Can mages Have tech toys or Not, eratta Options

[Egon]

I have looked at the eratta, but have not seen this. Could be my fault.

sr4.173

[LilithTaveril]

Mages can have cyberwear and use certain technical items for spellcasting.

[Protagonist]

Assuming that I understand you, this is the key: "but any technological visual aids that substitute themselves for the character’s own visual senses". None of those devices substitute themselves for the character's own visual senses. They simply aid it, by non-electronic means.

[Ancient History]

A magician cannot use electronic vision or enhancements.

A security camera, for example, does not let the photons that bounce off the target hit the magician's optic nerves; a length of fiberoptic cable does.

Regular binoculars (with lenses) work fine; electronic binocs do not.

A magician can target someone they see through a sheet of glass, or who reflection they see in a mirror. Hence, a periscope works.

[Metasigil]

Basically, the way i see it is that if you look through it, i.e. binoculars, telescope, parascope, etc., you can cast with it. If it sees for you and provides a digital display, i.e. digital binoculars, security camera, ultrasound, and probably the magesight goggles, you cannot cast because you're not really seeing the target, just a picture of the target.

Edit: You beat me to it Ancient History.

[Egon]

my bad, there is a very poorly placed line brake between electronic and binoculars.

[Ranneko]

[cx2]

Though I believe you can use things like video feeds to get a better bearing on where your target is, taking advantage of their magnification etc. You just need line of sight somehow as well to send the spell around there.

[Dread Polack]

But you can always blind-fire off indirect combat spells if you want, right?

Example: Nuke-O the mage sees a hiding enemy on a security monitor. It turns out the guy is only 10 meters away, behind a desk. Nuke-O drops a fireball right behind the desk, hoping to catch the chump in the blast.

Does that make sense?

Dread Polack

[lorechaser]

Sure - you're targetting the desk, not the guy. The guy is just, hopefully, in range.

And now Mage-sight Goggles make sense.

They seem *completely* cheesy, but they make sense. ;)

[Charon]

They call it Magesight, but really, everyone can potentially benefit from that fiberoptic cable gimmick.

Remember that before you skip these gadgets for your covert ops specialist just because it has the word magic in it.

[Mahali]

[Cabral]

[Egon]

I go with the thought that all aoe spell are targeted for the center and all in range of that center are affected. Here is why.

A group is jumped by 6 gangers. The sammy beats the mage and gos first. He runs up 10 meters strait into the mass of oncoming gangers. The mage gos "crap why he have to do that, now I can't use mana ball." Then he gets a great idea. He holds his hand up in front of him and blocks los on the sammy and hit the 5 gangers he still sees with a mana ball.


There were even thought of smartlinking the mage. You put a lcd face shield on him that puts a black boxs over friendlys. No los on friendlys he can mana balls as much as he wants.

[Cabral]

Hmm. I suppose RAW, that would work. Just remember that it would work both ways ... so a corp strike team could do it protect their teammembers or a hacker could hack in an mess with the mage's pannel. More trouble than it's worth IMO.

The simplest method to avoid that kind of abuse would be to measure LOS from the mage's aura, not his physical eyes. Thus, his own hands don't block LOS nor would a HUD.

[Ranneko]

Theoretically, yes, holding a bit of paper, or other LOS-blocking on friendlies cheat would work.

However at least in the SR3 FAQ it was suggested that trying to trick yourself that way could result in bad stuff happening, like the spell fizzling and you still taking drain.

[hyzmarca]

Of course, we shouldnt forget the best solution to teammates in the line of fire, mathmatics. If x>1 then N/(x-1)>N/x.


And we stuill don't know where your fireball originates if you try to cast it through a fiberoptic cable.

[Ranneko]

In one of the SOTA books when describing the Promethean system (sec mage system, fire optic cables running through the walls), it stated that since indirect manipulations start at the caster, and then go straight to the target, they weren't able to be cast through the system.

So I'd guess that in SR4 it starts at the caster, but I haven't bothered searching the book to make sure.

[Samaels Ghost]

So only Direct spells work through fiber-optics?

[kigmatzomat]

No, indirect spells will go off but they go in a straight line from mage to target. Meaning if you fire off that Firebolt spell using magesight goggles from around a corner you're going to blast the wall, not the target.

[Aaron]

I've always been grumpy about the ability of magicians to cast spells through lenses and mirrors. The concept is that you can see the target, and so throw spells at that target, yes? But, as anyone who has had high school physics can tell you, when you are looking at an object through a mirror or a lens, you're not actually looking at the object, but an image of that object.

On the other hand, the shiny new smartlinks also let one shoot around corners, so I guess it's all even. Just remember to hide around a corner in your next firefight.

[hyzmarca]

[Moon-Hawk]

[Aaron]

[Mahali]