Bailing Out, How To Survive a Plane Crash Options

[Serial_Peacemake...]

Are there any rules for ditching from a flying vehicle? Especially ones that are fairly close to the earth. I know that land based crash tests can be survived, and that in reality people have bailed out from aircraft in real life. However surviving a crash test that starts at a mile up kind of strains belief. Excuse me if I simply missed this one while reading through the section on crash tests and such.

[odinson]

There is falling damage on page 154. But that's not really survivable without burning an edge. I'd also start the damage from when the plane started to fall so a guy couldn't jump out at 10m and only take 5 boxes of damage. Otherwise the crash rules are on page 160-161.

Seems there is no maximum damage from a fall. I guess it would probably make sense to house rule something in. Trolls and orks would also probably take more damage from a fall and elves would take less as they are lighter and smaller.

[Solomon Greene]

I'm sure there will be other posts that explain this better, but fallen bodies reach a terminal velocity in free fall that pretty much caps damage - you can only fall so fast. Weight isn't really an issue at that point.

[Talia Invierno]

[odinson]

[redne]

So, with acceleration of 9.8m/s^2 you would reach your terminal velocity of 55m/s in 5.6 seconds. If falling damage depends on your impact velocity, you can't really get more damage from falling than you would get after a fall of 5.6 seconds.

The bad news is that this would be a fall of about 182 meters, which does 93 boxes of damage. :dead:

This is with RL numbers, the ones in SR4 p.154-155 would give even more impressive results. Please correct me if I am wrong, haven't done this kind of math in a while.

[Rotbart van Dain...]

[hyzmarca]

The good news is that a high-grade (significantly higher than is probable in a normal game) adept initiate with a lot of Freefall can survive it without a scratch.

[redne]

[hyzmarca]

You see, this is why Force diagrams are so useful.

If you have a horizontal velocity when you hit the ground, you will retain that horizontal velocity and essentially skid along the surface (assuming that you don't bounce). The rate at which you slow depends on the coefficient of kinetic friction of the surface and your body. On a surface with a high coefficient of kinetic friction, this can be very painful and would tear your skin up, but it would not add directly to the fall damage. This is why motorcycle riders wear thick leather, by the way.

Of course, this assumes a flat surface. On a slopped surface, it is necessary to measure the angles and use trigonometry to determine actual impact velocities.

[redne]

Damn, I didn't think of that. In my world things just stop when they hit the ground :grinbig: .

[Talia Invierno]

Of course, as odinson originally points out, all the PC really has to do -- OOC -- is to burn the Edge point , make that roll, and then the GM finds a nice soft glass ceiling or mass of pine trees to break their fall, or even the same airplane again.

Ironically, greater surface area is specifically associated with taking less damage in smaller falls independent of mass: something often made use of in aikido.

(Forward/vertical velocity notwithstanding, it's the air resistance that creates terminal velocity -- so you wouldn't necessarily Pythagoras "add" forces once you reach terminal velocity -- and over the distances involved the air resistance may well even turn diagonal movement into almost fully vertical movement. After all, skydivers can aim -- and that very precisely.

Edit:

All this discussion assumes both that the airplane started uncontrollably falling from a high altitude, and that the person had no way of slowing an individual fall. I can see a few factors which might modify both.

Airplanes rarely just fall out of the sky. More commonly the pilot is attempting a crash landing, trying to manage speed to at least partly glide and come in at something close to a landing angle. In those cases, it's a (relatively) moderate contact with the ground that ends up breaking up the aircraft -- but human beings are far more likely to survive the lower forces involved. In fact, large airplanes have able to glide into safe landings from quite high heights.

Is the person falling onto a downward slope? Consider the ski jumper.

Is there anything the person can use to slow their fall, parachute-style? It won't be as good as a parachute, but may slow terminal velocity slightly.

Second edit:

One of the involuntary glides of history was British Airways Flight 9, where all four engines (and consequently cabin power) had been stopped by volcanic ash, in a manner spectacularly visible to the passengers as well as the flight crew. After the initial attempt to restart the engines had failed, the captain relayed the following message to the passengers:

[Moon-Hawk]

[hyzmarca]

We can assume that one of the passengers critically gliched with his monowhip and cut both of the plane's wings off, thus making a controlled glide impossible.

[Serial_Peacemake...]

Well obviously a plane crashing is going to be pretty fatal. I should have been clearer, if you are in a plane that is crashing, are there rules for getting out of the plane, and using a parachute, or perhaps levitate?

[Demerzel]

There is a parachuting skill but no mechanics... At this point I'd call it a success test... Set a threshold based on the situation. Like 1 for a simple jump out of a plane that is fitted for recreational jumping. 2 for a risky jump from a fast moving plane or attempting anything tricky. Go from there...

[Talia Invierno]

No game mechanics, but a bit of trivia which could have in-game uses:

UK parachute training used to involve going through a bomb bay equivalent: ie through the bottom of the airplane. (This may have changed, I don't know.) United States training always involved side openings for jumping, as do most recreation jump aircraft.

Most standard airplanes come with passenger-accessible side doors, but cargo has bottom-entry.

Most aircraft exterior doors are designed not to open in-flight.

Levitation at the last moment would not work unless you are clear of the aircraft, any more than jumping at the last moment works within a freefall elevator.

[Fortune]

When it comes to parachuting, almost any rules you make up will be better than those for SR3.

[sunnyside]

Just for the OP. Note that runners in an airplane that is going down aren't neccesarily screwed.

Any mage worth their salt can levetate. And can probably whistle up some bound spirits to grab the other team members, or levetate them as well. Also a rigger will like as not have brought along a dalmation which could concevebly get them down. Etc etc.

In short I'd worry as much about having to come up with rules for when a runner monowhips off a chunk of wing and tries to use it as a glider as working out the exact falling damage.

(or trying to use assault cannon fire like a rocket engine, whatever)

[Demerzel]

[Fix-it]

extremely low altitude parachutes would most likely be standard equipment on aircraft in 2060.

hell. they probably have them in most high-rise buildings.

[PBTHHHHT]

And for small planes you can have it's own parachute system.

[KarmaInferno]

[Kyoto Kid]

[Talia Invierno]

I waited for this thread to wind down before I posted this. From Laughs in the Shadows: