Breaking Force hit limits with Edge, I'm either blind or gullible Options

[Samaels Ghost]

I thought I heard/read somewhere that when using Edge on a spellcasting test, the hits used are not limited by Force anymore. Is this correct? I can't seem to find it in the book, so I'm either blind or gullible.

Could someone point me in the right direction, please?

[Demerzel]

When I read that I thought the poster was mistaking the optional rule that you cannot have more successes than 2xskill rating.

I could not locate it either.

[respite]

It's on page 172 BBB ... "... Force serves as a limiter effect on spells—the more oomph you put into the spell, the better you can succeed with it. This limitation does not apply to Edge dice that are used to boost a spell."

Makes me wonder if you can use edge on spell casting and quicken / sustaining focus a low-force-but-higher-number-of-successes spell.

- Respite

[Jaid]

[Cabral]

[hobgoblin]

im wondering why the text says "boost a spell" rather then "added to a spellcasting test". it would be much more clear what they where trying to say with that last bit then.

[Samaels Ghost]

Rolling separately doesn't make sense. All the dice in a pool explode when you use Edge, rolling separate wouldn't matter.

And if that is what's trying to be said, it's a pain in the ass. Rolling separate for the same test? Does any other mechanic follow that kind of process? I can't think of one, and thank god. That just makes the whole process of rolling take that much longer. No need for that.

[Cabral]

You've got a good point with the exploding dice. However, it may have been their intent that exploded dice count as Edge dice. That said, you are most likely correct; as I understand it, a main objective of SR4 was to unify the mechanics of SR in general with mechanics of Magic, thus rolling seperately would be a step backwards (even if it's amongst 12 steps forward).

[Samaels Ghost]

If the Edge is used to reroll misses, then it would make sense. But that option I find is used far less than adding to the pool, probably why I didn't think of it to begin with.

So, that would mean that if you get 10 hits on your Force 5, you can't reroll the misses and say those extra five from the first roll count now. THAT makes sense. That means using Edge to break Force is still gamble that you could waste Edge on. I like that.

BTW thank you respite for pointing me to the right page. 2 Karma for you :D

[Cabral]

If I ever run a game, what I might do is have the cap on hits be Force of the spell or Force+Edge if edge was used to add dice to test (not to reroll misses).

[Jaid]

[Da9iel]

The break even point is edge = 7/18 times (dice pool). More edge--use exploding dice. Less edge--reroll failures. So if you have a dice pool of 18 and an edge of 7, statistically you'll get the same number of successes (on average) either way. The advantage of rerolling failures is (as Jaid said) knowing if you need to do it or not. The advantage of exploding dice is the possibility (a really slim chance) of getting more successes than pool. Too bad you may only do one or the other.