing payment when the contract comes up for renewal - in a couple of months. At that time, CGL will cease being able to print Shadowrun or Battletech materials (they would presumably keep the license to Cthulhutech and Eclipse Phase for at least a little while longer, because those are separate contracts).

So what does this mean for the future of Shadowrun? It probably means that someone else will create a company and start making Shadowrun again. After all, freelancers work for very little, and a well selling book can bring in tens of thousands of dollars in profits. $850,000 of embezzlement is seemingly enough to sink the company (whoever ended up with the credsticks), but I must point out that there was indeed eight hundred and fifty thousand dollars to steal, so Shadowrun is not - as a concept - insoluble. And I also point out that something similar happened to Shadowrun before. Indeed, twice before, as both FanPro and FASA before it collapsed under the weight of people not paying debts and having bags with dollar bill signs vanish mysteriously in the middle of the night. It's somewhat... poetic considering the subject matter of the game itself.

It is entirely probable indeed that when a new company comes to take the licence, many familiar faces will appear in the new company as if they had never left. Certainly back when FanPro collapsed back when I was working for the company, I simply started working for the new company as if nothing had changed. This happened back when FASA collapsed as well - those members of the team that were not extracted by Microsoft simply started turning in writing assignments to the new boss.

And yeah, I regularly go on shadowruns against Catalyst to find out what new releases are in store. Don't you?

-Frank
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Posts in this topic
- FrankTrollman   The Great CGL Rumors and Speculation Thread   Mar 16 2010, 07:30 PM
- - Ancient History   Before anyone calls bullshit on Frank for this, I ...   Mar 16 2010, 07:45 PM
- - bmcoomes   OK, how about a fundraiser for them. I know I can ...   Mar 16 2010, 07:50 PM
|- - Udoshi   QUOTE (bmcoomes @ Mar 16 2010, 12:50 PM) ...   Mar 16 2010, 08:35 PM
|- - MJBurrage   QUOTE (Udoshi @ Mar 16 2010, 03:35 PM) I...   Mar 16 2010, 08:44 PM
||- - Udoshi   QUOTE (MJBurrage @ Mar 16 2010, 01:44 PM)...   Mar 16 2010, 08:49 PM
||- - Chrome Tiger   QUOTE (Udoshi @ Mar 16 2010, 04:49 PM) Ex...   Mar 16 2010, 08:53 PM
||- - Demonseed Elite   QUOTE (Chrome Tiger @ Mar 16 2010, 03:53 ...   Mar 16 2010, 09:03 PM
||- - Patrick Goodman   QUOTE (Chrome Tiger @ Mar 16 2010, 02:53 ...   Mar 17 2010, 12:24 AM
||- - Chrome Tiger   QUOTE (Patrick Goodman @ Mar 16 2010, 08...   Mar 17 2010, 01:02 AM
|- - Sengir   QUOTE (Udoshi @ Mar 16 2010, 09:35 PM) I...   Mar 16 2010, 09:00 PM
- - HeySparky   Ummm... a fundraiser to give monies to people who ...   Mar 16 2010, 07:51 PM
- - bmcoomes   it wasn't squandered it was stolen.   Mar 16 2010, 07:52 PM
- - knasser   Wow. I guess first thing to say is thank you for b...   Mar 16 2010, 07:52 PM
|- - JM Hardy   Let me go through and put answers beneath each of ...   Mar 16 2010, 09:52 PM
|- - Udoshi   QUOTE (JM Hardy @ Mar 16 2010, 02:52 PM) ...   Mar 17 2010, 12:16 AM
- - Nifft   I'll be happy enough if Shadowrun survives. T...   Mar 16 2010, 07:56 PM
- - Ancient History   Khadim, I'd like to be able to answer your que...   Mar 16 2010, 07:57 PM
|- - knasser   QUOTE (Ancient History @ Mar 16 2010, 07...   Mar 16 2010, 08:04 PM
|- - Rotbart van Dainig   QUOTE (knasser @ Mar 16 2010, 09:04 PM) T...   Mar 16 2010, 08:08 PM
