 Cruise ship? nah. Cruise ZEPPLIN, sorta |
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 Mar 4 2006, 08:37 AM
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#1
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Uncle Fisty  Group: Admin Posts: 13,891 Joined: 3-January 05 From: Next To Her Member No.: 6,928  |
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Mar 4 2006, 10:26 AM
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#2
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Shadowrun Setting Nerd Group: Banned Posts: 3,632 Joined: 28-June 05 From: Pissing on pedestrians from my electronic ivory tower. Member No.: 7,473 |
What is this? 1932?
I do like it, though. I once ran in a game set on a flying hotel flying across the Atlantic, but it was a flying-wing plane, and not a blimp. Aw, man. That was a neat game. |
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Mar 4 2006, 10:31 AM
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#3
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Uncle Fisty Group: Admin Posts: 13,891 Joined: 3-January 05 From: Next To Her Member No.: 6,928 |
just bringing it up since they've started showing up in SR , like the Zeppelin heist in SOTA 64
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Mar 4 2006, 12:11 PM
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#4
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Shadowrun Setting Nerd Group: Banned Posts: 3,632 Joined: 28-June 05 From: Pissing on pedestrians from my electronic ivory tower. Member No.: 7,473 |
Oh, I know. Perhaps it was because the first thought that came to me when I saw the title was, "No ticket."
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Mar 4 2006, 12:14 PM
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#5
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Uncle Fisty Group: Admin Posts: 13,891 Joined: 3-January 05 From: Next To Her Member No.: 6,928 |
Last Crusade?
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Mar 4 2006, 06:21 PM
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#6
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
I've been hearing about this. It's supposed to be the "next big thing" in tourism travel. Pretty much like it says, it's a cruise ship in the sky.
Personally, I can't wait to go on one. |
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Mar 4 2006, 06:42 PM
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#7
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Target Group: Members Posts: 45 Joined: 4-March 06 From: Residence For The Magically Deviant Member No.: 8,333 |
I'm sure this has been tried before a couple of times. From what I remember the big problem was the companies trying to get zeppelins back in fashion (or whatever) keep thinking too big and going bust about halfway through.
Still, if it's built I'm so getting a ticket. It'd be awesome. |
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Mar 5 2006, 05:16 AM
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#8
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
Why are they avoiding lighter than air (or near lighter than air or controlled neutral bouyancy)?
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Mar 5 2006, 05:53 AM
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#9
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,028 Joined: 9-November 02 From: The Republic of Vermont Member No.: 3,581 |
Sadly, Rigger 3 doesn't allow for building proper zeppelins.
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Mar 5 2006, 12:39 PM
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#10
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
Although you can make a nice solar powered very mobile home for a few million.
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Mar 5 2006, 02:02 PM
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#11
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,073 Joined: 23-August 04 Member No.: 6,587 |
Probably for the same reason they game that you cant build a main battle tank, no runner is ever going to get one. This dose rase a question however. AIRCRAFT CARIER??!!?!?!?? Edward |
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Mar 5 2006, 04:01 PM
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#12
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
don't forget, locomotive.
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Mar 5 2006, 04:12 PM
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#13
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 114 Joined: 27-April 05 From: Summoning a spirit of the land Member No.: 7,362 |
awesome!
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Mar 6 2006, 06:34 AM
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#14
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 199 Joined: 11-September 05 Member No.: 7,729 |
Partially, if not mostly, because of the Hindenburg disaster way, way back in the day. The industry was never really able to come back from that one. And partially because of the lack of a reliable hydrogen substitute. LTA gasses in sufficient quantity are quite difficult to get ahold of on Earth. It was explained to me once, when I asked this very question, that part of the trouble is that the US possesses almost half of the viable helium (which is generally the preferred substitute since it doesn't burn) reserves on the planet, so while US-based corporations and organizations can get enough for the occasional full-size blimp, foreign concerns have a more difficult time of it. And the gas is highly valued in a number of industrial applications so that many of the producers appear hesitant to offer it up for something as frivolous as luxury air travel. |
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Mar 6 2006, 06:51 AM
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#15
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
That does explain things. What are they using for the quoted 2/3rds lift figure?
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Mar 6 2006, 09:57 AM
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#16
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Horror Group: Members Posts: 5,322 Joined: 15-June 05 From: BumFuck, New Jersey Member No.: 7,445 |
Helium.
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Mar 6 2006, 03:07 PM
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#17
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,073 Joined: 23-August 04 Member No.: 6,587 |
I say use hydrogen.
It is not explosive except in conditions that are unlikely occur in the airship, and in the case of a puncture its unlikely to find an ignition sores, remember the Hindenburg went down amid red flames, not blue as hydrogen burns. The “protective cladding” amounted to thermit and ignited buy a static charge (this is how it was discovered). Both of these things will not happen given today’s level knowledge. if there using hydrogen fuel sells to power the thing anyway then there carrying lage amounts of hydrogen anyway, it would call it very useful to be able to route fuel to the boinsy tanks in an emergency. The biggest advantage of being heavier than air is its more stable on the ground and means your carrying more payload per unit construction materials and landing space. The disad to being heavier than air is in fuel consumption. At least that’s how I see it working out. Edward |
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Mar 10 2006, 08:49 PM
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#18
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Man In The Machine Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,264 Joined: 26-February 02 From: I-495 S Member No.: 1,105 |
I still dont see how strapping several million cubic feet of an explosive gas to my back would be a smart thing.
And Edward, from my college chem book: When mixed with oxygen, hydrogen explodes upon ignition. A unique property of hydrogen is that its flame is completely invisible in air. This makes it difficult to tell if a leak is burning, and carries the added risk that it is easy to walk into a hydrogen fire inadvertently. What was seen was the superstructure burning away. |
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Mar 10 2006, 09:37 PM
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#19
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Beetle Eater Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,797 Joined: 3-June 02 From: Oblivion City Member No.: 2,826 |
Another problem with helium, other than rarity, is that it leaks in almost every possible condition. The higher the pressure, obviously, the greater the leak. As said, with added stability on the ground and a medium pressure tank probably balance well. Also, less gas means better maneuverability, though to what degree I can't say (it's not like the thing will be able to dodge missiles - but with all that helium, a Firelance laser could do the job... or maybe some Detect Missile / Missile Barrier anchors about the vessel). |
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Mar 10 2006, 09:59 PM
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#20
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Bushido Cowgirl Group: Members Posts: 5,782 Joined: 8-July 05 From: On the Double K Ranch a half day's ride out of Phlogiston Flats Member No.: 7,490 |
Interesting...
Once worked on a concept to develop a NB airship that employed "active" lifting body. To assist in ascent and maintaining altitude, waste heat from the engines was bled off into an array of cells within the elongated "fat" delta shaped envelope. The skin was made of lightweight polymers & composites. Propulsion was provided by four sets of counter rotating unducted fans powered by turboshafts. Projected speed was about 220 - 260 knt. with a 7,000 NM range. Another variant had the fans buried in the body of the craft for an aerodynamically cleaner form which also ducted thrust over parts of the lifting body structure to enhance performance. Neither of these are true LTAs in that buoyant gas is not required to provide actual lift. The craft still took off like a conventional plane but with a much shorter field requirement than present day widebody aircraft. I have actually worked one up in Rigger3+ for one of my campaigns. |
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Mar 10 2006, 10:05 PM
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#21
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
Hydrogen is far worse. Platinum is one of the few linings that can actually contain the stuff, as it leaks through almost anything else. Smallest elemental particle, and all. |
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Mar 11 2006, 12:27 AM
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#22
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Midnight Toker Group: Members Posts: 7,686 Joined: 4-July 04 From: Zombie Drop Bear Santa's Workshop Member No.: 6,456 |
One could always try to opposite route. Instead of trying to use a lighter than air gas make the air itself heavier. Get rid of all that oxygen and nitrogen and replace them with dense hydrocarbon chains. Thus, you could use safer heavier gases and still be lighter than air.
Of course, this would make it impossible to breathe outside but, in Shadowrun, that is a small price to pay. |
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Mar 11 2006, 01:08 AM
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#23
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
Are you mad? I love oil as much as the next American (I'd kill for it), but I don't want to have to breathe it!
Not unless I can invent a new steel alloy in the process and make ridiculous piles of money, anyway. Then I can basically justify anything. |
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Mar 11 2006, 01:37 AM
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#24
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Midnight Toker Group: Members Posts: 7,686 Joined: 4-July 04 From: Zombie Drop Bear Santa's Workshop Member No.: 6,456 |
If you don't want to breath our beautiful oil you can always buy Mitsuhama's kamikaze brand oxygen for 220 :nuyen: per liter at your local stuffer shack or other retail outlet.
The steel alloy is yours. |
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Mar 11 2006, 01:50 AM
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#25
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
Absolutely fascinating. And to think, the team I'm GMing for is hitting a chemicals plant this weekend. <evil.laughter> Oh. JOY! |
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