 How do you get a Meta Link or CMT Clip to function, RAW they crash with 1 program running. |
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 Oct 24 2006, 04:12 AM
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#1
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 556 Joined: 28-May 04 From: Moorhead, MN, USA Member No.: 6,367  |
Forgive me if this has been covered before (my search-foo is weak), but let's go through this. They both have a Response rating of 1.
So System also = 1
Run one program (rating 1 of course) and the response decreases by 1 to zero and the comlink crashes. Did someone not think this through? Is it possible to run a comlink with zero response? The fact that they sell the things sort of disproves the death spiral theory. System must not be limited to current response, but unmodified response. Do you house rule this? |
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Oct 24 2006, 04:48 AM
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#2
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Target Group: Members Posts: 14 Joined: 21-September 06 Member No.: 9,443 |
I guess those commlinks aren't meant to run programs - just send recieve calls / sms and browse the web. Just like your basic mobile phone these days.
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Oct 24 2006, 08:42 AM
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#3
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
ugh, not that debate again...
do a search, you will find that yes the rules can be interpreted that way but we don't know if its the correct interpretation. hell, that interpretation have a nasty feedback loop in it that makes almost any comlink below rating 4 on both (as one limits the other) will spiral to a crash the moment you load the system rating in programs. its as if one was trying to model the behavior of a windows ME box or something... (hmm, firefox 2.0 with inline spellchecker is nice ;) ) |
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Oct 24 2006, 12:46 PM
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#4
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 113 Joined: 11-December 05 From: Philadelphia, UCAS Member No.: 8,063 |
Eh, houserule it. It can run System x 2 programs, and response can't drop below 1. So it can run 2 rating 1 programs.
FIXED! Heh. |
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Oct 24 2006, 01:59 PM
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#5
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
That could get obnoxious at the upper end of the spectrum though. I suggest just letting a Commlink run up to it's System rating in Programs before degradation sets in. That way, a MetaLink could still run one Program at a time, while it only increases the capacity of the high-end gear by one. |
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Oct 24 2006, 02:50 PM
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#6
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,333 Joined: 19-August 06 From: Austin Member No.: 9,168 |
But again, the key to me is that you assume the commlink is used to run programs.
I would assume those can send and receive transmissions, and maybe store a gig or so of data, and that's it. |
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Oct 24 2006, 03:40 PM
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#7
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 834 Joined: 30-June 03 Member No.: 4,832 |
I ignore the rules that don't make sense, it worked wonders for cyberlimbs, shaped charge explosions, and TMs, it'll work wonders for commlinks!
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Oct 24 2006, 10:13 PM
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#8
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 113 Joined: 11-December 05 From: Philadelphia, UCAS Member No.: 8,063 |
Ahhh, so true. Especially TMs.... |
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Oct 24 2006, 10:42 PM
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#9
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,537 Joined: 27-August 06 From: Albuquerque NM Member No.: 9,234 |
So you think what he should have said was "I ignore TMs"? That's my current stance. |
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Oct 24 2006, 11:27 PM
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#10
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Works for me! :D
Technomancers and SURGE are the two things I really dislike in Shadowrun canon. |
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Oct 24 2006, 11:40 PM
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#11
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 9-July 04 From: Modesto, CA Member No.: 6,465 |
Simplest change would be that Device Ratings can't go below 1. |
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Oct 25 2006, 12:44 AM
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#12
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
And if you make that change, you get people loading 17 Programs onto a MetaLink with no degradation. |
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Oct 25 2006, 01:49 AM
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#13
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,089 Joined: 4-October 05 Member No.: 7,813 |
yes, 17 crappy programs that no one really cares about anyways. what's the problem again? (my personal solution is to allow you to run up to system rating in programs with no degradation, though). |
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Oct 25 2006, 01:49 AM
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#14
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Target Group: Members Posts: 94 Joined: 27-March 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 4,341 |
I've just ruled that the program limit goes to system rating; otherwise as written the Vector Xim operating system is functionally useless from a game mechanics standpoint (ok, so firewall 1 isn't functionally useless but the system 1 sure would be)
alternately just discourage anyone from actually *buying* it and handwave away the death-spiral effect on higher rated systems. |
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Oct 25 2006, 02:00 AM
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#15
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
The problem would be when a person moves up to a System 2 Commlink, he could then only run 2 Programs on it before it degrades. Not really a problem I guess, but not very elegant either. |
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Oct 25 2006, 02:58 AM
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#16
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 500 Joined: 4-September 06 From: Salt Lake UT Member No.: 9,299 |
I voted other, just doing a little thinking outside the box.