|- - knasser   QUOTE (Rotbart van Dainig @ Mar 16 2010, 08...   Mar 16 2010, 08:11 PM
- - Stahlseele   I can't help but appreciate the irony . .   Mar 16 2010, 07:59 PM
- - darthmord   What does this mean for those of us who have a 1+ ...   Mar 16 2010, 08:02 PM
- - Warlordtheft   Wow....thanks for the information. Do you know whe...   Mar 16 2010, 08:09 PM
- - DireRadiant   Heh, copied to RPG.Net already. 30 minutes.   Mar 16 2010, 08:10 PM
- - gorramfrakker   If CGL dies then someone will pick up the pieces. ...   Mar 16 2010, 08:15 PM
|- - Stahlseele   QUOTE (gorramfrakker @ Mar 16 2010, 09:15...   Mar 16 2010, 08:20 PM
- - KnightIII   I only pray Wizards of the Coast doesnt buy Shadow...   Mar 16 2010, 08:16 PM
|- - Fatum   QUOTE (KnightIII @ Mar 16 2010, 11:16 PM)...   Mar 16 2010, 08:20 PM
- - Demonseed Elite   I am so very, very unsurprised.   Mar 16 2010, 08:19 PM
- - winterhawk11   AH was kind enough to point me at this thread. If...   Mar 16 2010, 08:23 PM
|- - TW   QUOTE (winterhawk11 @ Mar 16 2010, 03:23 ...   Mar 16 2010, 09:11 PM
- - tsuyoshikentsu   Moderator Note: Merging this with the big CGL rum...   Mar 16 2010, 08:24 PM
|- - Synner667   QUOTE (tsuyoshikentsu @ Mar 16 2010, 08:2...   Mar 16 2010, 08:32 PM
|- - knasser   QUOTE (tsuyoshikentsu @ Mar 16 2010, 08:2...   Mar 16 2010, 08:41 PM
- - tim   damn...... that sucks, and god i hope WotC doesnt...   Mar 16 2010, 08:24 PM
- - tsuyoshikentsu   WotC is losing the Star Wars license and bleeding ...   Mar 16 2010, 08:25 PM
|- - Brazilian_Shinobi   QUOTE (tsuyoshikentsu @ Mar 16 2010, 05:2...   Mar 16 2010, 09:08 PM
- - Demonseed Elite   Your dedication to the game is admirable, but the ...   Mar 16 2010, 08:27 PM
- - Pendaric   I think my re-action to phase this succinctly in t...   Mar 16 2010, 08:27 PM
- - Sengir   What the...? How in.. QUOTE (FrankTrollman ...   Mar 16 2010, 08:29 PM
- - Stahlseele   I posted this on the classicbattletech boards. On...   Mar 16 2010, 08:29 PM
- - Dumori   At least we are free from such censorship on the ...   Mar 16 2010, 08:32 PM
- - DireRadiant   Shadowrun has tons of fan support and material. Gl...   Mar 16 2010, 08:35 PM
- - Dumori   Yep its not an issue of sales or such.   Mar 16 2010, 08:41 PM
- - Warlordtheft   In all honesty, I think this will be the end of CG...   Mar 16 2010, 08:44 PM
|- - Chrome Tiger   QUOTE (Warlordtheft @ Mar 16 2010, 04:44 ...   Mar 16 2010, 08:56 PM
|- - knasser   QUOTE (Chrome Tiger @ Mar 16 2010, 08:56 ...   Mar 16 2010, 09:04 PM
- - Dumori   Ouch I hope for every ones sake this issue with CG...   Mar 16 2010, 09:00 PM
- - Thanee   That's sad news. CGL has been doing awesome wo...   Mar 16 2010, 09:02 PM
- - Kumo   Damn. That. Really. Sucks.   Mar 16 2010, 09:03 PM
- - AngelisStorm   But if they could come up with enough to hold onto...   Mar 16 2010, 09:04 PM
|- - Demonseed Elite   QUOTE (AngelisStorm @ Mar 16 2010, 04:04 ...   Mar 16 2010, 09:07 PM
- - Demonseed Elite   I just want to support knasser's idea. Good fa...   Mar 16 2010, 09:04 PM
|- - Chrome Tiger   QUOTE (Demonseed Elite @ Mar 16 2010, 04...   Mar 16 2010, 09:16 PM
- - Mickle5125   oh. Frag. This sucks. Hope things work out. Any...   Mar 16 2010, 09:09 PM
|- - JM Hardy   QUOTE (Mickle5125 @ Mar 16 2010, 04:09 PM...   Mar 16 2010, 09:33 PM
|- - knasser   QUOTE (JM Hardy @ Mar 16 2010, 09:33 PM) ...   Mar 16 2010, 09:37 PM
- - Khyron   Damn it, I liked CGL too.   Mar 16 2010, 09:20 PM
- - Garou   maybe we could use some funding scheme, like the K...   Mar 16 2010, 09:25 PM
- - Tiger Eyes   I won't comment on Frank's post at this ti...   Mar 16 2010, 09:26 PM
