 Arsenal is coming...., we have release dates |
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 Sep 2 2006, 12:42 PM
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#1
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 289 Joined: 20-February 04 From: in the matrix Member No.: 6,091  |
i didnt say this but Arsenal is coming in Nov.... Augmentation is coming Jan (or so) and Unwired will be GenCon next summer. There will be several resource books between now and then including Corporate Enclaves, Emergence, etc This arsenal date is very solid. The others are good but not completely solid dates. dog from DragonCON |
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Sep 2 2006, 01:43 PM
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#2
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Shadow Cartographer Group: Members Posts: 3,737 Joined: 2-June 06 From: Secret Tunnels under the UK (South West) Member No.: 8,636 |
Hmmmm... Uncertainty of Outcome vs. Certainty of Moderately Bad Outcome. Two month delay for Arsenal? *sigh* Thanks for posting this, though. |
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Sep 2 2006, 06:40 PM
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#3
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Project Terminus: Soul Hunters Group: Members Posts: 1,052 Joined: 6-November 03 From: Casselberry, Florida U.S.A. Member No.: 5,798 |
Ahh the wonderful concept of projected shipping dates that have a tendency to evaporate.
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Sep 2 2006, 10:28 PM
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#4
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
hmm, this looks a bit like a carpetbomb of SR4 books! :eek:
i dont have the money for this kind of shoping spree, yet... |
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Sep 2 2006, 10:51 PM
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#5
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 393 Joined: 20-June 06 Member No.: 8,754 |
Wow, at that rate they'll have SR5 out before 2008
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Sep 3 2006, 12:09 AM
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#6
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Target Group: Members Posts: 52 Joined: 4-January 04 From: Redbridge, London, UK Member No.: 5,957 |
Ahem. |
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Sep 3 2006, 03:32 AM
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#7
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Bushido Cowgirl Group: Members Posts: 5,782 Joined: 8-July 05 From: On the Double K Ranch a half day's ride out of Phlogiston Flats Member No.: 7,490 |
...November?
Just in time for the Christmastide shopping rush. Yes Virginia, there still may yet be a Santa Claws (just hope his name doesn't begin with an "L") |
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Sep 3 2006, 03:37 AM
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#8
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 296 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Usually under a cat Member No.: 864 |
dog_xinu, did Rob say that at a seminar? Unless you got it straight from him, I wouldn't call it "solid." |
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Sep 3 2006, 05:28 AM
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#9
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,379 Joined: 16-April 02 From: the LI shadows Member No.: 2,607 |
Please give your source for releases, Dog_xinu.
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Sep 3 2006, 08:16 AM
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#10
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,213 Joined: 10-March 02 From: Back from the abyss. Member No.: 2,316 |
Even if Rob said it I wouldnt bet on it, hes not a fortune teller. On the offical SR page they have posted release dates many times only to move them back, again, and again. Even after books have been sent to the printers they have been postponed. The best thing to do is play the game, enjoy the game and when you get an email from an online store that you are on the mailing list of or you see the book on the shelf buy it, play with it, enjoy it, then do the same for each and every book to come. Youll keep your hair that way.
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Sep 3 2006, 02:06 PM
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#11
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,089 Joined: 4-October 05 Member No.: 7,813 |
or just spend time on dumpshock. that's how i find out when the new books are actually available =D (PDF, that is... physical copies seem to get to some places before others).
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Sep 3 2006, 02:59 PM
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#12
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 289 Joined: 20-February 04 From: in the matrix Member No.: 6,091 |
the fanpro shadowrun guy at DragonCON. He told me where exactly the internal status was of Aresnal and the timeline for all the others. But like most things the farther the timeline item is out the more shakey it is. He was very firm, almost aggressively firm on the aresnal date. Personally if I was going to make up dates, it would be this month, next month, the month after insead of the next year. Like most of you, I want them now. |
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Sep 3 2006, 03:21 PM
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#13
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 289 Joined: 20-February 04 From: in the matrix Member No.: 6,091 |
The guys I was speaking with didnt have a name tag on (nor would have expected one) so I dont know his name. I was told he was the "shadowrun expert" here onsite. |
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Sep 3 2006, 03:43 PM
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#14
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Prime Runner Group: Banned Posts: 3,732 Joined: 1-September 05 From: Prague, Czech Republic Member No.: 7,665 |
Hmm... well it doesn't really matter where in the timeline something is, there's still no way to be certain when something is coming out.
