 Do RPG players dislike depressing settings?, Taking issue with DMG II |
  |
 Jun 21 2006, 03:25 AM
Post
#126
|
|
|
Manus Celer Dei  Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802  |
No, actually, they aren't. Key is in realizing that there are two "better"s there—one is "better tool", the other is "better for the user", and the two do not have a direct correlation.
~J |
 |
 
|
|
Jun 21 2006, 03:40 AM
Post
#127
|
|
|
Midnight Toker Group: Members Posts: 7,686 Joined: 4-July 04 From: Zombie Drop Bear Santa's Workshop Member No.: 6,456 |
I've always thought that cortex bombs should have a lower availibility. You can't take them at chargen in SR3 or SR4. I don't think that's right. A cortex bomb can be integral to certain character concepts.
Someone might mention the Cortex Bomb flaw. Yes, that is great for some people but the flaw assumes that another party will control the bomb. In cases where you control your own cortex bomb it isn't much of a flaw. Considering some of the crap Shadowrunners can get themselves in I'm surprised that more runners don't have their own cortex bombs installed as a final solution to an inescapable situation. Stuck in an Invae cacoon? Cortex Bomb. Traped in Deus' arcology? Cortex Bomb. Tortured and interrogated? Afraid you'll break and betray your friends? Cortex Bomb. Cortex Bomb. Wendigo eating you alive? Cortex Bomb. Cortex Bomb. Cortex Bomb. With a catchy jingle like that I suspect that many wageslaves will be begging for the things. |
|
|
|
|
Jun 21 2006, 04:00 AM
Post
#128
|
|
|
Target Group: Members Posts: 49 Joined: 18-June 06 Member No.: 8,734 |
*singing*
Depressed 'cause Stuffer Shack sent the bill? Don't worry, just explode your head at will. */singing* That's right. Use the original cortex bomb, the Renraku Brain-Be-Gone. Accept no substitutes and use only Renraku Brain-Be-Gone accessories. The Renraku Brain-Be-Gone...when you absolutely can't pay the dinner check. |
|
|
|
|
Jun 21 2006, 07:09 AM
Post
#129
|
|
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,116 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,449 |
Bah. Forget cortex bombs. Do it like Raven from Snow Crash - have your own personal nuke, set to go off if you ever kack it.
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 21 2006, 12:47 PM
Post
#130
|
|||
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
Move along little fella, your intellectual posturing is unnecessary here. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/better The ones which would apply to tools are 1, 2, 3b, 4a, 5a, and 11a. All of those involve a tool that is more capable of performing it's tasks. Edit: And because I know you think dictionaries are wrong when they contradict you, there's also: http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/better. The applicable ones are 4 and 5. Or perhaps you prefer http://www.yourdictionary.com/ahd/b/b0218100.html. There you'll be interested in adjective definitions 1, 2, and 5. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Jun 21 2006, 01:32 PM
Post
#131
|
|
|
Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
See, here I thought you were just misguided, rather than being a fucking idiot. Has the concept of "return on investment" never crossed your tiny brain?
~J |
|
|
|
|
Jun 21 2006, 01:46 PM
Post
#132
|
|
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
You have pretty much infinite potential for return on investment, because the guy will likely end up working for you for life. The more capable he is, the faster you get the return on the investment.
Not resort to cursing by the way. Very intellectual of you. I know I'm impressed.* * Because I realize you probably would be willfully ignorant enough to assume that was true, here's the "it's sarcasm" disclaimer. |
|
|
|
|
Jun 21 2006, 03:34 PM
Post
#133
|
|
|
Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 204 Joined: 27-October 05 From: Waterloo, ON Member No.: 7,900 |
You can just get an alphaware tooth capsule with FUGU in it.
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 21 2006, 03:36 PM
Post
#134
|
|
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
The tooth capsule can't be high explosives capable of taking out the people that took you out. :)
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 22 2006, 02:45 AM
Post
#135
|
|
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,116 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,449 |
The reason that I would have them give the sammie boosted instead of wired-2, is that they would not consider an expendable street punk to be worth the cost. Hell, even their own soldiers don't all have wired reflexes. So he's a slave. Most mafia joygirls probably are, too, but you can bet the don doesn't spring for tailored pheromes for all of them.
