 Light Machine Gun?, Worst weapon in the game? |
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 Nov 17 2006, 03:58 PM
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#51
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Immoral Elf  Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486  |
Somewhere around the net is that weird pic of a howitzer-type weapon with a big ass suppressor attached. Anyone know where it is?
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Nov 17 2006, 04:24 PM
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#52
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
This one.
I outsmarted myself by searching for "m109 suppressor". I should have known I'd best find it with "tank silencer". :please: |
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Nov 17 2006, 04:29 PM
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#53
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
That's the one ... now that's what I call a silencer. :)
I did a quick search earlier, but only used howitzer silencer, which is probably why I didn't find it. D'oh. :D |
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Nov 17 2006, 04:50 PM
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#54
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,150 Joined: 19-December 05 From: Rhein-Ruhr Megaplex Member No.: 8,081 |
I wonder what Sigmund Freud would have to say about that. |
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Nov 17 2006, 05:24 PM
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#55
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,333 Joined: 19-August 06 From: Austin Member No.: 9,168 |
The other less obvious difference is that the Ares Alpha is still an assault rifle. It's a nice one, and will command respect. But it's not a freakin' machine gun.
That will have both upsides (I'd give a bonus to intimidate and the like) and downsides (High Threat is much more likely when the LMG comes out). But it's another aspect. Personally, I usually go with the Alpha, because you can get by with 6 bp in Heavy Weapons (Grenade Launchers) and roll 3 dice + agility just fine to place a grenade near someone. Very rarely are you required to put a grenade in a precise spot. If you use automatics as your main skill, you can also carry a machine pistol in a quick draw holster, or pick up and use most any SMGs. If you focus on Heavy Weapons, and you lose your White Knight, good luck finding a replacement on the sec guards. |
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Nov 17 2006, 06:04 PM
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#56
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,537 Joined: 27-August 06 From: Albuquerque NM Member No.: 9,234 |
Surefire was pushing assault rifle silencers for police use inside buildings, mostly as it prevents the permanent hearing loss that comes with shooting when you don't have ear protection and also allows you to talk amongst each other without the volume level you need when your ear pro has to handle 5.56 in a phone booth. It's not a movie silencers, which generally don't exist. |
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Nov 17 2006, 06:09 PM
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#57
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,089 Joined: 4-October 05 Member No.: 7,813 |
he didn't say assault rifle silencers, he said machine gun silencers.
most police forces that i have heard of don't use machine guns. well, at least not the RL ones (anime police forces probably use them occasionally, but then again anime police forces have also been known to use Giant Fighting Seizure Robots, with heavy weaponry that can level a small building) |
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Nov 17 2006, 06:21 PM
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#58
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,333 Joined: 19-August 06 From: Austin Member No.: 9,168 |
They also seem to employ lesbian catgirls in school girl outfits, or just leather straps, a lot. Come to think of it, it's a lot like Shadowrun. |
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Nov 17 2006, 06:33 PM
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#59
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 858 Joined: 25-August 03 From: Braunschweig, North German League, Allied German States Member No.: 5,537 |
To add some info: That howitzer and silencer belong to the German Heer (army). That particular artillery shooting range is near a city so the silencer is used to go easy on the citizens' ears. |
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Nov 17 2006, 06:42 PM
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#60
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 355 Joined: 23-August 05 Member No.: 7,590 |
I think he'd just point and laugh. (But then, psychology is one of the few things I've never really studied, so I don't know. :P ) |
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Nov 18 2006, 04:02 AM
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#61
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,116 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,449 |
He'd say:
"Sometimes a tank silencer is just a tank silencer." :D |
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Nov 19 2006, 05:45 PM
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#62
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 668 Joined: 4-September 06 Member No.: 9,304 |
Some seem to think that you can have a gas-vent 3 and a sound suppressor on the Ares Alpha. You can't.
Both are barrel mounted accessories, so, only one can be on at a time. |
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Nov 19 2006, 06:00 PM
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#63
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,526 Joined: 9-April 06 From: McGuire AFB, NJ Member No.: 8,445 |
And once you install a gas vent system, which takes an armorer skill check, it cant be removed from the weapon.
