New RPG Store concept, Since some think FLGS is a dinosaur Options

[Tanka]

Meh, I find Craigslist to be a cesspool. Nine times out of ten, it's really just some dumbass putting a post out because he thinks its funny to play tricks on us "dorky kids".

Or maybe I'm just jaded. ;)

[eidolon]

[BookWyrm]

But also go to Compleat Strategist as well, Eidolon.

[knasser]

[tisoz]

Perhaps odd or peculiar would have been more precise than funny, though they are both proper inflections of funny. The point is, Hooters doesn't seem to have a problem drawing customers. The contests exploiting young women always draw a crowd in this town. And college towns always seem to have young women willing to be exploited.

I see your point that it is probably a vastly different demographic, but the majority of the gamer demographic seems to be 16-30 year old white males. I am not saying there are not other types of gamers, but they should admit they are a minority. I knew I was when I hit 35. The thing with the younger gamers is they may not be settled enough to have a place of their own, or a place to game, or a wife to buy, prepare and serve snacks. I believe the target demographic is still driven by sex, or maybe gamers are so warped in their geekiness that I'm wrong. Game Art and general advertising says I'm not.

[nezumi]

I think perhaps putting it more at the level of Outback, where there are attractive ladies, but they aren't quite "exploited" as much as serve to enhance the view, would be a little less controversial. Keep the neat garb, but don't make it bikinis.

[mfb]

yeah. i mean, 16-30 year old white males are the biggest chunk of the gamer pie, but there are other significantly-sized chunks. the pie is small enough that you want to try for the whole thing, instead of just one slice. now, you could have chainmail bikini events or something, but making 'em the bulk of your hired help... eh.

[DireRadiant]

Why no beefcake?

[Butterblume]

Thinking back, we never had less than 2 females when playing shadowrun. In our biggest RPG group, playing one of the older versions of the Dark Eye, whe had 5.
But then, gaming is part of german culture. Richard Garfield (the Magic card game guy) envied us for that 8).

[Sir_Psycho]

So the store needs man candy?

[fistandantilus4....]

Most people I know that game in stores go there so taht they can all get together some where without having to worry about any thing else, including what some folks might think of them. These same folks (not trying to over generalize here, just the people I know) probably wouldn't know what to do if they were around a girl in a bikini, even if she wore a sigh that said "Pay me,I want to be your freind." So I don't think that would fly well.

Conversly, the girls in my game are either 1)married, or 2) play games socially to relax, not to pick up guys. So if they were going for man candy, they wouldn't do it with their husbands (the two married girls,since their husbands play), or would do it with an all girl group where they wouldn't have to worry about guys around (the other girl). Keep it simple, don't over complicate.

[tisoz]

Okay, how about compiling a list of features for the perfect game shop?

Game Books
Game Aids:
-Dice
-Miniatures
-Maps/Whiteboards/Hex Mats
-3D Scale Buildings?
Copier
Online Computer or online Access with printer
Ceiling mounted Projector
Comfortable chairs with appropriate height tables
Custom Designed Game Tables? (If you have to invest in stuff, may as well go for the niche stuff you wouldn't buy for home.)
Soft Drinks
Snacks:
-Candy Bars
-Fruit
-Microwave Popcorn (Or invest in a popcorn machine?)
-Chips
-Hostess (Twinkies, fruit pies, Ding Dongs, etc.)
-Nachos or breadsticks & cheese (Require a cheese pump)
Adjustable lighting
Handicap Friendly

Music? Jukebox? Boombox/table that plays tapes/CDs? Silence?
Promotions?
-Tournaments. (What would be a good SR tournament?)
-Uniforms based on RPG styles? (Shadowrun, D&D, Vampire...)
Cover charge/Entrance Fee? Could charge $X admittance and give them $X or $Y in store credit toward any purchase (or select purchase of high profit items.)

[RunnerPaul]

[Hound]

Wow so that projector thing is awesome, I want one.

Overall sounds like a sweet place, from a gamer/custromer's point of view. I think the kitchen is a little much, prepackaged food is the way to go here, in my opinion. But then, I'm really cheap. Also, I think the pretty girls are a bad idea. Pretty girls are usually a great idea, but in this case I think they would make some male gamers nervous, especially the younger ones. I dunno how old y'all are, but I'm 18. Quite a few of my friends, whenever a girl shows up, immediately become too cool to play games/roll dice. If the girl's a part of your gaming group, that's one thing. But an unfamiliar and good-looking face is more likely to make people nervous. Not all gamers are as proud of their niche as some, and you need their money just as much as the rest.

Oh and I think I would skip the miniatures as well. Having a reasonable amount of them would require a whole lot of money/time to put them together/paint them. And most people who like miniature games enough to come and play them would already have a sizeable set.

On a side note: If you don't mind my asking, where would this place be? Assuming you get it going, and if it's anywhere in Cali, I would very much like to stop by.

[Penta]

More to emphasize Hound's point:

Lots of gamers are in HS. Girls still scare them to an extent.