I mean, let's face it, someone coerced into serving you out of fear for his life isn't going to be the most reliable person in the world. He'll constantly be on the lookout for a way to get the bomb disarmed, will screw you over whenever he thinks he can do so undetected, and over the long term he might become suicidal or break under the stress. So they give him the cheap stuff, and occasionally coerce him into doing nasty jobs for them. |
|
|
|
|
Jun 22 2006, 12:27 PM
Post
#136
|
|
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
Cool. I disagree, but me not agreeing with someone isn't a rare occurrence. :) I don't think it would be done in all cases (disposable soldiers are easier to get with trickery or bribery than cortex bombs). But when a long term asset is needed, and the cortex bomb is your best bet for doing it, making the tool more survivable means more return on the investment.
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 22 2006, 12:58 PM
Post
#137
|
|
|
Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
yeah. the guy who gets wire-2 and a cortex bomb, though, is probably the guy who's already proven himself. he's basically either going to be a PC, or a major threat to the PCs.
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 22 2006, 01:05 PM
Post
#138
|
|
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
True.
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 22 2006, 10:53 PM
Post
#139
|
|||
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,640 Joined: 6-June 04 Member No.: 6,383 |
I don't want to die in such a way that makes people think I was ripping off Duke Leto from Dune. "Hmm, poison tooth capsule." "Bah, he just liked sci fi too much." BTW, the best cock-blocked suicide I've ever read was in the "Way of the Tiger" series of Fighting Fantasy solo adventure books where you play the roll of an 80s ninja. In book 1 when the ninja grandmaster is giving you the philosophical Caine pep talk he says something to the effect of, "A true ninja fears only failure of the mission, and not capture and torture in and of itself, because there is always time to bite the tongue and bleed to death." So there's this point all the way forward in book 3 where if you "lose" the bad guys are coming to torture you to death by breaking you on the wheel, right? So your guy bites his tongue, but because it's a magical fantasy setting one of the death clerics runs up and casts Cure Light Wounds or something on you to stop you from bleeding to death, and then they break you on the wheel. Who said that clerics can't twist your nutsack with the best of them? |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Jun 22 2006, 11:01 PM
Post
#140
|
|
|
Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
meh, Duke Leto is hardly the only figure--literary or real--to use a poison capsule to kill themselves. it's a staple of a lot of spy fiction. personally, i didn't think of Leto at all until you mentioned him.
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 22 2006, 11:11 PM
Post
#141
|
|||
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,640 Joined: 6-June 04 Member No.: 6,383 |
Eh, well, overall, it's just too passive aggressive for my taste. I really would prefer the cortext bomb just because it's at least plain old normal aggressive. Actually, Cure Light Wounds clerics of death aside, I think it would be pretty cool to have a character who could ninja his own tongue off and bleed to death. I have no idea if that's a medically accurate way to kill yourself or not but personally as GM I would let that fly on account of 80s shtick. As a GM, would you allow a character to bite off his or her own tongue and bleed to death? If so, what rules would you use for it? I'd say that the character must first succeed in a Willpower (10) test (centering can come in handy, I guess) representing both overcoming the natural resistance to biting off your own tongue and also pressing through the organ through the pain to finish the job properly once started. Then the character will begin to take Physical damage as though they unstabilized; 1 box per combat turn. As long as the character is left alone for enough time to fill up his or her Physical condition monitor he or she will ninja to death. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Jun 22 2006, 11:23 PM
Post
#142
|
|
|
Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
bite it off, i dunno. it sounds plausible, i guess, but it'd take a while. maybe a box per minute or so. swallow it, sure--again, it wouldn't be immediate; i'd cook up some variant on the drowning rules. i mean, i'm not a doctor. i just play one at your mom's house. ooooooohhhhh!
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 22 2006, 11:56 PM
Post
#143
|
|||
|
Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Plant a gun with a high-velocity armor-piercing round inside your skull. Don't give it an exit port, and make sure you're looking at someone you don't like when you pull the trigger. As for rules for tongue-biting, sounds decent—maybe a little fast. I'd also say that if you try to swallow the blood (to keep from alerting your captors) you'd need to make either Body or Willpower tests every turn with increasing difficulty to avoid vomiting. ~J |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Jun 23 2006, 01:06 AM
Post
#144
|
|
|
Horror Group: Members Posts: 5,322 Joined: 15-June 05 From: BumFuck, New Jersey Member No.: 7,445 |
I think I'd like a cyberarm with a subtac nuke in it.