Let's consider Augmentation. It's mostly reprints updated to the new rules. The work on that is practically finished before it starts. We're looking at a document that is in total ~100,000 words or so, and it's probably going to be like Street Magic in that it is split like 8 ways. So really, each person is writing like 13,000 words. For those of you still in college, that's five 10 page essays if you double-space it all. So that's the equivalent of the first 4 weeks of a standard Lit courseload. So the writing itself is going to take what, a month? Less? And it's been "in the pipe" since when? Heck, it's a good bet that a substantial portion of the writing on Augmentation is done already and the rest of it couldn't possibly take more than 4 weeks to put out if the book went into crunch time. Nevertheless, we aren't being told "it'll be out in 2 months" despite the fact that obviusly it could be if all it needed was "to be written". But that's not what it needs. It needs to have art solicited and drawn, it needs to have distribution channels worked out, etc. Noone knows how long those things are goning to take, because they are contingent on events outside of FanPro. I mean consider, what do people want out of Augmentation?
Right, there are conversions on the web right now for almost all of that - so it could be at the printer in digital format like tomorrow. But it's not going to be, because there's more to it than just the rules and the fluff. And yet, those are really the only things that FanPro can prodce themselves. -Frank |
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Sep 3 2006, 07:28 PM
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#15
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 734 Joined: 30-August 05 Member No.: 7,646 |
The back and forth about how the rules should work as well as the ensuing playtesting can take a great deal of time. In addition, this is not a 10 page college essay, which means that it has to be repeatedly edited to a certain degree of polish. Finally, how many FanPro staffers are deticated to purely Shadowrun and don't work on other FanPro titles like Battletech, Degenisis, and Das Schwarze Auge (I want to say the english title is The Dark Eye)? This also doesn't take into account "behind the scenes" duties that aren't related to developing a product but interfere with it, such as attending Cons, making arrangements with printers and distributers, quality control when they get the books from the printers, advertising, etc. Finally it's always been FASA's policy to determine their product lineup far in advance, and I believe this tradition carried over into FanPro ... So I'm not surprised at how long it's taking for Arsenal and friends. I just hope it's as good or better than Cannon Companion. :D |
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Sep 3 2006, 08:31 PM
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#16
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Project Terminus: Soul Hunters Group: Members Posts: 1,052 Joined: 6-November 03 From: Casselberry, Florida U.S.A. Member No.: 5,798 |
Ok I got the perfect idea to solve all the problems First we need a billion dollars not a problem as Bill Gates does own a small protion of the Shadowrun product line.
Next we buy or build a state of the art printing facility and hire 250 people to run it. Then pay off a couple of the top distrubitors to be sure when the books are ready they will be sent out immeadatly. Lastly we hire new staff to work on the books 50 as writers, 50 as editors, 50 as proof readers, 50 as play testers, 50 as convention support (I'll work here), 50 as final editers. See simple now all we need is the money hey Mr. Gates have I got an idea for you........... |
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Sep 3 2006, 08:51 PM
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#17
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Shadow Cartographer Group: Members Posts: 3,737 Joined: 2-June 06 From: Secret Tunnels under the UK (South West) Member No.: 8,636 |
You could sort of say the same about Street Magic to quite a degree. It covers a lot of old ground. And yet I was very impressed with it and can see that there has been a lot of thought and testing behind it. Maybe this is partially because it's a refinement of previous versions, but it still rates very highly on the scale of game supplements. I sincerely hope that Augmentation is as good. That said, why is all the artwork and printing such like outside FanPro's control? Do they outsource the actual publishing & formatting to another group or are they actually producing it on behalf of someone else, or what? I sense I've missed something, here. |
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Sep 3 2006, 10:25 PM
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#18
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,089 Joined: 4-October 05 Member No.: 7,813 |
as i understand it, Fanpro makes games. they are not publishers, they are not printers, and they are not distributers.
