 40mm buckshot, stats! now! |
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 Nov 14 2006, 06:55 AM
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#1
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Immortal Elf  Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670  |
i don't normally do this. i don't watch movies, and then think "that's gotta go into SR". or, if i do, it's no more than a passing thought. but i just got done watching Miami Vice, and i feel it's imperative that SR be introduced to the concept of 40mm buckshot rounds. there are things in this life that a man cannot argue with. a shotgun shell with a diameter of an inch and a half is one of those things.
i've heard of these, of course. i believe they're generally used for breeching heavy doors where you don't care what happens to whoever's on the other side. i'm also fairly sure that this is designed to be used fairly close-in, so its longer-range accuracy should probably suck--maybe pistol ranges, who knows. and, of course, the damage should be horriffic. SR3, i'm thinking something like 16D(f). maybe even just straight-out 14D--no reduced effectiveness against armor. thoughts? |
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Nov 14 2006, 07:15 AM
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#2
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 906 Joined: 16-October 06 Member No.: 9,630 |
I doubt 40mm buckshot rounds would do more damage then an assault cannon. Or as much anti-vehicle rocket.
You might actually need an assault cannon to fire a buckshot that large. |
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Nov 14 2006, 07:20 AM
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#3
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
well, keep in mind that rockets deal area damage, whereas shot rounds are point targets (ignoring SR3's retarded-ass rules for shotgun spread). assault cannon do 18D, minimum.
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Nov 14 2006, 07:21 AM
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#4
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
I haven't seen the movie yet but ...
Sounds something like Shock-Lock style rounds. |
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Nov 14 2006, 07:29 AM
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#5
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
It isn't all that scary actually, 27 00-buck pellets at under 900fps. You can get 18 00 pellets to over 1200fps with 12 gauge magnum or 10 gauge loads. 10D(f) is quite enough for it. The effective range would indeed suck, thanks to the low muzzle velocity and the lack of any sort of choke.
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Nov 14 2006, 07:34 AM
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#6
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
Would rather be using 40mm grenades than 40mm buckshot. I've only used it in anti-ambush drills, because the engagement ranges are too short not to get fragged by your own grenades and there is no time other than point and fire(or spray and pray).
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Nov 14 2006, 08:15 AM
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#7
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
i dunno, AE. i mean, that's 50% more lead coming in at a not-unreasonable clip. it should be somewhat more impressive, despite the lower speed. i mean, there's over one and a half times the total energy there, right?
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Nov 14 2006, 08:37 AM
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#8
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,150 Joined: 19-December 05 From: Rhein-Ruhr Megaplex Member No.: 8,081 |
In the 19th century, shotguns with a diameter of up to 2 inches were used, mainly to hunt water fowl (punt guns).
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Nov 14 2006, 11:30 AM
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#9
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
18 00 pellets at 1200fps has about 19% more KE than 27 pellets at 900fps. The greater amount of pellets doesn't hurt, but I wonder if penetration suffers: 0.33" 55-grain lead balls at under 800fps (they slow down fast) will not go through a lot of tissue.
The 18-pellet load is pretty massive, though. Maybe 11D(f) would be called for. After all, we're talking about 1000+ grains of lead. |
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Nov 14 2006, 11:35 AM
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#10
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,950 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Pah, enough of this 40mm buckshot, how about grapeshot? I bet a Troll could carry around the required cannon, too.
~J |
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Nov 14 2006, 11:59 AM
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#11
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
There's always the 40mm (X?)M1001 canister round (115 steel flechettes) for the Mk 19 AGL, as well as the 120mm M1028 canister round (~1150 tungsten buckshot) for the M256 tank gun.
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Nov 14 2006, 12:41 PM
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#12
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,498 Joined: 4-August 05 From: ADL Member No.: 7,534 |
fps = frames per second? what the heck?!?
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Nov 14 2006, 12:47 PM
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#13
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Target Group: Members Posts: 27 Joined: 7-December 02 Member No.: 3,698 |
Or feet per second. Maybe. |
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Nov 14 2006, 02:35 PM
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#14
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,950 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
One frame = one foot long ;)
~J |
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Nov 14 2006, 04:14 PM
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#15
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 944 Joined: 19-February 03 Member No.: 4,128 |
I was hoping someone would mention the Mk19 canister round. Sounds nasty at convoy ambush ranges.
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Nov 14 2006, 04:18 PM
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#16
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
seriously? here are my rough-and-ready calculations, show me where i went wrong. i'm using a single 00 pellet as my base unit of mass, since i'm not worried about specific units of measurement. 12ga round (18 00 pellets @ 1200fps): (0.5*18*1200)^2 = 10802 by that math, the 40mm round would have about 12% more KE. (ignore my ealier 1.5x figure; 3am is a bad time to test one's recall of the differences between KE and momentum.) edit: goddamn windows 0.5*27*900*900 = 10935000 0.5*18*1200*1200 = 12960000 |
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Nov 14 2006, 04:25 PM
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#17
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
Exponentiation is done before multiplication. 2/3rds the mass at 4/3 the velocity equals 1.185185185... the kinetic energy.
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Nov 14 2006, 04:31 PM
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#18
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
for the love of... windows' damn calculator doesn't do exponents. editing...
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Nov 14 2006, 04:33 PM
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#19
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
Yeah. Who knew you'd still need arithmetic with all these computers around. :wobble:
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Nov 14 2006, 04:36 PM
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#20
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 16,950 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
I keep a Python shell nearby for times like that.
~J |
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Nov 14 2006, 04:37 PM
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#21
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
there. 12960000/10935000=1.1851851851851851851851851851852.
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Nov 15 2006, 02:57 AM
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#22
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,640 Joined: 6-June 04 Member No.: 6,383 |
What we really need is stats for t3h HK CAWS and its tungsten shot of wonder.
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Nov 15 2006, 04:15 AM
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#23
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Mostly Harmless Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 937 Joined: 26-February 02 From: 44.662,-63.469 Member No.: 176 |
I'm pretty much positive that that conversation (as well as the current one) has been handled previously. Search time.
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Nov 15 2006, 04:29 AM
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#24
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Creating a god with his own hands Group: Members Posts: 1,405 Joined: 30-September 02 From: 0:0:0:0:0:0:0:1 Member No.: 3,364 |
Canister Rounds and Rockets (yes, they put flechettes in aircraft-launched rockets)
were used with great effect in vietnam for getting out of ambushes, and prepping LZs. from what I've read they tended to make jungle into a lot of matchsticks. and VC into a lot of chunky salsa. |
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