"For when you absoloutely, positively have to blow the fraggers who fragged you." |
|
|
|
|
Jun 23 2006, 03:02 AM
Post
#145
|
|
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
I'd probably require some sort of willpower rolls if you're trying to bite your tongue off with no pain editor or other means of making it not hurt like hell.
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 23 2006, 03:44 AM
Post
#146
|
|
|
Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
oh, yeah, definitely. probably Will (8) or so. may as well blow all your karma on it!
|
|
|
|
|
Jun 23 2006, 04:38 PM
Post
#147
|
|||
|
Shadow Cartographer Group: Members Posts: 3,737 Joined: 2-June 06 From: Secret Tunnels under the UK (South West) Member No.: 8,636 |
Many things are are possible. I wish I had a better link where it describes not only cutting through the nerves in the arm, one by one (*twang*) but the fact that when he stumbled back to civilisation he initially waited in the bushes for half an hour because there was a family picnicing and he didn't want to scare the children. Not saying it ain't Willpower(8), but just that people can do it. Oh yeah, Leto wasn't trying to kill himself. The tooth had been implanted by his mentat who had arranged for Leto's capture and had hypnotised him to bite down on it when the Baron got close enough to get caught in the poison cloud. It was an assasination attempt, not a suicide bid. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Jun 23 2006, 06:28 PM
Post
#148
|
|
|
Midnight Toker Group: Members Posts: 7,686 Joined: 4-July 04 From: Zombie Drop Bear Santa's Workshop Member No.: 6,456 |
Self-amputation isn't that unusual although it is mostly limited to people who have BIID. Self-amputation with a pen-knife is abut extreme. Usually these things are accomplished with chainsaws and shotguns. I wonder exactly how he got through the bone. A pen knife wouldn't be able to cut if. He'd have to saw through very slowly or just snap it off. Either method would be very painfull.
As for bitting off the tougue, it can be fatal but it often isn't. Consider that tongue-splitting is becomming more and more common. The tongue is very vascular but it is mostly just a colection of muscles. If you sever a blood vessel profuse bleeding can result. If you don't sever a vessel it will still bleed but not nearly enough to kill. The trick to suicide by tongue bitting is to bite far enough back from the tip that you do sever a blood vessel. Unfortunatly, I don't know the average rate of blood loss from such a wound. I know it is difficult to stop but I don't believe that it is fast enough to kill within 30 seconds. It would almsot certainly take several minutes. The biggest problem with tongue wounds isn't the rate of bleeding but the fact that it is very difficult to stop, from what I understand. Likewise, the risk of infection is rather high. This comes from research on tongue-piercing and tongue-splitting rather than tongue severing so it may not be accurate for suicide attempts. Personally, I think the best suicides by tongue-biting involve spitting the severed tongue at a captor and laughing like a maniac while blood flows down your chin. Sure, they can heal you but they can't make you talk. If they try to cauterize the wound with a hot iron you can be really hardcore and force your head down on it so the heat destroys your airway. |
|
|
|
|
Jun 23 2006, 06:44 PM
Post
#149
|
|
|
Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,028 Joined: 9-November 02 From: The Republic of Vermont Member No.: 3,581 |
My preferred method of suicide is high-Force Deadly Ball Lightning centered on myself, with every die of Sorcery, Spell Pool, and Karma I've got behind it.
Area-effect elemental manipulations are more fun when you're planning to spectacularly fail to soak the Drain! |
|
|
|
|
Jun 24 2006, 01:12 AM
Post
#150
|
|||||||
|
Decker on the Threshold Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,922 Joined: 14-March 04 Member No.: 6,156 |
Fifty-year old technology? Sounds like the government to me. :P |
||||||
|
|
|
||||||
|
|
Lo-Fi Version | Time is now: 26th February 2026 - 07:15 AM |
Topps, Inc has sole ownership of the names, logo, artwork, marks, photographs, sounds, audio, video and/or any proprietary material used in connection with the game Shadowrun. Topps, Inc has granted permission to the Dumpshock Forums to use such names, logos, artwork, marks and/or any proprietary materials for promotional and informational purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not affiliated with the Dumpshock Forums in any official capacity whatsoever.