- - Fatum   Oh the irony of the real life.   Mar 16 2010, 09:26 PM
- - Axl   $850,000? I hope the selfish bastard who did ...   Mar 16 2010, 09:31 PM
- - Stahlseele   QUOTE I again ask people to keep speculation on th...   Mar 16 2010, 09:35 PM
- - JM Hardy   Hey folks: Just want to throw in a couple things:...   Mar 16 2010, 09:39 PM
- - TW   Adam Jury resigned from CGL   Mar 16 2010, 09:45 PM
- - cndblank   Sorry to hear this. Been some great stuff coming ...   Mar 16 2010, 09:49 PM
- - The Jake   Wow. Just wow. Hopefully this all gets sorted. I...   Mar 16 2010, 09:55 PM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (The Jake @ Mar 16 2010, 04:55 PM) ...   Mar 17 2010, 12:10 AM
- - Bull   Ok kids. See my Sticky thread about this. But I...   Mar 17 2010, 12:10 AM
- - ravensmuse   I just want to say two things: 1. This sucks. I t...   Mar 17 2010, 12:20 AM
- - Dumori   Its called defection we dont want to even think of...   Mar 17 2010, 12:24 AM
- - Murrdox   I love Shadowrun and I love Catalyst. I just foun...   Mar 17 2010, 12:34 AM
- - BlackHat   I hope this does work out for the freelancers, who...   Mar 17 2010, 12:39 AM
- - Delarn   Why can't we just push Topps to extend their l...   Mar 17 2010, 12:39 AM
- - Sengir   Alright, something that is (presumably) not based ...   Mar 17 2010, 12:41 AM
|- - the_dunner   QUOTE (Sengir @ Mar 16 2010, 08:41 PM) Al...   Mar 17 2010, 12:49 AM
- - Tanegar   If CGL does lose the rights to Shadowrun, I hope t...   Mar 17 2010, 12:43 AM
- - Penta   Because to Topps, who make billions off of basebal...   Mar 17 2010, 12:44 AM
- - BishopMcQ   Topps owns the BattleTech and Shadowrun licenses f...   Mar 17 2010, 12:46 AM
- - nylanfs   I would say that it's valid speculation on who...   Mar 17 2010, 12:47 AM
|- - Synner667   QUOTE (nylanfs @ Mar 17 2010, 12:47 AM) W...   Mar 17 2010, 12:54 AM
|- - tsuyoshikentsu   QUOTE (nylanfs @ Mar 16 2010, 05:47 PM) W...   Mar 17 2010, 01:12 AM
- - Method   Wow. That'll teach me to go to work all day a...   Mar 17 2010, 01:05 AM
|- - Patrick Goodman   QUOTE (Method @ Mar 16 2010, 07:05 PM) Sp...   Mar 17 2010, 01:16 AM
- - Wesley Street   As a quasi-freelancer (who actually received his f...   Mar 17 2010, 01:15 AM
- - Mr. Man   You guys are all way off base. My bet: Shadowrun...   Mar 17 2010, 01:16 AM
- - ColdEquation   This is...disheartening. I just got back into Sha...   Mar 17 2010, 01:21 AM
- - Method   QUOTE (Mr. Man @ Mar 16 2010, 06:16 PM) M...   Mar 17 2010, 01:27 AM
- - crash2029   Is it just me or does it seem like the rumored cor...   Mar 17 2010, 01:35 AM
- - nemafow   Gonna be a sad session tonight when I at least let...   Mar 17 2010, 01:37 AM
- - TheWanderingJewels   Well......Hellfire and Damnation. This was a unple...   Mar 17 2010, 01:37 AM
- - SCLariat   Did CGL carry any type of insurance which might co...   Mar 17 2010, 01:38 AM
|- - Penta   QUOTE (SCLariat @ Mar 16 2010, 09:38 PM) ...   Mar 17 2010, 01:54 AM
- - MikeKozar   I wonder if Steve Jackson Games is interested? Th...   Mar 17 2010, 01:40 AM
- - tweak   This makes me sad. I want to wish the employees ...   Mar 17 2010, 01:49 AM
- - Brazilian_Shinobi   I was talking to Garou about this. While I would s...   Mar 17 2010, 01:52 AM
- - Dr.Rockso   Well....drek. I certainly feel silly, having pre-o...   Mar 17 2010, 01:58 AM
- - Delarn   QUOTE (Dr.Rockso @ Mar 16 2010, 09:58 PM)...   Mar 17 2010, 02:06 AM
- - JM Hardy   QUOTE (Dr.Rockso @ Mar 16 2010, 08:58 PM)...   Mar 17 2010, 02:20 AM
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