alternate technomancers Options

[Spike]

You couldn't have a backup copy until you'd broken the copy protection!

[Glayvin34]

Thinking about BTLs and whatnot, I didn't take into account the use-once and self-erasing technology in the Sixth World. I guess you're right.

[Garrowolf]

wow this thread took off from last night.

well at this point in my game the technomancer is a NPC. I just use him as a super hacker.

What I was thinking was that if we changed the technomancer to be AR illusionists instead of traditional hackers they could develop their own niche. Right now they have a bad character development system and they are walking all over another character type.

Basically a hacker can fast hack a comlink. what I was thinking was allow the technomancer to force something through the resonance into a commlink without actually hacking it. Basically in AR they can do things that make little sense from a hacking point of view (they make little sense anyway so why not focus it). They could have a whole list of complex forms that do things that hackers can't do becauseit does an end run around the system and just plants things into a computer. Make them e-warfare gods but then get rid of their regular hacking. Basically they see the wifi world differently then the rest of us. They can access it but why aren't solid in the actual matrix itself.

I'm talking about starting over with these guys. No just a patch or a house rule. Why not just remove them entirely as written and take the name and the wifi brain thing and start over.

[mfb]

[Spike]

Why is that dumb? I don't get how 'dumb' follows from 'AR doesn't use sim.'


Everyone uses AR. It's just mostly images on screens that you can interact with. Holograms only you can see even. YOu walk around in it, do stuff in it, with your real body.

Sim shuts the body down and just uses the mind itself. Not everyone is going to want to do that just to hang out, chat with buddies or do their daily job.

Now, if you are saying it's dumb to hack in AR... well, the rules make it pretty dumb, sort of like the old 'turtle deck' hackers. You are SLOW... slow beyond belief compared to the sim dudes. In return the nasty brain burning can't happen, its just an electronic ghost making scary faces too you.

Makes perfect sense to me.

[mfb]

because 'sim' is short for 'simsense', which is ASIST data. if your commlink plugs into your brain, you are using simsense whether you're hacking in VR or making phone calls in AR. same for technomancers. the only question is whether you're using hot sim or cold sim. 'no sim' is not on the menu for TMs and users of cybercommlinks. if AR didn't use sim, you would not be able to use AR with DNI--which is what you're doing when you use AR on a cybercommlink, or if you're a technomancer. (actually, even if you're using non-DNI interface devices, it's still simsense--it's just being fed to your contacts/gloves/earbuds, rather than your brain.)

that's why i compared it to drinking coke, earlier. whether you're drinking it through a straw or straight from the cup, the coke is coming from the same place and it's going to the same place--and it's still coke, no matter what. same with simsense. it doesn't matter if you're using AR or VR--it's still simsense, and simsense is what black IC exploits to fry your brain. the only way you should logically be immune to black IC is if the simsense never reaches your brain at all. in other words, if you're using contacts and gloves and earbuds to do your AR (or VR, for that matter), black IC can't touch you. but if you plug your brain into your computer (or if your brain is a computer), you should be vulnerable to black IC and other sources of Matrix damage because, AR or VR, you are sucking simsense into your skull.

and as for being 'slow beyond belief', well, sure--unless you've got jacked-up physical reflexes. then you're just as fast as the DNI hackers, and you're immune to Matrix damage. which is why this is something of an issue.

[Ranneko]

[nathanross]

Going back to Technomancers. I like most of what they can do, and I feel that the terrible starting character is necissary to balance their INSANE abilities once they get karma pumping.

Hackers start the game with all programs at 6 (effective 5) and only have to upgrade their commlink and computer/hacking skill groups 2 more. 40 karma in total. Sure they have to spend over half of that oh so precious 250k on programs, but so what, they never have to upgrade again. And, once they brake their copy protection, no one else in the team has to ever buy the programs. This makes ace hackers also wonderfull sammies and probably the most viable character to play in SR4.

Technomancers are stuck with their lot in life and will never be able to do anything else, except maybe face or rig. The other fundamental issue is that almost all of their advantages come in full VR, when really, they should be much more focused on AR. Definately, they should recieve 1 (if not more) Initiative pases for working in AR (or just treat AR as VR for a TM) since they bend the matrix with force of will much as a mage bends mana. I think rules need to be established that reinforce this. Right now TMs are not much more than Otaku. Only know they access it wireless. Where are all the cool AR Technomancer powers. Thats what I want to see.

[Wasabi]

A few responses... I just saw the thread, my apologies if some are from the initial few posts:

1. When a Technomancer using threading or the Assist ability of a sprite his CF value is raised. This makes Threading Stealth viable.

2. Why not Thread AND use a Sprite's Assist action?

3. Running multiple CF's is a huge benefit, but you have to have a GM thats not a hack and slasher to see how sexy it is.

Example:
Joe has the following 6 programs loaded using his starting 6/5/5/6 commlink and a successful roll of a Reality Filter:

Reality Filter (+1 Response, raises limit of programs to 6 since System is already a 6)
Analyze [so you can have half a chance at Matrix Perception]
Exploit [so you can get in, change to Scan, Edit or Browse as needed]
Encrypt [So baddies can't listen in on your commlink to your team without decrypting]
Spoof [So you can keep trying to notice the Trace program]
Stealth [So you dont get seen]

Now out of those 6 programs, you have all useful programs and only the Exploit slot to change around without hindering yourself. Thats not versatile. Meanwhile the TM can Scan for nodes while browsing for data, directing Agents doing searches, etc, and his defenses like Armor are always active in case he is surprised. Thats an advantage to be sure!

4. Two cool TM powers are Cookie, Diagnostics, Electron Storm, and Gremlin... all available only through Sprites. Yeah, yeah, its a cool *Sprite* power but thats what defines a TM's uniqueness. Sprites are wicked powerful, usually treated as intelligent, and with the ability to take any wireless or skinlinked device like a smartgun and add bonus dice they really make a difference. Oh... and you're right about the limited roles of a TM but in those roles they can do a phenomenol job!

5. Sprites getting Bound, errr... 'Registered' cost NOTHING except time. Not like Spirits where it costs Nuyen.

6. The Resonance link is an unhackable, unspoofable way to communicate and has no range penalty. You park a sprite at an NPC and speak through the sprite... have a nice day. And it allows you to communicate with sprites very well too. the only hitch is a enemy TM impersonating you, but hey, it pwnz hackers.

7. Machine Sprites can carry CF's of autosofts as an optional power. Have a Machine Sprite aid another Machine Sprite using the Diagnostics power and you have a Steel Lynx with TEETH... [6 Rating sprite, 6 autosoft rating, 2 dice for smartlink, sensor link bonus dice <varies>, and then another 4 dice on average from the Diagnostics power. thats maybe 20 dice to shoot without aiming and without the cap on Pilot ratings and without the cap on Autosofts. Ba-DOW.

Lastly, TM's can do some funny things Hackers can't. I had one who would hack by having the Team's mage Shapechange him into a Pigeon. He'd take 100% cover near the heart of a compound [to avoid astral detection hopefully] and hack while a pigeon. A few teensy flying drones for data storage and relaying to the group via the Drones higher Signal rating and VOILA! A real PITA for enemy hackers.

My 2 Nuyen worth...

[Jack Kain]

The following as no limit
Program rating
Firewall
System
response

You can build or program all of these things above 6. And a technomancer can develop them beyond six.

Frankly I think its a good idea for a hacker to run a bunch of programs at rating 5 and take the 1 hit to your response. Sure its 5 and not 6. (assuming you haven't built a rating 7 response chip)