essentially, there's like 2 (maybe 3?) people who actually work for Fanpro, and everyone else (including most of the writers, developers, etc) are actually freelancers contracted as needed. they don't have the time, or the resources to handle every aspect of physical production of the books. quite frankly, assuming they did have the time and money needed, i would much rather they spend it on keeping the bills payed (thus insuring they'll be around later) and developing better games. honestly, i can't really see any way it would benefit us, as gamers, if fanpro did all the printing/publishing, distributing, etc... chances are, they'd still have problems (heck, the companies that are responsible for printing, distributing, etc have problems, and they are devoted to those specific aspects entirely. imagine if Fanpro, with it's handful of employees, tried to take over that part!), so we wouldn't see the books any sooner. but of course, i may be wrong about all that =D |
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Sep 3 2006, 10:50 PM
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#19
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Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
FanPro is a publisher, not a printer, and not just a game "design house"" or something like that. Publishing is a process, not a single act.
Writing: very frequently done by freelancers. Editing: very frequently done by freelancers. Art: exclusively done by freelancers. Layout/Graphic design: exclusively done by freelancers. Printing: Done by third party companies. Sure, FanPro has "control" over those processes -- they choose who to hire, who to print with, which projects to assign to which people, etc. But they can't control everything when they outsource. People get sick, people overload themselves with work and can't hit deadlines, printers make mistakes ... shit happens. Publishers just have to roll with it when it does. For example, sometimes I'll see people say something like "Hey, if an artist is late, why not just hire a new one?" Sure, hiring other artists is an option in the future -- but that won't fix the problem right this instant. If art is due on Monday, and it doesn't arrive, you can't contact a new artist, get him the art notes, and have a finished piece turned in that day [OK, /sometimes/ you can, but it's very rare!] -- so you either have to wait for the late artist to finish it up, or hire a new artist with a sensible rush deadline [like, say, Friday] and hope that *he* isn't late with work. |
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Sep 3 2006, 10:55 PM
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#20
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,379 Joined: 16-April 02 From: the LI shadows Member No.: 2,607 |
Nobody is calling you a liar or misinformed, Dog_xinu, don't worry. There have been plenty of people who have said "{insert upcomin book here} is finally coming out {place date here}! My source said so!"...and still, when the company's site still has not updated, Previews has no info, and inquiries to the producers go unanswered, there will be skepticism.
I just wanted to know who told you or where you heard it. Rumors are an unfortunate evil in this business. |
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Sep 3 2006, 11:42 PM
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#21
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 734 Joined: 30-August 05 Member No.: 7,646 |
I thought you did the Layout ... or was that just with one product or a different company? As a side note: I really hate the green border in the SR4 book. Please don't use that for layouts again. your eye picks up green/yellow most easily (as I understand it, that's why nightvision goggles display a green tinted image) and I found it very distracting. A cool shade of faded blue may have worked better and distanced the game from The Matrix* slightly rather than looking like yet another company riding its tailcoats. *Yes, I know the Matrix was inspired by short fiction the VR 1 book. |
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Sep 3 2006, 11:53 PM
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#22
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Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
Jason Vargas and I shared it, and we're both freelancers. |
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Sep 4 2006, 04:04 AM
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#23
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Shooting Target Group: Validating Posts: 1,618 Joined: 29-January 03 From: Montevideo, Uruguay. Member No.: 3,992 |
This usually happens with D&D 4E. *rimshot* :P |
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Sep 4 2006, 05:13 AM
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#24
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 289 Joined: 20-February 04 From: in the matrix Member No.: 6,091 |
I dont take any misfeelings from the comments above. And I too have seen all the talking about release dates. But when someone from FanPRO on the shadowrun teams tells me something, I take it at face value. I just parroted what he told me (just striping out, some of the details). if the comments on this board (anywhere) offends me, then I need to stop playing and especially GMing games.... |
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Sep 4 2006, 05:22 AM
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#25
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 500 Joined: 4-September 06 From: Salt Lake UT Member No.: 9,299 |
ok, i havn't looked at dumpshock in years and maybe im gulible but what is this:amazon page for Arsenal?
I was thinking of ordering tonight, heck it ships in 3/4 weeks |
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