responce = max system rating. system rating = max rating for programs system x 2 = max # of subscriptions system -1 = max # of active programs before responce is effected system /2) + 8 = boxes in the persona condition monitor system = max firewall rating. Responce + System = Matrix iniciative Where do the rules say that the device crashes if responce is reduced to 0? What I've read says that a user with a MetaLink running Edit 1 makes tests to change or erase a file with (computer + zero) dice Cannot be subscribed to cannot run another program has a condition monitor with 8 boxes has no operative firewall has a matrix iniciative of zero when in full VR thus cannot run full VR posibly there is such a thing as a rating 0 system? I say this because most die pools are made up of two things; body+armor, Skill + atribute, Skill + device/program rating. you can make a test with a skill of zero. You can resist damage with no armor. The only program that is paired with responce is Reality filter. |
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Oct 25 2006, 03:24 AM
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#17
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 9-July 04 From: Modesto, CA Member No.: 6,465 |
I think part of the problem is Response=0 isn't explicitly defined. Does a zero rating imply no function? Signal=0 yields a very small radius, but it still functions. Firewall=0 would mean you'd be wide open to most anything that comes your way. Maybe part of the problem is we try to explain an abstract attribute like "System=0" or "Response=0" with tangilbe real-world results. I like OneTrikPony's line of thinking here as well as SR4's non-comment on zero Device ratings. As for running 17 crappy programs, the odds of generating a glitch or critical glitch gets pretty nasty (1 or 2 dice). |
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Oct 25 2006, 03:33 AM
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#18
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 500 Joined: 4-September 06 From: Salt Lake UT Member No.: 9,299 |
Ah Ha! The n00bie gets a cudo, my very first. :) Thanx Grinder
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Oct 25 2006, 06:25 AM
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#19
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
I didn't think Firewall was dependent on the System rating. |
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Oct 25 2006, 06:27 AM
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#20
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Why would you assume a Computer Skill of 1 or less? |
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Oct 25 2006, 12:26 PM
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#21
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Target Group: Members Posts: 14 Joined: 21-September 06 Member No.: 9,443 |
p 213: System serves as the limiter for the maximum rating a program can be run on that node (a higher rating program functions at the System rating instead) p 321: Matrix Programs
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Oct 25 2006, 02:25 PM
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#22
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Interesting.
I seem to recall reading something about being able to install (any level of?) Firewall on any kind of Device, no matter what the Rating (which equates to System/Response). This, along with several references to this very thing on these Forums somewhere led me to believe that Firewalls are an exception to that restriction. Not much in the way of hard evidence at the moment though. :( |
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Oct 25 2006, 04:49 PM
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#23
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,754 Joined: 9-July 04 From: Modesto, CA Member No.: 6,465 |
Yeah I neglected the Computer skill, but assuming 4, throwing 5-6 dice doesn't makes the odds much better. :( |
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Oct 25 2006, 05:25 PM
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#24
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Chicago Survivor Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,079 Joined: 28-January 04 From: Canton, GA Member No.: 6,033 |
Firewall isn't a program. It's a statistic for the device, like signal. It is independent of the device rating unless no firewall is given, then it is assumed to be the device rating.
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Oct 25 2006, 05:33 PM
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#25
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 619 Joined: 18-April 03 From: The UV Nexus Member No.: 4,474 |
No worries, mate! Common sense received 50% of the vote. |
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