 House Rules, Ammo questions |
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 Feb 12 2006, 12:03 AM
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#151
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Runner  Group: Members Posts: 2,556 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle Member No.: 98  |
The vast majority of EMTs (essentially, those not attached to SWAT units) go into dangerous situations only after they're secured by police. EMTs are NOT supposed to expose themselves to hostilities, as an injured EMT is now a drain on resources in a situation, instead of a resource himself. The whole point in my thinking behind having a vest on would be that it's much easier to get OUT of a bad situation if a bullet doesn't punch a hole in your chest, first.
Teargas/pepper spray I've considered, the difficulty is deploying it in close quarters (for example, the inside of an ambulance) without exposing yourself in the process. I've also considered a Taser, which will more reliably disable an assailant under the influence of drugs or in an altered mental state (a decent portion of the population EMTs get called for). A handgun is probably off the list of things to have along... I've got a feeling any EMT who shoots a patient or someone on-scene is going to find himself out of a job really quickly. This would, of course, be influenced by the neighborhood I end up working in. White phosphorus grenades? Where do YOU live? :eek: |
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Feb 12 2006, 07:22 AM
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#152
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Target Group: Members Posts: 89 Joined: 29-January 06 From: Orlando, Florida Member No.: 8,210 |
Hmm, do you guys think the present combat system works so far?
I have been playing with different formulas for combat within the present system but I am still debating and testing the results. I just don't like how the different ammos and armor intereact with each other, it ust feels off. |
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Feb 12 2006, 01:47 PM
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#153
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Midnight Toker Group: Members Posts: 7,686 Joined: 4-July 04 From: Zombie Drop Bear Santa's Workshop Member No.: 6,456 |
I simply assumed EMT was a clever euphemism :cyber:
WP presents some advantage against bodyarmor including being resisted by half impct. The continuous burning can distract even the best traint SWAT officer long enough to facilitate an escape. |
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Feb 12 2006, 01:53 PM
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#154
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Target Group: Members Posts: 16 Joined: 5-January 06 From: Kansas City Area, Missouri Member No.: 8,134 |
Indeed. The number one item pounded into me throughout training was safety. In descending order the list goes: Myself, my partner, my patient, bystanders. Of course, sometimes EMTs get ambushed (an EMT was killed about 3 years ago when a guy started firing on an ambulance when it pulled up to his house.) As for weapons...well...from everything I know any weapon is a no-no. Period. |
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Feb 14 2006, 07:59 AM
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#155
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Target Group: Members Posts: 22 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 385 |
Define common use. We use a APDS round for our sniper rifles. Heres a link: http://www.amkat.se/762x51/762x51.html Scroll down to "7,62 mm Sk Ptr 10 PRICK" |
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Feb 14 2006, 08:25 AM
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#156
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
Now that is interesting. My Swedish sucks, and the English FMV site doesn't seem to have any additional information on the round. Any idea where I can read more about that cartridge? What has been changed from the original SLAP design, which I assume is the same as the US army M948 (which, AFAICT, is no longer used)?
Do you know if such ammunition is used by any other military? If it's just snipers in the Swedish Army then I wouldn't call it "common use". :) |
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Feb 14 2006, 09:05 AM
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#157
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Target Group: Members Posts: 22 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 385 |
They have recently remade the FMV site, can´t find the info one the swedish version either. I´m looking around for more info for you.
Don´t know if any other countries use it, haven´t checked. I didn't mean that the use of it by swedish snipers made it common use but thats why I asked what your definition was :) Edit: A source said that the round is a variant of the M948. Edit2: btw, why doesn´t the US mil use the 7,62x51 SLAP anymore? Was it because it can´t be used with muzzle break/flash hider or perhaps because of the malfunctions they had in the M60 or the fact that it can but shouldn´t be used in MG:s? |
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Feb 14 2006, 09:59 AM
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#158
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
I appreciate that. It'd be good to know if and why SLAPs in smaller calibers make it back into use.
No doubt feed and muzzle brake issues had a lot to do with it. I don't really see what the current US military would gain by using such ammunition either -- the slight potential gains in effective range of penetration of hard targets would not be worth the higher price, lesser terminal effect against personnel targets, and the other mentioned drawbacks. I have no idea if it was ever used in number in sniper rifles. |
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Feb 14 2006, 10:20 AM
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#159
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Target Group: Members Posts: 22 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 385 |
It should only be used in sniper rifles, rapid or autofire weapons will cause funny malfunctions like the bullet exiting thru the side of the barrel :)
The usefullness in sniper rifles is not limited to penetration. For example it...ehh, don´t know the phrases in english but it has lower "d-max", it has a lower maximum top of its ballistic arc. Make sense? When shooting at 1000m the height over the sightline at 600m are: APDS: 225 cm FMJ: 540 cm FMJ Tracer: 553 cm Also, the sub-caliber 7,62 round is 32% less affected by wind and since it has a higher V0(1300m/s) it reaches the target in much less time than a FMJ 7,62 and thus has less time to be affected by wind and other outside factors. A sniper using sub-caliber rounds have much better marginals for misjudging range, wind and such. |
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Feb 14 2006, 10:27 AM
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#160
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Target Group: Members Posts: 22 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 385 |
Found some info:
From FMV: "Under utvecklingen var många företag delaktiga, men det blev Winchester i USA som våren 1998 fick beställningen på en miljon patroner. Patronen är en vidareutveckling av deras "7,62 SLAP". Skillnaden utgörs av ökad utgångshastighet och minskad spridning. Ammunitionen kommer att levereras under 1999." Translation: "During development many companies took part, but it was Winchester in USA that spring 1998 got the order for one million rounds. The round is a development of their "7,62 SLAP". The difference is an increased muzzle velocity and reduced spread. The ammunition will be delivered during 1999." |
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Feb 14 2006, 12:15 PM
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#161
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
Yeah, that's very reasonable actually, provided that the light projectile maintains the high velocity like this one seems to. Some articles note that accuracy with the SLAPs is slightly worse than with full caliber ammunition, which is to be expected. The changes from the M948 might include making the projectile shorter, and lighter, to better stabilize it with the normal rifling of the PSG-90. AFAIK, accuracy with the M948 at 1000 yards with a rifle meant for firing 140-170 grain FMJs would be crap. Thanks for the information. Makes me wonder if Sweden is truly the only military using something like this. Solid data on small caliber sabot rounds is difficult to find on the net. |
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