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> Game stores getting squeezed, By the pdfs and amazon?
nezumi
post Aug 20 2007, 08:46 PM
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I can only assume that the license has not been released to distribute them like that. I agree that if I could buy the pdf on CD with a nice case and all that, that would actually be preferable to me. Even moreso if you can get multiple books in a library together, comes with other stuff, etc.
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Kyoto Kid
post Aug 20 2007, 10:18 PM
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...the thing is if Catalyst already owns the property and authourises web sales of the PDF I don't see where the issue is. I for one am unable to order online since it requires plastic money of some sort. Meanwhile there is a gaming store only a few blocks away and I have cold hard cash in my pocket I am willing to part with for the PDF of this supplement.

There are still a lot of gamers (several in my own group) who still prefer having the dead tree version in their hands so I do not see a conflict between sales of the two different formats either. A CD/DVD is cheap to produce compared to a printed book, so one would think it would be an attractive item from a profit standpoint. If they (Catalyst) are already selling the PDF on line then, they already have secured whatever distribution license/agreement they need from Adobe.
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nezumi
post Aug 21 2007, 02:27 PM
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Because when you buy a pdf, you put your personal information with it. If my pdf turns up on kazaa, someone (in theory) would knock on my door and ask for Mr. Nezumi Hebereke and why he's sharing copyrighted property.

Selling unmarked pdfs on CD doesn't have that problem.
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Adam
post Aug 21 2007, 03:25 PM
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Without going into details -- so far, it has been very difficult for game companies to get decent penetration and profits in stores with CD-ROM material, especially books on PDF. Only a few companies have done it, and I've been privvy to a few sales figures and expense reports, and at this time I don't believe it's worth it.

nezumi: Not all vendors are watermarking PDFs; BattleCorps.com doesn't.
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nezumi
post Aug 21 2007, 04:21 PM
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Gah! So when I wanted to send pdfs to Ziggurat Con I could have gone to battle corps? Too bad it's blocked at work, but thanks for the head's up. I'll definitely check them out.

I have to wonder though, why would it be tough? Do people see the CD and say 'well, I could get that cheaper online, and without spending the gas money'? Assumedly, anyone who wants the pdf version already knows they can get it online and anyone who wants the books knows where to get those (online). I don't understand why limiting options in the stores (by not offering CDs) would decrease sales.
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Adam
post Aug 21 2007, 07:12 PM
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It's tough because:

* some game stores think that once people start buying electronic books, they're just going to buy them online from then on.

* most game stores don't have a lot of area devoted to CD/DVD products, and due to small size and stealability they can't be shelved next to the related print books. Things that aren't shelved well aren't purchased.

* printing good quality packaging in small quantities is not inexpensive.

I don't believe I said that offering PDFs on CD-ROM would *decrease* sales, but from my research I don't think it would be profitable.
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Kyoto Kid
post Aug 21 2007, 07:23 PM
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QUOTE (nezumi)
Because when you buy a pdf, you put your personal information with it.  If my pdf turns up on kazaa, someone (in theory) would knock on my door and ask for Mr. Nezumi Hebereke and why he's sharing copyrighted property.

Selling unmarked pdfs on CD doesn't have that problem.

...well if the publisher is so paranoid (like a certain software company I know & love to hate) all they need to do is have an activation code that requires you to "register" the PDF before being able to install it. That way there is a tag associated with it.

However, I don't see this as any more an issue than my going down to Powell's Books and selling off all my D&D 3.5 stuff or simply giving it away to someone. The company got their money from me, they will not get any more from Powell's, or from the person I give the books to.

The day that publishers ban the resale or exchange of books (especially textbooks which are way overpriced) will be a dark day indeed.

I do agree with your next response, providing a CD alongside the hardcopy version in game stores would really be no skin off the game publisher's nose. I have no issue with paying a bit more than the online price, simply because now I could buy it without resorting to jumping through a bunch of hoops or having someone "loan" the disk to me and *shudder* copying it.

...hmmm, what's that SUV with the blacked out windows doing parked across the street? Uh oh I think they're are on to me...
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bofh
post Aug 23 2007, 02:00 PM
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QUOTE (eidolon)
Yeah. Attitude is the major killer for me. The local place would be great if they had some more vocal and outgoing, customer-focused people running it. I can't complain too much, as the owner died not too long ago and the staff that's on now is running it for his widow. It's a bad situation, and I give them major credit for managing to keep the place open.

None of that makes up for the fact that when you go in there, even if you aren't one to feel "gamer shame", you feel the thick blanket of social maladjustment, and have to hope that the <insert sterotypical gamer here> that keeps looking at you is the person working there, because you're already irritated that you have to hunt for an employee, and you don't want to have to ask fifteen "wrong guys" about a product.

I have been in gaming stores ranging from totally bad ass down to "I wish I could afford to work here and fix the place", and right now, the place closest to me is closer to being the latter.

I go in occasionally, only to remember why I don't go there and walk out frustrated that not only did they not have anything I was looking for, nobody seemed all that interested in finding out what I needed and helping me get it.

I'm a customer. I vote with my wallet. And if I'm not voting for you, know that I'm voting for someone else. It sucks, because I would love to rejoin the ranks of the "I shop FLGS" crowd, but frankly, my bottom line is more important to me than theirs unless I'm getting something out of the deal that makes paying an extra few bucks worth it. Good service from friendly, knowledgeable people is what I'm paying for with that few bucks, and I wish shop owners would wake up and realize that.

Wow this place sounds familiar. I experienced the exact same thing. I'm in a game farther south from that store but don't like going in for the same reasons so I stop at the FLGS closest to the game. I picked up Emergence and CoC6 last night on the way to the game. The guy who was at the shop was friendly and helpful (even though he didn't know Emergence was in the New Release rack :) ) and we chatted for a good 45 minutes about various game things interrupted only by other customers.

There's one farther east that I'd like to go to but they're pretty far out of my way.

Carl
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