That said...I beg, I plead. Nobody can make you do it, but if it's at all possible, try to make this place disabled-accessible. (I realize you'd be using an old mansion.) It's not just ramps, but wider doorways, floors usable with a blind cane, clearly marked doorways (Ugh, so many experiences here...), and something that would be of assistance to so many, disabled or not...

Good lighting. Lighting is obvious, but most places don't put much thought into it; it would seem to me worth your while to really think about lighting for this place.

[Tanka]

I'd go with dimmers for lighting. All the way up is standard halogen-brightness overheads, downgrading from there on a sliding scale (obviously).

Seriously. Sometimes, having full lighting can be nice. Sometimes you just want more "chill" lighting, so you can dim it down.

Obviously that suggestion is for the private rooms. The main room would be standard overheads, though brightness could depend on your mood or what-have-you.

[tisoz]

[tisoz]

Like I figured; moved and died.

[fistandantilus4....]

Nah, I think people just lost interest after all the discussion about whether or not to make girls one of the features.

The stores that isee doing well in my area are all "Game" stores, not RPG stores. They all sell the mix of various games, such as "taboo" and all that, as well as a good selection of comics. That may just be because I live in Utah, but that's been my experience to date. The one guy that I've found that has his place mostly comics and RPG's isn't doing to great.

The only other suggestions I would have (besides going with vending machines) is to make sure the place looks nice, and has room to places to play, and perhaps a schedule for what's going on. As in, organize it yourself to recruit pepole to come in and play. THat's the other thing those stores that are successful around here do.

[tisoz]

So why isn't the thread bitching about killing the FLGS moved? Because it mentioned FanPro direct every now and then? I recall mentioning SR gaming in this thread (or meant to.)

[zephir]

I like your concept.

I also think the girls are a distraction, because they provide strong motive for young men to prove they're the greatest thing since electrical dishwashers.

Also, what do you want your clientele to be? Students (19-25+) or kids who come there after school? The former will be repulsed by the latter, won't it? Do you plan to offer them spatially separated gaming space?

We had a FLGS in town once that offered a large room in the cellar. There were 5 mediocre PCs for LAN games down there and you could rent time on those. Also, a large desk for tabletop wargaming and roleplaying (no fee) They sold cans of soft drinks and Mars, Bounty etc at ~80% markup.
It died because it was badly lit and ventilated and was never cleaned all the way.

Our comic shop offers a large and well lit room with Biergarten tables and seating, but only school kids go there to play TCGs. I don't know if they offer food, but I guess not as they want to keep their place (and comics) clean.

I repeat, you ought to consider good ventilation, as a lot of people sitting in a room have other requirements than a dorm room can provide.

[tisoz]

Ok, added good ventilation.

There used to be a video game place, back when video game arcades were all over the place, that was across the street from campus in about the type area I think would be successful. I remember going there as a high school teenager and the patrons ranged from middle school kids to college students. I don't know if the younger kids turned off the university aged or not. Hopefully, with seperate rooms or booths, those wishing to remain exclusive can do so. I do not think the Game Store should require "open tables".


Game Books
Game Aids:
-Dice
-Miniatures
-Maps/Whiteboards/Hex Mats
-3D Scale Buildings?
Copier
Online Computer or online Access with printer
Ceiling mounted Projector
Comfortable chairs with appropriate height tables
Custom Designed Game Tables? (If you have to invest in stuff, may as well go for the niche stuff you wouldn't buy for home.)
Soft Drinks
Snacks:
-Candy Bars
-Fruit
-Microwave Popcorn (Or invest in a popcorn machine?)
-Chips
-Hostess (Twinkies, fruit pies, Ding Dongs, etc.)
-Nachos or breadsticks & cheese (Require a cheese pump)
Adjustable lighting
Handicap Friendly
Good Ventilation
Clean, friendly environment

Music? Jukebox? Boombox/table that plays tapes/CDs? Silence?
Promotions?
-Tournaments. (What would be a good SR tournament?)
-Uniforms based on RPG styles? (Shadowrun, D&D, Vampire...)
Cover charge/Entrance Fee? Could charge $X admittance and give them $X or $Y in store credit toward any purchase (or select purchase of high profit items.)

[tisoz]

Today I found what looks to be a terrific game store. It reminds me of the story of the guy from South Africa that went halfway around the world prospecting for diamonds. Why? Because the game store is in my home town.

It opened 3 years ago and I never heard of it until yesterday. I decided to become a commando and was checking where the nearby stores were letting other commandos run Classic Battle Tech. One of them listed this game store, which I actually thought at first was a nearby Comic Shop.

But I stopped by, luckily within minutes of their opening at noon, and entered gamer heaven. No comic books or puzzles, chess sets and board games. Just roleplaying stuff. A board posting the games run on a daily basis. A snack bar. A large room with several tables and chairs. 4 more private game rooms.

There was even an ongoing SR game.

[Penta]

Where is this holy place?

[tisoz]

AVALON
223 Pete Ellis Drive
Bloomington, IN 47408
(812)331-3008

www.avalonkingdom.com (but I was told the website is temporarily down)