 Quick question on gun type, World's shortest thread. |
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 May 23 2007, 09:26 PM
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#1
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Shadow Cartographer  Group: Members Posts: 3,737 Joined: 2-June 06 From: Secret Tunnels under the UK (South West) Member No.: 8,636  |
Just a quick question as I know very little about guns. I watched Smoking Aces on the weekend. Very dull bar two good characters, but there's a woman in the film who has some sort of great big rifle she uses to snipe across at another hotel. I just wondered if this weapon is what an assault cannon is supposed to be. If so, it will make a very good reference for me to give to my players (who also tend not to be very familiar with firearms).
Thanks in advance, -K. Edit: Said 'rifle.' Meant 'cannon.' |
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May 23 2007, 09:36 PM
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#2
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 433 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Somewhere in Iraq Member No.: 1,789 |
I think it's more similar to the Barret Model 121 that was in the Cannon Companion than a PAC.
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 May 23 2007, 09:43 PM
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#3
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jacked in Group: Admin Posts: 9,025 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 463 |
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May 23 2007, 09:44 PM
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#4
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 745 Joined: 13-April 07 From: Houston, Texas Member No.: 11,448 |
Yup thats a .50cal rifle.
The shadowrun equivalent would be the Barret 121 that was in the cannon companion(SR3). There is no equivalent in SR4...yet |
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May 23 2007, 09:44 PM
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#5
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 380 Joined: 19-May 07 Member No.: 11,698 |
Shadowrun Sniping:
How to make friends and influance people, from over a mile away! |
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May 23 2007, 09:57 PM
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#6
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,159 Joined: 12-April 07 From: Ork Underground Member No.: 11,440 |
Yep that is what as Barrett, I saw one on Future Weapons, that the former SEAL sniper host of the show, used to shoot at a target 2,500 yards away.
It is the .416 Barrett, "This new sniper’s round produced by the renowned maker of .50-caliber weapons fires faster and with more accuracy and power than any other type of rifle ammunition. Accurate to 2,500 yards - that’s a mile and a half away! - the .416 can hit home on the first "cold bore shot," giving no warning to the target. Barrett's new M99 rifle, seen here, has recently been configured to handle the new ammunition" Very nice weapon and nice show also WearzManySkins |
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May 23 2007, 09:57 PM
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#7
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,206 Joined: 9-July 06 From: Fresno, CA Member No.: 8,856 |
No gun thread will ever qualify for this... |
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May 23 2007, 10:02 PM
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#8
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
interesting show, but that host is just to annoying... |
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May 23 2007, 10:02 PM
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#9
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Shadow Cartographer Group: Members Posts: 3,737 Joined: 2-June 06 From: Secret Tunnels under the UK (South West) Member No.: 8,636 |
Wow! I've just looked up the Barrett 121 in Cannon Companion and it's not actually a heavy weapon. And the Panther Assault Cannon actually has a power rating of 18 compared to the Barretts 14. (In SR3 terms). So what I'm being told here is that the panther assault cannon is considerably bigger and more powerful than that! Frightening. Was that movie exaggeration or is it really that powerful? Thanks for all the replies. -K. |
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May 23 2007, 10:26 PM
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#10
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,159 Joined: 12-April 07 From: Ork Underground Member No.: 11,440 |
Basically they are two different weapons, the Barrett is a long range anti personnel weapon aka sniper rifle, the Panther Assault Cannon is a 20mm anti tank rifle.
Barrett is long range sniping, shoots at weak points in a targets armor. Panther brute force rifle, for defeating heavily armored targets by blowing thru the armor. Basically two different weapons designs. I see nothing wrong with the DV of either. As for the host of the show....I have no issues with his style, as a SEAL he has "earned" it the hard way many times over. I served with several USN SEALS, when they were not in the SEAL function, actually he is fairly typical of the ones I served with. Doing what they do, lets say they tend to have a blunt type of flair, or attitude. After abit of working with them, you do not notice the flair any more. WearzManySkins |
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May 23 2007, 10:31 PM
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#11
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Shadow Cartographer Group: Members Posts: 3,737 Joined: 2-June 06 From: Secret Tunnels under the UK (South West) Member No.: 8,636 |
Thanks, WMS. A very useful summary for someone with my level of knowledge. Many thanks, -K. |
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May 23 2007, 10:33 PM
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#12
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 168 Joined: 23-April 07 From: Aurora, CO Member No.: 11,514 |
I have not seen the movie but .50 cal sniper rifles are used as anti material weapons first and foremost but have since gained popularity for anti person operations as well. NightmareX translated some of the weapons from cannon companion over and basically gave the Barret 121 the stats of 10p with -3 ap which is better than the other snipers but not as good as a panther (unless you get apds rounds for it :D) As for a more real life mobile panther equivalent try this one.... the XM 109 http://www.military.com/soldiertech/0,1463..._XM109,,00.html picture: http://media.popularmechanics.com/images/l...lg_xm109-lg.jpg 25mm sniper rifle goodness also here is a comparative picture for various weapon sizes... mind you the 25 for the sniper rifle does not look to be that long http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/sys...ges/natammo.jpg |
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May 23 2007, 10:58 PM
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#13
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 834 Joined: 30-June 03 Member No.: 4,832 |
Just pointing out that 12.7mm = .50 cal, to help put that 25mm in perspective. |
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May 24 2007, 12:00 AM
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#14
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 941 Joined: 25-January 07 Member No.: 10,765 |
I'm not entirely up on all the fluff for the Panther, but as I recall it is essentially a smooth bore (possibly) explosive launcher, rather than a proper 'gun'.