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Nov 19 2006, 06:11 PM
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#64
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 668 Joined: 4-September 06 Member No.: 9,304 |
Oh, I would allow it to be removed, with another armorer's check (or monofilament whip check and a new shorter barrel version). But it would not be a quick and easy change.
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Nov 19 2006, 10:11 PM
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#65
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
But you could simply replace the whole barrel. ;) |
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Nov 20 2006, 06:00 AM
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#66
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Man In The Machine Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,264 Joined: 26-February 02 From: I-495 S Member No.: 1,105 |
But that would make sense! Blasphamer!
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Nov 20 2006, 06:09 AM
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#67
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,526 Joined: 9-April 06 From: McGuire AFB, NJ Member No.: 8,445 |
Hmm... Sometimes gun parts are married to the gun as a whole and to replace one part, expecially the barrel, would reduce the overall effectiveness of the gun. (I.E. gun jams more often, the accuracy of the gun is thrown off or power is not applied properly to the projectile due to a flaw in the new mating) Now when dealing with machineguns though, most are made with the idea that the user will have to change out the barrel every 200 shots or so due to heat bending the barrel. In this situation, the argument above doesnt work as well, but on rifles or assault rifles, it holds more water. |
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Nov 20 2006, 06:10 AM
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#68
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Can you give me some actual examples of guns that are incapable of having their barrels removed or swapped out?
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Nov 20 2006, 06:16 AM
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#69
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,526 Joined: 9-April 06 From: McGuire AFB, NJ Member No.: 8,445 |
Not really, because guns made now a days aren't hand made to work like that, but once they are thrown together and tested out, you might have a set of parts that work together just right. If you swap one out, you might have a totally different feel to your gun afterwards.
I know the M16A2 is designed with changable parts, but I've use some really crappy rifles that were obviously thrown together with spare parts. Course I've had some good rifles too that were the same, so it's sorta a crap shoot once you start changing parts. |
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Nov 20 2006, 08:03 AM
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#70
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,116 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,449 |
Microtronic tools and other future-tech would make calibrating new gun parts easier, although the armorer can still get a bad roll and wind up doing a barrel replacement that gives you a penalty.
On a tangental note, I would think that most runners would change out the barrels of their guns on a regular basis, either that or dispose of them. A gun's ballistics are a record of every crime committed with that weapon (and that might include the Azzie BTL-smuggler gunning down four LoneStar officers before his AK-97 wound up getting picked out of the local fixer's bargain bin by a character). |
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Nov 20 2006, 10:06 AM
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#71
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 171 Joined: 5-February 05 Member No.: 7,053 |
Isn't this what the GM-invented armourer check (a somewhat harder one) to remove it is for? The check can't be harder than making a rifle from scratch yourself, and while (thank god) firearms design hasn't made it to SR4, players have been able to do that with the tech skills before. |
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Nov 20 2006, 01:16 PM
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#72
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Awakened Asset Group: Members Posts: 4,464 Joined: 9-April 05 From: AGS, North German League Member No.: 7,309 |
One would indeed assume thats what the armourer test covers. Disassemly and assembly of rather simple parts should come free, this is not Rolemaster after all.
Concerning the advantage of light machine guns vs. assault rifles, a belt-fed weapon would have been real handy in our run yesterday. Sometimes you donīt have time to change the clip. |
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Nov 20 2006, 02:35 PM
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#73
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Old Man Jones Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,415 Joined: 26-February 02 From: New York Member No.: 1,699 |
So carry more guns!
=) -np |
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Nov 20 2006, 02:42 PM
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#74
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
On a firearm clearly intended for military use, given an average Armorer skill, the most basic of tools, and a range for test firing, the task of removing, replacing and adjusting the barrel should be relatively easy. For a weapon like the Ares Alpha, it would not be surprising to have modification kits available on the market such as a barrel without the gas vent on (assuming, as the rules apparently do, that the gas vent is an integral part of the barrel and can't be removed).
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Nov 20 2006, 05:25 PM
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#75
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Target Group: Members Posts: 56 Joined: 29-October 06 From: Grenoble, France Member No.: 9,730 |
the Ares has a "special chamber design", not an integral gas-vent (the weapons with an integral gas-vent are, for example, the ingram smartgun x, the fn har, and the white knight)
so you can put a gas-vent 3 on an Ares Alpha and get 5 points of RC (or put a sound suppressor and stay with your basic 2 RC) |
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