You can't, for example, get APDS rounds for it... or couldn't... because it doesn't fire a bullet so much as an explosive charge, possibly shaped. It's man portable artillery, not to dissimilar from the 60mm mortar fired from the hip (possible and slightly frighting concept, I know), only smaller and without the ability to soft lob shells in a high arc. It is, essentially, a Cannon in every real sense of the word. If the artwork is any measure, it's rounds will look like larger versions of the 40mm grenade rather than the 12.7mm or 25mm. Of course now I need to dig out my old first edition Street Sam catalog and reread the old entry.... |
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May 24 2007, 12:19 AM
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#15
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 745 Joined: 13-April 07 From: Houston, Texas Member No.: 11,448 |
If you ever play Battlefield 2142, there is an unlock in the game for the engineer class called the Pilum AVR(Anti-Vehicle Rifle). It reminds me very much of what the PAC should be.
*edit* link http://bf2142fever.com/content/Koenig_H-AVR |
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May 24 2007, 12:23 AM
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#16
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
QFT |
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May 24 2007, 12:54 AM
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#17
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
i think its mostly a case of "why on earth is he whispering to the camera all the time?!". you can clearly hear him use a more normal voice when talking to people. im starting to think he is being directed to do it that way. i recall reading that the mythbusters where asked to argue more on camera. im guessing they (the producers) are trying to get a kind of reality show feel over it, kinda like what you have with orange county choppers and similar. there was also that show "beyond though" that gave me the same kind of irk. sure they are though for doing the job they do, but one would expect them to brush it of as no big deal or something... but then i also got a bad feel when yet another show, that was to talk about the ak-47 and the m-16, had a guy in it that appeared to embrace the m-16 he held as if it was his girlfriend. and this was a guy in a suit, not someone in a foxhole. |
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May 24 2007, 03:12 AM
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#18
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 403 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Kill Em All Member No.: 2,018 |
60mm from the hip? GET ME ONE PLEASE! It'd make carrying the cannon so much more worthwhile? |
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May 24 2007, 04:13 AM
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#19
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 524 Joined: 12-April 06 Member No.: 8,455 |
There's a video clip somewhere of a low-impulse 3" shoulder cannon.
Doesn't look very practical, though... how many rounds can you hump? |
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May 24 2007, 05:53 AM
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#20
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
not possible, not with the range an AC gets. an AC is as accurate at 2.4 klicks as a sniper rifle is at 1 klick. no way you get that kind of accuracy without rifling. also, AC rounds, while described as being explosive, don't actually have an area of effect. ACs are weird. the job they appear to excel at--taking out vehicles and other heavily-armored enemies--is hampered by their rate of fire, and would be better handled with a rocket or missile. the job they could perform--anti-materiel sniping--is hampered by the lack of specialized armor-piercing ammo. AC ammo is described as explosive, which clashes somewhat with the high penetration of the weapon, and also clashes with the fact that it doesn't have a radius of effect. i suppose you could just assume that AC ammo is always some kind of shaped-charge explosive doohickey, like you said. but... only -5 armor? meh. |
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May 24 2007, 06:08 AM
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#21
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,159 Joined: 12-April 07 From: Ork Underground Member No.: 11,440 |
Well you can use the US Army's "Polish Nuclear Hand Grenade"......AKA the Davy Crockett, a bazooka that fired a nuclear tip rocket.
One minor issue, range of rocket kept the firer in the Primary Blast Radius...!!!!!!! Talk about a one way mission........ |
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May 24 2007, 06:54 AM
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#22
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,598 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Hong Kong Member No.: 4,253 |
Sigh, Myth. |
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May 24 2007, 07:04 AM
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#23
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,159 Joined: 12-April 07 From: Ork Underground Member No.: 11,440 |
Not myth Link here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Davy_Crockett...nuclear_device) check out the Utube link there. Just because "they say" the radiation would not harm, same folks that told those at Bikini Atoll. "Do not worry son Uncle Sam would not do anything to hurt you." How close were they. well the crews of the ships were up on deck, with their arms crossed over their faces. Blast flash allowed the standing crewman to clearly see the forearm bones in their arms over their eyes. But after that they let the crews go into the hulks that were blasted in the primary blast radius, the scientists along with them had radiation suits, the crew did not. Same folks that thought the Atomic Cannon was a good idea. :( |
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May 24 2007, 07:29 AM
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#24
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,598 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Hong Kong Member No.: 4,253 |
and from the wikipedia you link to:
That's a far cry from:
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May 24 2007, 09:46 AM
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#25
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,159 Joined: 12-April 07 From: Ork Underground Member No.: 11,440 |
you did not go to the Utube video.
Wiki's are input by volunteers, information quality.....???? |
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